You can crown yourself Grand All-Knowing King of the Universe for all I care, eric, it doesn't make your posturing and blathering any more valid or correct.

I don't need to have intimate conversations with you in order to understand that you are wrong and further that you are so smug and close-minded that you will NEVER. EVER. EVER. admit to it.

You don't have to prove yourself to me. I don't care what you make or how smart you are how nice a guy you are or how much you appreciate the military. Those are things for YOU to worry about. Not me.

As far as your "sister" goes, we'll see. Either a) She's a made up persona you've created to add credibility to your claims or You called your SISTER and asked for her to come rescue you on a blog site!

A or B, I'm laughing my ass off.

As far as your "sister" goes, we'll see. Either a) She's a made up persona you've created to add credibility to your claims or You called your SISTER and asked for her to come rescue you on a blog site!

Actually, I merely called my sister to ask about Army benefits, when she asked why, I tod her about this great post and all the insulting morons that claim they can give their children a perfectly good life at the wefare level. She got interested and came by to check it out, nothing more, nothing less.

She simply found the whining of you enlisted hags to be insuting to the military, and simply chidish, your insults to my beliefs that eking out an existence for your children is not something to be commended for. You are a hyper sensitive drama queen, that needs the ten more years experience that my sister has on you before over reacting to every somewhat questionable comment about the miitary or your views of it.

insulting morons

She simply found the whining of you enlisted hags

hyper sensitive drama queen

These comments, along with your "sister's" bitchy rant on my blog have resulted in banishment from my blog. Complain all you want about freedom of speech and blah, blah, blah. I don't care.

Your true colors are obvious.

I don't need to have intimate conversations with you in order to understand that you are wrong and further that you are so smug and close-minded that you will NEVER. EVER. EVER. admit to it.

Have to comment on this one. Can you not see the obvious here? What I am getting from your statement is that Eric is wrong for having his own opinion. Is that not the point of these discussions or would you rather everyone just write "hey TEX I agree with everything you say and you rock, I have nothing to add but how great you are" ? You are coming off as the close-minded one here and it is evident in the fact that you can't see it. I don't agree with everything my brother, husband or anyone else I can think of believes but that doesn't make them wrong. It means they have a mind of their own to form their own opinions. If you do respond back please be reminded that I didn't actualy call you close minded...just that you appear that way in the blog and that is what I have to base my opinion on. This has obviously played out, maybe you have heard of agreeing to disagree.

With the exception of Tex or any other personel here, who may retire with Army pension and benefits, I fully believe the lot of you will be burdens to society and your well loved children. I on the other hand, will be a burden to no one. If that makes me a rich elitist, then so be it. I've been working and self sufficient since I was 15 and I plan to be so long after I retire

No, this makes you an insufferable boor! I also raised 2 kids on an E-3 pay and I'll tell you this much. If you tried spewing your crap at either of my children or talked to "any" of the women here like you have, in front of my boys....I'm pretty sure you'd be spitting teeth! I raised them with a few more manners than you seem to have.

I don't need to have intimate conversations with you in order to understand that you are wrong and further that you are so smug and close-minded that you will NEVER. EVER. EVER. admit to it. Have to comment on this one. Can you not see the obvious here? What I am getting from your statement is that Eric is wrong for having his own opinion

And I have got to comment back. Eric is NOT being villified for having an opinion or expressing it. Rather he is being villified for the "way" along with his attitude he used in expressing his opinion! It would seem that ericseba is the same color as the highlight for a quote, right along with his sister.

She simply found the whining of you enlisted hags to be insuting to the military, and simply chidish, your insults to my beliefs that eking out an existence for your children is not something to be commended for. You are a hyper sensitive drama queen, that needs the ten more years experience that my sister has on you before over reacting to every somewhat questionable comment about the miitary or your views of it.

FAAAAAR better to be an "enlisted hag" than a eliteist snob of a "zero's wife! The women here are ladies until the the chips are down. Then they become a lot more than just a lady! And on top of all that they are ladies by the grace of god (for some....sorry if that offends you LW) and upbringing. Unlike your sister who was made a lady by an act of congress! Grow up sonny!

Hey TEX and friends. Since you blocked me off of your blog I will come here to answer your MOS questons, you stated that you couldn't wait to hear the answer. In advance let me apologize to those of you who are in this blog that wonder where the heck I am coming from. I feel it is wrong to ask me a question about the validity of my existence and then block me out before I can answer. So here it is. My husband's MOS is 11Bravo, was 95 Bravo when he was enlisted. If you need more acronyms as "proof" that I am not an "alter ego" here are a few. My husband gets up at 0430 to get in his POV with his BDU's in the backseat to go to PT. He is a BN and has held other positions such as PL, CO, BDE S1. Some of his duties lately have been approving NCOER's, writing ARCOM's, writing OER's, going on FTX's, deploying in support of OIF where he stayed in theatre for nine months at the begining of the war. He has been to CGSC, OCS, BMO, IOBC, and many other schools that I don't need to mention for fear that it may look like flaunting. He was deployed for OUD Haiti, Desert Storm etc. He has numerous awards and decorations that I would prefer not to mention here as I can only assume that you would find some fault in such as saying it is because he is an officer or that I am bragging. His dependents are involved in CYS, I don't do AFTB, not in OSC, do participate in FRG formaly known as FSG which was renamed as it made dependents seem weak. I didn't google to find this info as we have lived it.
You seem to find it ok to have your friends bash others but when you get brought to task anyone else must be an alter ego or be weak to have to call in support. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. I was under the impression that we have the right to freedom of speech. I don't feel as though I have insulted you, I didn't use foul language or attack you personaly, I haven't questioned your existence, haven't done a lot of things that would deem it necessary to block me out. You have insulted me, insulted my husband's rank, name called and pointed out that I spelled a word wrong. I don't claim to be perfect, don't claim to know it all, and certainly don't claim to never make a typing mistake. I type fast because I have three kids and other things that keep me too busy to go back and spellcheck. In my opinion it is more about what someone has to say on a subject than if they spelled correctly or if they used proper punctuation.
Again to those who started this blog, I do apologize for using your forum to take care of this unfinished business.

FAAAAAR better to be an "enlisted hag" than a eliteist snob of a "zero's wife! The women here are ladies until the the chips are down. Then they become a lot more than just a lady! And on top of all that they are ladies by the grace of god (for some....sorry if that offends you LW) and upbringing. Unlike your sister who was made a lady by an act of congress! Grow up sonny!

So I am an eliteist snob for coming and outlining the benefits package the military offers? I am a lady because I choose not to belittle others, use vulgarity and insults to belittle others, and generaly whine. No act of Congress makes anyone a lady but hard work, dedication and sacrifice made my husband an officer. You recieve the same benifits from the same place we do so get off your high horse. As I stated before and will state again, my husband earned his commision the hard way...from private to E6 and then onto OCS. He used his GI bill, the same offered to everyone enlisted member. It isn't for everyone, the army needs NCO's and Commisioned Officers. Why do you find it necessary to belittle someone for furthering their career? I have not said one bad word against enlisted and I wouldn't, that is just crazy. The generalization is that an officer's wife wears her husbands rank, you won't find that here but I think I see your stripes coming out and I thought it was your husband that earned them not you. Be proud of your soldier for who he is and what he does for his country, not by bashing others that you know nothing about.
To quote a favorite movie TEX....."you can't handle the truth"....just block it out and enjoy your own little one sided world, how sad for you.

iw: Can you READ?

You were responding to a comment by drmiler, not by me.

I have nothing else to say to you.

I have nothing else to say to you

Look back at your blog and I was answering your question. You are all about censorship aren't you, suprising since your husband signed up to defend said rights. I had to come here to answer you since you deleted my postings...guess they hit a little close to home and you couldn't handle it. Also, you and your friend were double teaming me so I felt it was okay to sum it up to both of you at one time. I do wish you the best for you and your soldier no matter how it may seem here. At the risk of sounding sappy, we have a lot in common wether you would ever admit it. We are passionate about what we believe in and what our husbands stand up to do. Unfortunately this will probaly either get turned around or used against me as these seems to be a rather hostile place. Enjoy Hawaii and all it has to offer and if your husband is deployed or about to be I wish the best for his safety and well being because when it comes down to it, no matter what rank he is, he is an American soldier and deserves respect.

No, this makes you an insufferable boor! I also raised 2 kids on an E-3 pay and I'll tell you this much. If you tried spewing your crap at either of my children or talked to "any" of the women here like you have, in front of my boys....I'm pretty sure you'd be spitting teeth! I raised them with a few more manners than you seem to have.

Were you perpetually an E-3? Never increased in rank?

Besdies the obvious truth that no, you did not exist as an E-3 perpetually, I have also already gone over this subject with Tex and it is why my sister came in to comment. I am not addressing the military when discussing this 35k issue. If everyone in this country were afforded free housing, no utilities and free medical care as part of their compensation, I would have no problem with the 35k standard. As it were drmiler, your "E-3" pay was much more than what you saw in your paycheck. So please, please please, no more military personnel telling me about how they "struggled" through life, but did okay in the end.

You want to bring your boys into this huh? Well I've got a 14 year old son that was reading this dribble last night that would propose that he is more mature than your so-called "ladies". Tex's incessant "dude", "Bwhahaha" and other tired booring cliche's really make my son worry about the state of affairs in this country. Whip and her "man you are so getting your ass kicked every other post" has him simply speechless. And while my son is too young to have started taking finance classes, even he at his young age would question the rationale of someone bringing a child into this world if they can't even afford a car. Even a 14 year old kid finds it ludicrous that in this country, If you are unable to be financially responsible for a bunch nuts and bolts, that you are able to bring a lving breathing human into this world. Somehow, our priorities are a little warped here.

My son, as a child, as a young person who still looks to his parents for love, protection and providing, is horrified at the images of these "poor" folks down in new Orleans who can not even provide their children with a ride two hours inland to avoid being drowned, yet they are trusted with their well being. Like me, my son has nothing but pity for those poor children, but disdain for their parents who cannot even provide a damn ride out of a drowning city. And worse, instead of taking personal responsibilty (which this post was originally was about), people blame Bush for their predicament. Well we can argue forever about whose fault it is that New Orleans is a historically poor city, but I am quite sure that none of you will contend that Bush personally went down and fathered all of those children that are exisiting amongst the dead and dying. But hey, I guess this experience will only go to "build character" and teach the "benefit of a little suffering" to the poor children of New Orleans whose parents can't afford the upkeep of a vehicle, but have the responsibility of multiple children. God forbid we actually hold their parents to task for their role in the predicanment in which their children find themselves.

I'm pretty sure you'd be spitting teeth! I raised them with a few more manners than you seem to have.

Those manners include settling disputes with having people "spitting teeth"?

I feel sorry for your kids, eric, because they have a parent who equates love with money, and thats really, really sad.

No, they equate love with the fact that I brought them into this world AFTER I was able to properly raise them, They can rest assured knowing that if our home is being flooded they won't hear their dad saying, "damn that Bush, all because of him, I can't afford a car with which to evacuate my kids!!"

Having "gobs" of money and being able to properly provide the basic necessities for your children are two very different ideas, whip. You people are twisiting my words into "only the rich can have children". I am only saying that one should be able to provide for the basics, maybe be able to take in a ball game very once in a while and prepare for the future so as not to be a burden to your children when you are in your golden years. That whip, does not require great wealth, but I propose that it takes a hell of a lot more than 35k per year.

Just checking the news this morning on msn, I came across this article on the front page titled "12 fast-growing cities that are still cheap". The cheapest city on the list was Lakeland, FL with a median home price of $108,000. The highest was Allentown-Bethlehem-Easton, PA at $207,300. The National median price for a home is $218,000. these are places considered "cheap". Now this is not to say that a house cannot be had for less (for all you 35k you should hope so because the max mortgage payment the bank will finance is $765.00, nowhere near the mortgage on a $108,000 house), but hey, when you go to a city, if you shop at the bottom of the barrel, you are going to get the neighborhood that is at the bottom of the barrel.
Link

As far as the original argument goes, think of all the great people that would never have been born had their parents thought like eric and his "sister."

This is the nonexistent sister just coming back to remind you that as two people, my brother and I hold different opinions-obviously a new concept to you. Where did I ever state that certain children shouldn't be born? The only thing I ever said on the issue....as you may recall I simply came on to talk about benefits (a thread that has been deleted by liberal cencorship hmmm...) is that if you are on welfare I believe it irresponsible to keep having more and more children. By all means, use the welfare to pull yourself up and then go on to have however many babies you want. Is this so crazy? I am afraid though that you are delusional. YOu couldn't wait to hear about the MOS issue and now that you have you continue to "rant" about the "sister". Aren't you the one who doesn't have children anyway? Not to say there is anything wrong with that, but what do you really know about what it takes to rear a child? FOrgive me if I am wrong about your parental status but if I am right, did you "Google" to find out what it takes to raise a child? Real life experiences go a lot further than what you can read on the internet.

This isn't a dispute, eric, this is you openly insulting people. I can't speak for anyone else, but the implication that I am unfit or irresponsible as a parent is about the worst possible insult I can imagine. I don't know that I would have you "spitting teeth", but such an attitude is not something you should take as lightly as you do.

I would assume anyone as self-admittedly "grown up" as you are would have enough tact not to march in and start questioning the parenting skills of complete strangers based on some patently ignorant income scale. I guess not.

It would seem that ericseba is the same color as the highlight for a quote, right along with his sister.

Insults, insults....that is how you cope, very sad. It reminds me of an angry two year old not getting her way.

managed to retire as an aeorospace engineer for one of the largest defense contractors in the United States

Obviously you grew up on welfare and that is why you are so staunchly defeneding it? Sounds like you must have really gone without as a child. Go ahead and name some of those brilliants who grew up in today's world on today's welfare since that is the issue. Also since you have such a problem with me, please be sure to remember when looking this up to take into consideration the circumstances in which I felt it was just fine to be on welfare, not a permenant way of life.

I have finally figured out to host photos on a website that will allow me to provide you with a link for viewing:

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Now these are scans that I have made this morning of my mine and my wife's most recent paystubs (censored to discourage the creeps that whip talks about). Now some of you, namely Tex and whip will begin questioning the validity of the scans, claim I have some program for creating them, etc.. (and these are the people that ban me from their posts because I wil simply NEVER see that I am wrong). To the conspiracy theorists who believe my sister is my alter ego (how's that ip check going whip?) and that I have created my personal history, these scans will be a lesson in futility (the idea that I would create a fales history, a phantom sister and now falsify pay stubs to illustrate a point is laughable). But to those who give me just a tad of credibility regardless of my view points let me illustrate the following from my pay stubs:

First, yes my wife and I work together and we commute together as well. To the dismay of the ladies here, yes my stub is the one that is paid salary and my poor wife is slaving away as the hourly wage employee making $10.00 per hour. As you can see from her paystubs, we both work hard, around 60 hours per week. We are both here from 6am until 5pm mon-fri and for a few hours in the morning on Saturdays. As my stub shows, I have worked here for 11 and 1/2 years. It does not show that I started as a driver and worked my way through shipping receiving, the front office, accounting and now my current position as the number two of the company as operations manager. I was not born with a silver spoon, I worked my way up in this company through hard work and dedication.

To those of you who say I work to much, only worry about money and am distant from my children: My wife and I are home around six in the evening mon-fri. I have the privelge of being able to bring my girls into the office with me on Saturdays. They can color and draw in my office, mess around on one of the computers or watch TV in the conference room. They love it because we stop in at Dunkin Donuts on the way in and we go out for lunch when we leave. I make enough money to swing by the house after work, pick up the boys and go out to the mall, go see a movie, hit Chuckie Cheeses or what not. Maybe we just go home and play in the backyard.

Now let's look at the stubs and the real reason I posted them. These stubs are not to illustrate that I am rich (as many of you would surely say). No, these stubs are to show at least partially what it costs to raise a a family and to begin preparing for retirement in a manner that will allow us to not be a burden on our children later in life (a subject that not one of you has had the stones to address).

We have discussed health care and I've had everyone tell me about how much I have inflated the real costs. Again, I don't know what world you people live in, but see my stub for my reality. Oddly enough, it is cheaper for me to pay for an adult with dependents and have my wife pay the individual rate, than it is for one of us to simply pay for a full family (one of the mysteries of the world of insurance). My stub shows my weekly deduction as $78.50 or $2,9830.00 year to date. My wife pays $26.85 weekly and $751.80 year to date. By the time this year is over we will be out of pocket $5,478.20 in premium alone. The plan is an HMO, so while we don't have a 20-80 plan, we do have co-pays for every visit. I've also included a scan of my insurance card.:


Please note, this is Aetna, not some rip-off only takes peoeple with bad credit health plan. Aetna people and a small group at that (supposedly we get better rates because the company get's a volume discount). However, my wife and I STILL pay $105.35 per WEEK just for premiums. My card shows that the doctor deductible is $20.00, $40.00 for a specialist. Prescriptions range from $10.00-$45.00. It does not show that emergency room visits are $100.00 co-pays. You have a newborn that get's sick in the middle of the night, well Tex, out here in the real world we have to decide between paying the $100.00 emergency room fee or making our little newborn tough it out until the morning (I guess you'll say she should not be so weak, it builds character right??) and pay the $20.00 rate (if I can get a same day appt at the doctor's office).

I repeat $5,478.20 annually just for PREMIUMS!! This not a luxury, not some fanciful expenditure of the rich, this is what each and every person who plans to have children should be prepared for. If you make 35k per year, you health insurance premiums will be over 15% of your pre-tax income.

Now, on to the next subject on my stub. While I was already doing so independently, my company has recently begun an optional IRA contribution. I am deducting $75.00 weekly and my $40.00. That's $115.00 per week or $5,980.00 per year that we are putting away so that we will not be a burden on our children or our fellow citizens. So far, we are up to $11,458.20 per year in insurance premiums and savings for retirement alone, almost 1/3 of the total annual earnings of you 35k'rs. Now some of you will try and try hard to make these expenditures seem wasteful and reserved for the rich. I have said it many times, if I am rich and elitist because I can pay for my own children's health coverage and plan for my retirement while still knocking out newborns, then I guess I'm guilty as charged. I don't know if insurance rates are a regional issue, but I see no reason why an Atlanta resident should have higher healthcare costs. However, if it is the case, then I guess my point should be that residents of Atlanta should not have two children while earning less than 35k. However, I sincerely doubt that health cost and saving for retirement are any less expensive based upon where you live.

But I am dying to see you Tex, you whip, you drmiler and you Baker and all of the other bleding heart "poor is great crowd" explain to me how you can afford two children on 35k per year, if you can't even provide proper healthcare or plan for your retirement. Heck, I'm at 1/3 of 35k and we haven't begun to discuss housing, utilities, food and clothing or gasp!! entertainment expenses. For that matter, what is the tax on 35k anyways??

Sorry, this link stuff is not working out as well as I planned, I think I have them here now, the two stubs referenced as well as my health insurance card:

Link

Link

Link

Just click the link, go to the bottom of the page and click on FREE download. The image will diplay on the screen imbeded in the page.

I'm pretty sure you'd be spitting teeth! I raised them with a few more manners than you seem to have. Those manners include settling disputes with having people "spitting teeth"?

With someone that is as arrogant AND ignorant as you seem to be....yes! Most especially when you talk to a lady the way you have here. As a matter of "fact" if any male in my immediate family (me, my brother, my father or my 2 boys) heard you talking like that to a lady you'd more than likely get the same responce from ALL of us. And just an FYI....the manners "I" was refering to are "how to talk to a lady".

And just an FYI....the manners "I" was refering to are "how to talk to a lady".

I think that being a lady is more than genetics or an act of congress if you know what I mean. Since he is a gentleman I will respond by saying in my OPINION you do not meet the basic standards of how a lady acts. Insults, foul language and intolerance of others does not a lady make. Just my opinion of what makes a lady. He was raised well on how to treat a "lady".

This isn't a dispute, eric, this is you openly insulting people. I can't speak for anyone else, but the implication that I am unfit or irresponsible as a parent is about the worst possible insult I can imagine. I don't know that I would have you "spitting teeth", but such an attitude is not something you should take as lightly as you do. I would assume anyone as self-admittedly "grown up" as you are would have enough tact not to march in and start questioning the parenting skills of complete strangers based on some patently ignorant income scale. I guess not.

Baker, I am showing pay stubs, real deductions for insurance, taxes and retirement. You keep crying to me that I am personally insulting you because you were once an E-3 rasing two children. I ask again, were you an E-3 all of your life? After the military, did you have a family income of less than 35k while still raising your children? If so, how much did you have saved up for their college education when they reached 18? How much do you have saved up for retirement if you are still living off of 35k annually? What if social security doesn't exist in a decade or two? If your sons followed your fine example of raising children on 35k, will they be able to provide what you did not save for your golden years?

Are you even in these circumstances or are you so insulted by my sense of reality that you are merely coming to the defense of those that might be?

Lastly, I am not questioning your parenting skills, I am questioning the ability of someone to financially support their children on so meager an income. You can be the most firmly grounded, loving parent on earth, but love doesn't pay the mortgage or the health insurance premiums.

I am questioning the responsibility of an individual that blames the president because he cannot afford to own a car with which to transport his children out of a drowning city, yet you claim they are otherwise perfectly capable of raising a family of four.

And Baker, I will repeat, don't hold me to a standard of only being able to say on this blog, what I would be willing to say to a complete stranger's face. Tex has called my children weak, you have threatened me with physical violence and whip is a nonstop torrent of insults against my sister and I. All behaviors that I am sure that all you would refrain from if my kids, my sister and her family and I were in front of you face to face. The beauty of the internet is not one's ability to be a jerk on a blog, it's the beauty of being able to have a frank discussion about issues that can inflame passions beyond the point of what would be advisable with a stranger walking down the street (as I said, you want to knock my teeth out, or at least have your sons do it for you).

So I am an eliteist snob for coming and outlining the benefits package the military offers? I am a lady because I choose not to belittle others, use vulgarity and insults to belittle others, and generaly whine. No act of Congress makes anyone a lady but hard work, dedication and sacrifice made my husband an officer. You recieve the same benifits from the same place we do so get off your high horse. As I stated before and will state again, my husband earned his commision the hard way...from private to E6 and then onto OCS. He used his GI bill, the same offered to everyone enlisted member. It isn't for everyone, the army needs NCO's and Commisioned Officers. Why do you find it necessary to belittle someone for furthering their career? I have not said one bad word against enlisted and I wouldn't, that is just crazy. The generalization is that an officer's wife wears her husbands rank, you won't find that here but I think I see your stripes coming out and I thought it was your husband that earned them not you. Be proud of your soldier for who he is and what he does for his country, not by bashing others that you know nothing about.

Like your brother, you come across that way with your attitude that shows in your writing. And just an FYI.....it is a well documented "fact" that by an "act of congress" that all military officers are "gentlemen" and their wives are to be considered "ladies". Problem is for the most part "neither" one deserves the title. And please do try to follow the conversation. This is NOT "Tex"! "My" name is drmiler. As far as your husbands rank goes, I do not know the man nor have I ever served with him so I could not in all fairness offer any comment in that area. Mustang officers (ones that start as enlisted) are generally considered a better grade of officer. And your own comments show you to be snobish. Otherwise you would know that the word "zero" is used by enlisted personel to describe officers as the officers ranks are usually O-1 up through O-10

Baker, I apologize in advance if I am blending your comments with drmiler, sorry. I guess I am more or less speaking to both of you on the last post.

And just an FYI....the manners "I" was refering to are "how to talk to a lady". I think that being a lady is more than genetics or an act of congress if you know what I mean. Since he is a gentleman I will respond by saying in my OPINION you do not meet the basic standards of how a lady acts. Insults, foul language and intolerance of others does not a lady make. Just my opinion of what makes a lady. He was raised well on how to treat a "lady".

Once again you don't seem to be following the conversation very well at all. Just to clue you in this is again drmiler NOT Tex OR LW and I'm NOT female! Get it? Got it? Gooood! Do try to keep up in the future.