If one innocent person is put to death!

hanging. firing squad, electric chair, gas chamber and now we just kill em like we do animals, we put them to 'sleep"

So, imprisonment is state sanctioned kidnapping? Working in prison would be state sanctioned slavery? I mean, how dare we put people through registering as a sex offender? Heck, what if they didn't do it? Think of the abuse people suffer being falsely labeled sex offender, and for the rest of their lives. Should we stop?

Sure, it is a possibility that innocent people pay the price. By that rationale, we don't dare put innocent people in jail for a lifetime of the horror of prison. There's really no punishment we can hand out that would somehow magically be fair to both the innocent and the guilty.

So, we get rid of capital punishment, and then they start on the next notch down, and then the next, until finally no one has the right to sit in judgement of anyone else. If infallibility was a requirement of a justice system, NO ONE could ever sit behind the bench or on a jury. Me? I see people who fight to keep monsters in the business of victimizing people, in or out of jail, as party to their acts, too.

I respect your beliefs, but there are people sitting one rung down from you who believe life imprisonment is unjust. Below them are people who feel ANY prison is unjust and we should focus on rehabilitating criminals and not punishing them at all.

You have to draw the line somewhere, and I respect where you draw it, though I disagree. I can't really condemn you, because I call those who allow monsters to bide their time, victimize others in jail, and then eventually get loose and kill again party to murder, too.

I guess we better end the entire medical profession then, since the infallibility of medical professionals ends far more innocent lives than capital punishment. Even if we took away the medical mistakes, do you realize how many medicines have death as a "side effect"?

If capital punishment is "state sponsored murder", then what should we call it when a doctor prescribes a medication (or a paramedic or nurse administers one) that lists "death" as an acceptable risk?

"If One Innocent Person is Put to Death, It's too much for me"...

so moderateman, how many inmates will be killed in prison this year? how many of those do you think are innocent? you can't give them their lives back if its discovered they are innocent. how many innocents in prison will be raped? you can't give them that innocence back if they are discovered to be innocent. better release everyone from prison immediately, just to be safe. we allow the government a lot of power in order for it to do its job, the power to kill in at certain times is one of those powers. take it from me, i know first hand.

Instead of Tookie Williams, perhaps your attention should be turned to Virginia as we are about to put to death Robin Lovitt, and the only eye witness is not completely sure he was the perp.  I dont agree with the death penalty either, but I am really hoping that Warner commutes or at least delays this sentence.

There is too much uncertainty. Even the man Warner beat for the Job says his life should be spared.

I’m against the death penalty as well. I think it’s a waste of a perfectly good living donor and medical experiment subject. Why give some innocent chimpanzee an incurable disease when we have these sub humans with DNA even closer to our own to test experimental treatments on?

As LW said, terrorists do not give their victims the right to legal representation, a trial before a jury of their peers, and the right to appeal.

I think that the home grown terrorist analogy is a bit of a stretch, MM.

So I guess you, Michael Moore and Cindy Whatsername are all in favor of adding the United (Terrorist) States of America to the Axis of Evil? ;~D

Reply By: BakerStreetPosted: Monday, November 28, 2005So, imprisonment is state sanctioned kidnapping? Working in prison would be state sanctioned slavery? I mean, how dare we put people through registering as a sex offender? Heck, what if they didn't do it? Think of the abuse people suffer being falsely labeled sex offender, and for the rest of their lives. Should we stop?

I believe life in prison, with no hope of parole, housed with other killers, locked down 23 hours a day is just and fitting baker. A killer must pay for his crime, but I just cannot help thinking if they did not do it, there is no hope of ever proving they are innocent at some future date.

Reply By: ParaTed2kPosted: Tuesday, November 29, 2005I guess we better end the entire medical profession then, since the infallibility of medical professionals ends far more innocent lives than capital punishment. Even if we took away the medical mistakes, do you realize how many medicines have death as a "side effect"? If capital punishment is "state sponsored murder", then what should we call it when a doctor prescribes a medication (or a paramedic or nurse administers one) that lists "death" as an acceptable risk?"If One Innocent Person is Put to Death, It's too much for me"...

there is a difference between prescribing meds that have a risk of death, the patient knows this ted.

Reply By: little_whipPosted: Tuesday, November 29, 2005Glad to know you think I'm no better than a terrorist because I support the death penalty, Elie.Big fucking difference, though. Terrorists do not give their victims a court trial, with witnesses, a jury, and an attorney. They do not feed, clothe, and house them for 20 years worth of appeals in which to prove their innocence. They deliberately target innocent people to kill, whereas the State has to meet all sorts of conditions to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt before this sentence is imposed.You can be against the death penalty all the live long day, Elie, and I can respect that. But I don't appreciate being equated with a goddamn terrorist for disagreeing with you.

Ok the terrorist remark is way over the top whip, was just in a "mood" apoligizes..

#6 by Dr. Guy Tuesday, November 29, 2005

6 by Dr. Guy Tuesday, November 29, 2005

Instead of Tookie Williams

this ain't about tookie, it's about state sanctioned murder doc.

#7 by stubbyfinger Tuesday, November 29, 2005

I’m against the death penalty as well. I think it’s a waste of a perfectly good living donor and medical experiment subject. Why give some innocent chimpanzee an incurable disease when we have these sub humans with DNA even closer to our own to test experimental treatments on?

too close to torture.

#8 by dharmagrl Tuesday, November 29, 2005

think that the home grown terrorist analogy is a bit of a stretch, MM.

you and whip are right, was over the top. apoligizes.

9 by ParaTed2k Tuesday, November 29, 2005

So I guess you, Michael Moore and Cindy Whatsername are all in favor of adding the United (Terrorist) States of America to the Axis of Evil? ;~D

ouch ted.

"I believe life in prison, with no hope of parole, housed with other killers, locked down 23 hours a day is just and fitting baker. A killer must pay for his crime, but I just cannot help thinking if they did not do it, there is no hope of ever proving they are innocent at some future date."

How awful, thinking of all those innocent people you are condemning to a life of confinement, physical and mental abuse, and forced labor. Unless you think for some reason we only make mistakes in cases that end in capital punishment.

I guess it is a matter of perspective, but being unjustly sentenced to living the rest of my life with animals in a cage isn't any more preferable than death.

#18 by BakerStreet Tuesday, November 29, 2005

I believe life in prison, with no hope of parole, housed with other killers, locked down 23 hours a day is just and fitting baker. A killer must pay for his crime, but I just cannot help thinking if they did not do it, there is no hope of ever proving they are innocent at some future date." How awful, thinking of all those innocent people you are condemning to a life of confinement, physical and mental abuse, and forced labor. Unless you think for some reason we only make mistakes in cases that end in capital punishment. I guess it is a matter of perspective, but being unjustly sentenced to living the rest of my life with animals in a cage isn't any more preferable than death.

the difference being is many prisoners have been released due to new technology, mny of then have served decades behind bars unjustly. Kind of hard to do that with someone put to death.

17 by little_whip Tuesday, November 29, 2005

And you call being locked down 23 hours a day in solitary confinement what

I call it a just and fair punishment for a presumed killer whip, as long as killer is alive evidence can set him free, if he is guilty, well then tough shit for them.

yep, one released recently based upon DNA evidence seems to have murdered a woman who came to his house to photograph his car for a sale paper. If that is what jail does to "innocent" people, I tend to think killing them is more human.

I can say without a shadow of a doubt that if I would be later released in the mental condition to commit a crime like that, go right ahead and kill me. That kind of mental change, to me, would be worse than death. I'd rather be dead than assimilated into the zoo.

you and whip are right, was over the top. apoligizes

See, that's why I like you so much. You apologize sincerely and say when you're wrong with dignity.

21 by BakerStreet Tuesday, November 29, 2005

yep, one released recently based upon DNA evidence seems to have murdered a woman who came to his house to photograph his car for a sale paper. If that is what jail does to "innocent" people, I tend to think killing them is more human. I can say without a shadow of a doubt that if I would be later released in the mental condition to commit a crime like that, go right ahead and kill me. That kind of mental change, to me, would be worse than death. I'd rather be dead than assimilated into the zoo.

baker i do not think one case example is enough to put aside all the totally innocent people released because they were railroaded into prison. But since you cited one example I feel it behooves me to respond in kind. How about the case of hurricane carter, wrongly imprisoned for a murder he did not commit, carter had no prison record at the time and since his release has become an advocate for wrongful imprisonment. http://graphicwitness.com/carter/

#22 by dharmagrl Tuesday, November 29, 2005

you and whip are right, was over the top. apoligizes See, that's why I like you so much. You apologize sincerely and say when you're wrong with dignity.

thanx D, The day I cannt say "i was wrong" is the day I can walk on water and change water into wine.

this ain't about tookie, it's about state sanctioned murder doc.

I know, but Robin is more immediate, and the guilt not as clear cut.   Before we start worrying about an execution in 2 weeks, perhaps we need worry about one that is in one day.

Ok MM, take all the fun out it! Just as I was ready to hit you with a few more great ones, you go and apologize! ;~D

Glad you did though, we all have our "over the top" moments, it's how we handle realizing it (or having it pointed out to us) that makes the difference.

And in fairness, even though I did mean the Mikey/Cindy shot as a joke, I take it back also. ;~D

25 by Dr. Guy Tuesday, November 29, 2005

this ain't about tookie, it's about state sanctioned murder doc. I know, but Robin is more immediate, and the guilt not as clear cut. Before we start worrying about an execution in 2 weeks, perhaps we need worry about one that is in one day.

there is just nothing I can do about this doc, much as I would like to.