COL Gene

ELECTION IN AFGHANISTAN SHOWS FATAL FLAW IN BUSH POLICY

ELECTION IN AFGHANISTAN SHOWS FATAL FLAW IN BUSH POLICY



The highly publicized election in Afghanistan yesterday has documented the fatal flaw in the foreign policy George W. Bush is pursuing which is, the Spreading Democracy Theory. This is the holy Grail of foreign-policy which is supposed to make America safer and for which we are willing to sacrifice our young men and women.

The problem with this idea is that in many areas of Afghanistan, the voters DID NOT KNOW any candidates running for office. At the polling places, voters talked among themselves as to who each was going to vote for since no one knew any of the candidates. They did not know what they stood for and might as well have closed their eyes and voted. The reason for this is the candidates were afraid to campaign or make themselves known for fear of assassination. This is the very same thing that has taken place in many locations in Iraq. Many candidates in the highly touted Iraqi election were not known until the voters saw their names on the ballot FOR THE FIRST TIME when they voted! George Bush does not realize that the Muslim populations in these countries are simply not ready for democracy. Until there is security, that will allow candidates to make themselves and what they stand for known to the voters, there can be NO REAL DEMOCRACY! We are not even close to that in either Iraq or Afghanistan!
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Reply #76 Top
What you consider me to be is not the point. The conservatives DO NOT make up the majority in this country and should not be setting policy!

You have no idea what a Moderate is and I can assure you I do not support the left with more social progrems. However, the things like SS, Medicare, Medicaid need to be funded. I said from the beginning that the Prescription Drug Plan needed to be funded if it was to be enacted. The Republicans passed it with NO thought of paying for it. Now the GOP drives up the debt and the interest we must pay EVERY year is beginning to shoot up for two reason- The growth in the dabt and now higher interest rates. The National Debt will be the largest increase in the Federal Budget ( Amount and %) and it is because of the Bush policy that was supported by the conservatives. Charge and Spend. Even the old Democratic policy was better-- Tax and Spend. That at least did not require interest EVERY year to be paid the way the Conservatives have caused!
Reply #77 Top
{ Lloyd Bentsen voice on }

I know moderates. I'm friends with many moderates. I've worked with many moderates for many years.

You, C.O.L., are no moderate.

{ Lloyd Bentsen voice off }

If you walk like a duck, quack like a duck, blah blah...

You are a Clueless Old Liberal. Call yourself a Republican if you want, but then ask yourself how many Republicans you've voted for lately? How active are you in the party? How much have you given to the party? How much have you contributed to liberal causes? To liberal candidates, either materially or otherwise?

Thought so. Caught you. Switch to the big {D} and enjoy your official new friends and family. Have fun and stop hiding from the truth. Just like a closet homosexual, afraid to admit his/her real leanings.
Reply #78 Top
As usual you are wrong. The current polls say Bush did not respond properly to Katrina. Only the initial polls indicated Bush was not part of the problem. That was before the public understood how poorly the Fed reacted! The polls, as well as most officials including Bush himself, now acknowledge Bush was responsible for the failure of the Feds who had the most assets to respond. In fact, most now admit what the GAO said in 1993- ONLY THE ACTIVE MILITARY HAVE THE ASSETS< ORGANIZATION< COMMUNICATIONS AND COMMAND structure to effectively respond to a major disaster. Bush did not use the only resource that was capable of responding right after the storm! That showes a lack of leadership on his part! In addition, he appointed unqualified people to head FEMA and used that agency to pay off his political supporters.


Col, you have proved wrong about this again. Just give up and get over it.


Conservatives do NOT make up the majority. The moderates are the largest group. I consider myself a moderate.


You are as much a moderate as I am a liberal democrat.


There is a core of people that will go down with the Bush ship. Read Time this week for those of you that think we are winning in Iraq! The last straw in Iraq will be what happens after the 15 Oct election. If stablilty is not established after that election, the situation will go to Hell fast! There is also no support from the other Moslem states for the new Iraq Government. Only Iran has relations with the new Iraq government.


Col, you have already condemned Iraq. No matter what happens you will think it's a failure. I am ashamed to call you a fellow American.

The conservatives DO NOT make up the majority in this country and should not be setting policy!


America voted in twice a Conservative majority, so they do set policy. Do you even understand why liberals like yourself lose elections in this country col? You have never answered this question.
Reply #79 Top
There is also no support from the other Moslem states for the new Iraq Government. Only Iran has relations with the new Iraq government.


Col, you have now reached a point of lying.


Jordan’s premier has met in Baghdad with his Iraqi counterpart, on the highest-profile visit from his country since the ouster of President Saddam Hussein and marking a thaw in strained relations.
In a press conference with Iraq’s Ibrahim Jaafari, Adnan Badran stressed the importance of strengthening cooperation and emphasized the strong position of Iraq within the Arab world.
Badran said, “We will not leave Iraq unaided. We will continue to support the unity of Iraq’s people and its territory.” He said the common borders with Iraq were secured and that “security and stability in Iraq are linked to the security and stability of Jordan.”
At the same time, he said, “we discussed reactivating joint committees to strengthen commercial and economic relations... Iraq is a fraternal country, and an important part of the region’s history.”
Reply #80 Top
IslandDog I have proven my committment to this country both in the military and in civilian life. I do not need or want your support.
You could give a s*it about what will benefit his country long term. Just give me more tax cuts now and the Hell with the future or the fact we are passing OUR problems on to the next generation with the debt!
Reply #81 Top
You could give a s*it about what will benefit his country long term. Just give me more tax cuts now and the Hell with the future or the fact we are passing OUR problems on to the next generation with the debt!


Col, we had deficits before and we will get out of them. Do you understand why "the world is ending" people like you don't get elected.

I notice you still haven't addressed how the tax cuts helped stimulate the economy. Proved wrong again col.
Reply #82 Top
On balance, the tax cuts have cost more in lost revenue then it stimulated the economy. In addition, if you Bushies are correct and the economy has recovered , running deficits to stimulate the economy is no longer needed. Now that I answered your question, tell me why we should continue the tax cuts that were to return a surplus that never existed. We are not in recession and there is no surplus. Add the deficit, and the case is clear, we need to increase Federal revenue. The article about the lack of support for Bush among the GOP is interesting.

Katrina's Cost May Test GOP Harmony
Some Want Bush To Give Details on How U.S. Will Pay

By Shailagh Murray and Jim VandeHei
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, September 21, 2005; A01

Congressional Republicans from across the ideological spectrum yesterday rejected the White House's open-wallet approach to rebuilding the Gulf Coast, a sign that the lockstep GOP discipline that George W. Bush has enjoyed for most of his presidency is eroding on Capitol Hill.

Trying to allay mounting concerns, White House budget director Joshua B. Bolten met with Republican senators for an hour after their regular Tuesday lunch. Senators emerged to say they were annoyed by the lack of concrete ideas for paying the Hurricane Katrina bill.

"Very entertaining," Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) said sarcastically as he left the session. "I haven't heard any specifics from the administration."

"At least give us some idea" of how to cover the cost, said Sen. Conrad Burns (R-Mont.), who is facing reelection in 2006. "We owe that to the American taxpayer."

The pushback on Katrina aid, which the White House is also confronting among House Republicans, represents the loudest and most widespread dissent Bush has faced from his own party since it took full control of Congress in 2002. As polls show the president's approval numbers falling, there is growing concern among lawmakers that GOP margins in Congress could shrink next year, and even rank-and-file Republicans are complaining that Bush is shirking the difficult budget decisions that must accompany the rebuilding bonanza.

Rep. Tom Feeney (R-Fla.) said he and other fiscal conservatives are feeling "genuine concern [which] could easily turn into frustration and anger."

Congressional Republicans are not arguing with Bush's pledge that the federal government will lead the Louisiana and Mississippi recovery. But they are insisting that the massive cost -- as much as $200 billion -- be paid for. Conservatives are calling for spending cuts to existing programs, a few GOP moderates are entertaining the possibility of a tax increase, and many in the middle want to freeze Bush tax cuts that have yet to take effect.

The resistance suggests that Bush's second term could turn out far rockier and more contentious than his first. One indicator many Republicans are watching to gauge whether Bush is becoming a liability for the party is in Pennsylvania, where Rick Santorum, the No. 3 Republican in the Senate, is trailing state treasurer Bob Casey Jr. by double digits.

"My caucus would do anything for Senator Santorum," Sen. Lincoln D. Chafee (R-R.I.) said of his colleague. Chafee, who himself faces a tough reelection battle next year, predicted Republicans will increasingly be faced with the choice of propping up Bush or protecting their own. "I think they're going to collide," Chafee said of the two options.

Asked whether Bush's problems were a factor in his slump, Santorum responded, "That may be."

The White House is aware of the growing political problem and has moved on several fronts to pacify Republicans -- with decidedly uneven results. Treasury Secretary John W. Snow, in a speech yesterday, said the White House will be forced to put several plans on the "back burner," including changes to the estate tax and permanently extending first-term tax cuts. "It's taken over the national agenda, and I think it will for a while," he said.

This prompted protests from one of the White House's closest allies, House Majority Leader Tom DeLay (R-Tex.), who said waiting on taxes was unacceptable. But White House officials said Snow was accurately reflecting Bush's intentions.

Amid this friction, top White House officials told Republicans the relief and recovery package could come in much lower than widely quoted projections of $200 billion. Some House GOP leaders also are urging their colleagues to cool off, reminding them that the true cost of the relief effort is not yet known.

"There are tough choices that are going to have to be made," said White House spokesman Scott McClellan. "We're going to have to cut unnecessary spending elsewhere in the budget to offset some of the cost with Katrina."

House conservatives are particularly riled. Unhappy about spending growth during Bush's first term, they thought they had slowed the pace when Congress passed a relatively austere fiscal 2006 budget this spring.

A group of these conservatives, including Feeney, plans today to present to the White House a proposal to cover the cost of the entire Katrina relief and reconstruction package. Dubbed "Operation Offset," it will include repealing many of the pork-barrel projects stuffed into the $286 billion highway bill that Bush signed into law a few weeks before Katrina struck.

McCain called on Bush to undo the Medicare prescription drug law, while a number of lawmakers said the costly benefit should at least be postponed from its January starting date. Republicans are pressing ahead with the Medicare changes, even as the White House spreads the word it is opposed to such a move.

In one of the most unexpected proposals to cover the reconstruction costs, Rep. Vernon Ehlers (R-Mich.) raised the possibility of raising taxes. Other Republicans say that while a tax increase is unlikely, Bush tax cuts that are scheduled to take effect in coming years may be in serious jeopardy.

Sen. George V. Voinovich (R-Ohio) said he will even comb through the Pentagon budget for cost savings. "Many of us think that we need to step back and look at what we're doing and reevaluate it," Voinovich said. But he added that "someone has to look at the big picture" -- and that someone should be the president. "The vision is missing," Voinovich said.

A new Gallup poll shows a majority of Americans believe the mission in Iraq should be cut to cover the recovery costs, while only a small fraction support slashing other domestic programs, raising taxes or increasing the deficit to finance it. New Orleans also has emerged as the chief target of angst. "The question is do we really want to flood New Orleans with money," said Rep. Jack Kingston (R-Ga.).

Kingston said he has detected a building hostility toward New Orleans among his constituents, based on reports that local officials mismanaged the crisis, along with federal dollars that had previously flowed the region's way. "What we are hearing from constituents is: 'Wait a minute, slow down on this,' " Kingston said.

Deficits have rarely emerged as a potent political issue, with the exception of Ross Perot's independent bid for the presidency in 1992, but some worried Republicans believe the deficit may soon reach an untenable level, especially if Democrats can link it to Republican mismanagement.

"I don't know that anyone ever lost a race because of the deficit, but there is concern" that it could happen this time around, said Rep. Thomas M. Davis III (R-Va.), the former head of the National Republican Congressional Committee. "You can't just keep piling up debt."
Reply #83 Top
"Cut out all those exclamation points. An exclamation point is like laughing at your own joke."---F. Scott Fitzgerald

Reply #84 Top
What about addressing the points in the articles I post?
Reply #85 Top
Col, you yourself don't stick to the original topic in your own posts... why should anyone else?
Reply #86 Top
Yes, at times I do change topics most often in response to other posts. My point, is the issue exclamation points or the basic issues, on or off topic? It seems many JoeUsers who can not refute something shift to trivia .
Reply #87 Top
It seems many JoeUsers who can not refute something shift to trivia


Col you refuse to address any question that debunks your theories. Everytime someone here presents real facts that blow your ideas apart, you start with the usual rhetoric about the deficit.
Reply #88 Top
When JoeUsers say I am wrong or as you put it "debunk" my theories, what they are saying is they disbelieve the sources I have used. In writing my book, I did extensive research and used input from many well knows experts. Below is a list of the sources I used in Four More For George W.


Sources:


Against All Enemies by Richard A. Clarke

Alan Greenspan, Chairmen Federal Reserve

Boston Globe-Bush National Guard Service

Brookings Institute

Center For Economic And Policy Research

Charles Lewis

Congressional Budget Office - CBO

Dan Rather

Dept. of Labor, Division of Labor Force Statistics

Department of the Treasury, Bureau of Public Debt

Face The Nation Interview with VP Cheney 2001

Federal Reserve

General Accounting Office –GAO

General Barry McCaffrey

General Eric Shinseki, Former Army CoS

General Wesley Clark

Hoover Institute

Imperial Hubris by Anonymous (Michael Scheuer)

Lt. General John Riggs


79
Lt. George W. Bush’s National Guard records

Office of Management and Budget – OMB

Paul Craig Roberts

Paul O’Neil, Former Secretary of the Treasury 2001-2003

Plan of Attack by Bob Woodward

Popular Science -- Airborne Laser

Presidential Commission on Social Security

Professor Jeffrey Record -- United States Army War College visiting professor

Professor Paul Krugman, Princeton University

Professor Rogan Kersh

Senator Ted Kennedy comments on Medicare January 2005

Sierra Club

Social Security and Medicare Trustees

The Price of Loyalty by Ron Suskind

Toshi Tsurumi, Harvard Professor

United States Army War College

60 minutes

60 Minutes II







Reply #89 Top
Just the fact that you used "60 minutes" say enough for me. Col you can quote a number and distort the meaning behind it. Just remember col, Bush is not going anywhere, and if people like you and the democrats keep it up, another Republican will be elected. I hope you understand people like you and the other liberals are our best campaign tools.
Reply #90 Top
Dan Rather


Face The Nation Interview with VP Cheney 2001


Imperial Hubris by Anonymous (Michael Scheuer


Bob Woodward


Harvard Professor


Senator Ted Kennedy comments on Medicare January 2005


Sierra Club


Social Security and Medicare Trustees


Ron Suskind


60 minutes

60 Minutes II


Professor Paul Krugman, Princeton University


And these liberal sources are just the few that leapt right out at me....the problem with you, Col, is that your views are so slanted, like many others of your kind, that you can't see the slantedness of your sources.
Reply #91 Top
First, I am not a liberal but a moderate. You can argue a few of my sources are liberal leaning. However, look at the entire list. Most are nationally accepted experts or federal agencies. The facts have not been distorted. I have used exact data that shows what is taking place.

The problem for those that support Bush is that the results are very negative. I am not the Bush Basher the results are the Bush Bashers. You can not look at an increase in the National debt from $5.7 Trillion to$8 Trillion and argue that is good for America. You can not argue going from a balanced budget in 2000 to over $500 Billion annual deficit in 2005 is a good thing. You can not argue 3 million people crossing our border with NO control is a good thing. You can not argue that a 50% increase in the trade deficit since 2001 is a good thing. These are ALL FACTS. NO SPIN JUST the change that has taken place under the Bush policies.
Reply #92 Top
The facts have not been distorted. I have used exact data that shows what is taking place.


Col, you can use an exact number and distort the reasons behind it. Which is what you do.
Reply #93 Top
First, I am not a liberal but a moderate.


I think your definition of a moderate and liberal are the same. You believe in almost every wacky liberal theory about Bush. You demand higher taxes. You have a bias against all Republicans. You give a pass to democrats on pretty much everything. You blame Bush for everything that happens in the world no matter how ridiculous it is.

I'd like to see what your definition of liberal is.
Reply #94 Top
The reasons are not the issue. The issues are the results and their impact on this country. The date from the Debt, budget, trade, lack of border control are all factual not reasons why. They are what took place under the Bush policies and administration.

The Face the nation reference used Cheney's statements- Cheney is a Liberal?

The material from the Economics Professor that Bush at Harvard were direct statements made by Bush to the professor. The source was Bush-- Bush is a liberal?

The trustees of Social Security and Medicare are Liberals GET REAL.
Imperial Huburis was written by the man responsible for the BenLaden operation at the CIA. He had 22 years experience That has nothing to do with liberal or conservative.
You are not saying I am wrong but all these references are wrong? You just do not want to look at the results because thay are not good for this country. Bush said we should judge by RESULTS. That is just what I have done and have given the sources for thoes results. The problem for the Bush supportrs is that RESULTS do not look good The budget, Iraq, trade, immigration etc.

Reply #95 Top
Conservatives do NOT make up the majority. The moderates are the largest group. I consider myself a moderate.


Yeah, you libs are good at redefining words!

Sorry, col...a tax and spend liberal is NOT a moderate!
Reply #96 Top
No, I am a Balanced Budget MODERATE. That is what I have been saying. We need to cut pork spending, increase enforcement of existing tax laws and return the rates to the pre 2001 level except for the tax cuts that went to the middle income tax payers to balance the budget. No one or two of those actions can do the job. We need less spending and a lot more Federal revenue. There was no Surplus like Bush told us and these is no justification for the tax cuts to the wealthy. They were not overtaxed since there was no Surplus to give them back!

Does some one want to argue there was a surplus to give to the wealth with the Bush tax cuts?
Reply #97 Top
No, I am a Balanced Budget MODERATE


He sobbed, repeatedly stamping his feet and squeezing his eyes shut as tears streamed down his cheeks.
Reply #98 Top
Answer the question Why should we continue tax cuts to the wealthy when there was NO SURPLUS to return? Cat got your tongue?
Reply #99 Top
Answer the question Why should we continue tax cuts to the wealthy when there was NO SURPLUS to return? Cat got your tongue?


No, it's probably due to the only half right question being asked in the first place. Granted there may have been no surplus to return (in your eyes anyway it seems) but the part about only the wealthy getting the cuts is absolutely absurd (and again "only" in yourd and your followers (2) eyes)! So when you can ask an intelligent question....you may get an answer. Although probably not one to "your" liking, as this probably falls into that catagory.
Reply #100 Top
The reasons are not the issue.


Of course it is col. You blame Bush for everything regardless of the real reason. All you do is repeat the moveon.org rhetoric about the economy, but you take into account nothing but "it's Bush's fault". You don't take into account we were headed into a recession from the previous administration.

Answer the question Why should we continue tax cuts to the wealthy when there was NO SURPLUS to return? Cat got your tongue


Every person who pays taxes got a tax cut. Just because you are a liberal and believe the "evil rich" should support everybody in this country doesn't make you right. You want to eliminate spending col, how about eliminating welfare to start with.