I wouldn't have said it if it wasn't the main thing that was dragging SCO development down at this point.

Here is what is going on...

• Aliens? We have a great system to handle dialog and lip syncing!
• Storyline? Rock Solid. It will win a Pulitzer, Hugo, and Nobel Prize for Literature.
• Space? We were fighting on the viewpoint, but we have our systems set up.
• Combat? It was rough at first, but we see where we need to go to fix it. Nothing to worry about here.
• Planetary Exploration? We're screwed! Hope y'all have more than 100GB of VRAM on your GPU. Also, say hello to load screens or forced transition movies. And say goodbye to diverse planet types.

Didn't you complain about this too earlier in this thread?

Would you like them to continue to chase after a boondoggle feature that nobody asked for?

Because, let's face it: The only reason why we have Super Mario Galaxy worlds is because Stardock wanted to "differentiate" themselves from what SC2 did.

EDIT: 

To put things more succinctly...

SCO's planetary exploration is turning into a cancer. We may need to cut it out to save the rest of the game.

If that makes you panic, demand that they reinstitute the original planetary lander mini game that had a much smaller human and machine resource cost.

If I had my way, I would make it so that the number of stars and explorable planets could be scaled up or down similar to MOO or GalCiv. I always played those games on small or tiny because it let me skip the boring stuff (explore) and get right to the fun stuff (expand, exploit, exterminate).

Well... i'm really interested on the aliens... i REALLY hope the January vault has them!

;O Aliens are my lifeblood for movies and games <3

In 1080p or 4k resolution.

Yeah, I can't possibly support what you want here.

Maybe, maybe not. What's your side of the argument? Why should SCO implement Super Mario Galaxy Meets Mass Effect? Why choose this over the old SC2 system? What level of crippled gameplay are you willing to live with? 6 planet types? Massive load delays? Crysys levels of hardware requirements? All to drive around, gobbling up starbits and pewpewpewing creeps?

To me, the vibe of the last update was, "We were too ambitious. Time to scale back."

That's not the vibe I got at all. I interpreted as a need for a restructuring of how it's being done. Removal is not on the table.

Restructuring = Scaling Back. Plus, Brad said before that everything is on the table.

Also, you didn't answer my questions.

Why should SCO implement Super Mario Galaxy Meets Mass Effect? Why choose this over the old SC2 system? What level of crippled gameplay are you willing to live with? 6 planet types? Massive load delays? Crysys levels of hardware requirements? All to drive around, gobbling up starbits and pewpewpewing creeps?

You realize it's basically the same mechanics, right? The only thing that's different is presentation.

I do realize that, or did you not read my post? I said that the whole thing needed to be yanked OR reduced to SC2 levels because the deliverables aren't living up to the vision initially pitched to us.

Hence my questions...

Why should SCO implement Super Mario Galaxy Meets Mass Effect? Why choose this over the old SC2 system? What level of crippled gameplay are you willing to live with? 6 planet types? Massive load delays? Crysys levels of hardware requirements? All to drive around, gobbling up starbits and pewpewpewing creeps?

If your stance is that you want to see what they can do before deciding to axe or scale back, that's fine too. I'm willing to wait and say that I told you so. (But keep in mind that they are already in scale back mode... )

Yeah, i just wanna see them in SOME detail

You're really reaching here, though. You do realize that in SC II, in actuality there was only ONE type of planet... Flat. Various colors and swirls of flat, but flat, one-size rectangle nonetheless.... Right? 

My several hundred cents:

• I'll start with the accompanying files

1. I very much liked the planet music. Yes, game music should be unobtrusive but meaningful and evocative and I think this one hits the mark.
2. The human theme feels a bit off. I think it should be more industrial, that is closer to the original, with beats that make me feel like this is a race that is almost literally boostrapping its way out of nothingness and into the galactic scene. And that takes a lot of work.
3. The logo is cool.
4. I don't have much to say about the Mukay rig except it looks unfinished. But I guess that makes sense as it is still months from being production ready.
5. Without the video, or even storyboards, I don't know what to make of the intro music. But if this is the story of humans making themselves matter in this galaxy, then it's much to synthy and should probably feel more like rock, like struggle. See point 2.

• And now for the update document.

1. I second a previous idea about procedural generation. I take Torchlight II as an example. If you look at it, especially at the random dungeons, you can see that certain parts repeat exactly. Just in different configurations. So, it's obvious they have pre-made parts they shuffle around and reattach procedurally. That could be a way to go that will look good and not be too weird.
2. I know time to actually work on a project is hard to come by, when you factor in clients and money. I don't need to be reminded. I just hope that you will get builds to us as soon as possible and take as much time as possible on the polish phase. Many games go gold in an incomplete state and then get much better after launch. But they still take a hit from reviews and public opinion. I don't want that to happen to Star Control.
3. I'm not the graphical genius but did you try to stream assets as needed? Campo Santo did something like that for Firewatch. And, as I'm playing Grim Dawn currently, I see they did something wonderful there because the world is completely seamless and teleporting is also very quick.
4. What I liked about ship design in Star Control II is that, while it's a big oblong shape, the ship looks very different depending on how you design it. I hope that in Origins, despite all modules being centered on a wheel, we'll still have that. I know it's probably too late to discuss the main model of the game but I just hope there will be a lot to customise on that ship.
5. I also agree with what's been said about world variety. The sector would feel much more dull with out some kind of rocky M class world. Barren is common and Volcanic also (or 'Hot' as astronomers like to call them) but, although crystalline would be cool, frozen and just rocky or, preferably, living (we have to hunt for weird lifeforms somewhere) seems like a much more sensible idea (even considering development resources) than acid or rainbow. I would gladly save those two for a later update. Even more, you can spread the rumour and myth of rainbow worlds which are difficult to find and even more difficult to explore (rainbow means very harsh in the Star Control dictionary) and they wouldn't be found until a few updates later.
6. Sometimes it takes some travelling to understand that the best thing is to be home. Maybe Super/Hyper/Whatever Melee should just stay as it is. Or you can do a pause and play massive fleet combat situation like some other games. Either of the two will work. But, seriously, the best thing is probably to just let the people test it.
7. As for the ships themselves, they do seem mostly similar. Star Control should have wild shapes, bold colours and designs that get weirder from ship to ship. With that I agree. Like some designers tend to say, turn the dial to 0.1 and then to 200 and then you can more easily see what works better. I like the Mu'kay ship and the Phamysht (yes, that's a very weird name) one. I'm slightly interested in the Greegrox and the Measured have to offer but the others don't look very special.
8. 700 stars is enough. Most people won't see them all. I haven't explored all 500 systems in Star Control II. And I would prefer 700 (or even 500) mostly interesting systems to 400 billion that just look the same. And a 2D map is fine. The galaxy is mostly 2D anyway.
9. Hyperspace looks cool but I want to see the entire flow before final judgment.
10. The solar system looks good but the background is too much. Most of space, especially from the solar system perspective, is mostly dotted black. The nebula background bothers me in every game that does it. And, yes, the lines might be too much. Needs something more subtle.
11. It's interesting you're thinking about cosplay when designing the human commander. So, firstly, don't think of cosplay just for her but for all the rest. Because some insane person might build a full Diablo costume or a Transformer. And if you want cosplay, you really need very unique and colourful characters. And she is, currently, not so much. Maybe she should accessorise.

Thank you for the update and I really hope at least someone from the dev team is reading this and paying some attention. See you next month.

Throwing in my 2 cents.

Feel free to come up with and name some suggested components that you’d like to see on your shop.
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I am also a huge fan of the ship customisation  . . and plan to alter the game at a later date so I can eventually build something that is completely over powered  

Also, if i look closely at the image, it looks like the Bow and Stern looks customisation as well - Awesome !

As for ideas for various modules:
> System Modules - Ignoring the usual suspects (Cargo / Crew / Dynamos / Fuel / Engines / Thrusters)
- Hanger: Used to transport the support craft (i.e. earthling cruiser)
- Hightail HyperDrive: Because if we are weak to start with, we might wanna run away when we are outgunned in Melee.
- Dampen Drive : Reduces your hyperspace signature in so you don't attract as much attention.
- ECM: Reduces your signature in real space
- Fusion Forge: Convert unwanted resources into Fuel.  Useful for long haul trips (but its a more expensive method)

Super Melee:
> Defensive Modules (Passive)
- Shields (adds X number of HP that need to be destroyed before you loose crew)
- Point Defence Drones.  As mentioned earlier, Drones that orbit the ship shooting at anything.

> Weapon Modules & Special Abilities: I had a list, but when I looked at it, all I was doing was pulling ideas from SC2 that dont look like they are currently on any ships in SC:O

Another considerations:  Some modules can come in different sizes.
- Small = 1 Slot
- Medium = 2 Slots
- Large = 3 Slots
- Titan = 6 Slots

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How many world environments are needed?
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I quite enjoyed exploring planets in SC2 but was disappointed that there was not more precursor artefacts around the system.

As mentioned several times before, I agree that we need more planet types, especially if you can make some enormous galaxies.  I would be more than happy to settle for a simple re-skin and randomisation of greebling.  A new planet type, does not have to come with a new "feature" or "hazard"

In addition to the Easy worlds:
As mentioned earlier, it would help the variety of planets if the Desert planet could be turned into an ice planet by changing the colour and adding a few icicles here and there. (Just watch out for the occasional Cryovolcanoes - think Saturns moon Enceladus)

For the Medium Worlds:
Again as mentioned earlier, I think there needs to be a middle ground for any planets that are in the circumstellar habitable zone (CHZ)  These "Bio World" would is lush jungle / trees etc.  Fairly much guaranteed location to collect your carbon based alien lifeforms (some more hostile than others)

The ships in game.
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I must have missed the memo, but I am getting a Ur-Quan / Kohr-Ah vibe from the Skryve & Xraki ships

Mukay Rig
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Its probably just me, I understand that the second screen (with the circular object on it) is suppose to be behind the Mukay, but to me it doesn't look like its in the background.

There's no detail. It's all WIP in 3D and 3D WIP looks like shit until it's 100% done. Sometimes it still looks like shit when 100% done.

Quoting Darkstar076, reply 63

I must have missed the memo, but I am getting a Ur-Quan / Kohr-Ah vibe from the Skryve & Xraki ships 

 

The only problem with it is that they are 2 completely different races...

It also is in the original Elite - FUEL SCOOP. Where you fly close to the star and refuel your ship. I totally want this thing in the game for following reasons:

• If somebody (like me) wants to make a gi-hugic sector of 10000 stars and a campaign with no supply base, where you just fly forward from one end of the map to another and do quests and stuff, this thing is a must to have, since there's no other means of refueling. Yes, you can turn resources into fuel, but it'd become too tedious and if you're stranded in a star system without planets, you're screwed.
• Even in the original campaign when I'm over the midpoint of it, I don't wanna return to base for fuel. That'd be a total waste of time and major fun killer. I just wanna be able to fly to a star, swerve around it couple of times and be on my way.
• Make it fairly hard to get. Ex.: Need a list of special resources and couple rare components or something. Can't just find it on a planet.

Yup. And while I wouldn't mind some improvement on it, I wouldn't want to see the majority of development time/effort go toward fixing something that wasn't necessarily broken. That's what's happening now.

Boondoggle.

^ Lipsynced 3D aliens is a major boondoggle in my eyes too. And they still want to make 3D backgrounds!!! WHY??!!!

I also would like to reiterate the planet variety issue. Why not just start with "realistic" planets taking Sol System as an example.

We should have on game release:

1. Volcanic (Mercury) can be all shades of Red + Black/Gray

2. Acidic (Venus) all shades of Yellow + Swamp Green

3. Barren (Earth's Moon) 50 shades of Gray

4. Desert (Mars) all shades of Brown

5. Ice (Jupiter's Europa) all shades of Blue

6. Crystalline or Rainbow (cause need to have 6?)

Drop Rainbow or Crystalline world in favor of ice/snow/cold planet type and defo use recolor to fake variety.

Whoever on the team wants 9 planet types on release can start working overtime (assuming they're salary).

The space is lifeless and desolate place, I'll feel totally fine not having lush green and waterworld planets to explore in the original campaign.

Just because restructuring can mean scaling back does not mean that it is, planet diversity was scaled back, but at the same time debating how to deal with planet generation is a restructuring mechanism, and not scaling-back the planetary systems themselves. 

As for why this new system is beneficial? Well, it essentially takes the old system and puts it on a 3D globe, giving a better perspective of scale and better context for the planet you are dealing with. The old system it was hard to make out physical features or defining traits of the planet on the 2D mining screen. This new system not only brings in the potential of many new hazards, but it also gives a welcome change of pace and a "spiced-up" version of the old mechanic, taking advantage of new technologies and hardware. None of the problems you listed would be problems if this new planet system is properly executed, I described previously how a structured procedural generation makes it on-par with many hand-crafted planets, and as for the load delays I think you are severely underestimating the power of even semi-modern hardware and over-estimating the resource intensity of these planets. Initially, they may be buggy and laggy, but this is standard for any game early in its development cycle. As someone who has participated in the QA and development of several games I can assure you that none of them were free of lag and bug issues early on, even the games that were a continuation of a franchise and were using the same engine as the previous game. Again, you are considering the early performance implications as the indicator of the final game performance, and this is a unwise strategy, for we have not even received the Alpha of a game demonstration yet, let alone reaching the optimization process. 

Did you SEE the Mukay_rig movie?? Static 2d backgrounds looks weeeeeeiiiiiiird. 

Now if they would just ANIMATE the 2d backgrounds, that's another story.... (maybe more work than 3d?)

You're speaking my language, Think Tank. They can't go back to flat 2d plane planetary exploring. It'd be a joke. They can't/shouldn't do lifesize planets like NMS, it'd also be a joke and defeat the feel that you're actually successfully exploring large chunks of the galaxy - they need small, bite-sized planets like SCII, but updated graphically for the modern age.

I, for one, think it looks extraordinarily fun to zip around those bad boys, makes me feel like I'm in Star Control, and that I'll be able to check planets off as *Explored, which gives a very good sense of accomplishment. I love it. I love everything about it. The look, the weight, the feel of heft, the rapid exploration of an entire planet. It's unlike ANYTHING out there, these days, and it's sexy as heck (G-rated language for Awkbird). 

The only complaint I voiced was the lack of variety. But like I also said, and many agreed - the APPEARANCE of variety (cool idea for a black desert, Hunam!!!) is COMPLETELY 100% a working solution. Just model a few trees, and change the color on a planetwide scale and you're golden. Same with water (rivers, lakes, etc). Create multiple templates (but don't just randomly throw together a mishmash like NMS, make them coordinated) and it's a no-brainer. 

***EDIT: I just thought I'd mention this, since we're on the subject - no matter what, DO NOT make resources or Bio units RESPAWN, under any circumstances!!!!!! Checking off planets as *Explored* is a very important sense of accomplishment in the SC Universe.

In SC2 you also had the Melnorme who would help you out if you ran out of fuel.  So there must be another race / module / option that will be filling in that role as it would be a major fun killer to run out of fuel and have no way of getting more.

Hence the suggestion to have more than one way of obtaining fuel.  I like the idea of the fuel scoop, however instead of the star, how about a gas giant. (at least they would be useful then)

As for the eventuality of running out of fuel and reaching a star system that has no planets.  I would chalk that up to the whole risk reward thing.  As then you would use a "distress beacon" as your last recourse and hope that the first alien group that respond give you fuel rather than alerting some pirates..

I never liked this mechanic. I like self-reliance in life and games. I play my Fallout 4 on survival without any retarded companions.

I know it'll never make it into this MODERN game, but I LOVED how if you ran out of fuel in Star Control II, without a Giant star in range... and you hadn't saved in 8 hours? Sorry, bub! No distress beacon in sight!!

Games are missing that, these days. No one likes to fail anymore! I watch my son play one of many older games I love, like the original Fallout or SCII or SimCity 2k... if he dies one time, and has to reload? "Can I play something else?" it's like, bred into kids these days. Everything's gotta be all Call of Duty - hit by 11 bullets - takes a 3 second breather, and ready-to-go and get hit by 11 bullets again!! Even if you die, you go back about 7-14 seconds total. I hate that crap. Star Control II? If you ran out of fuel? You better have had a save when you were still in range. If not? Tough luck, and you better believe next time you'll save more often!!!

I know what this game's gonna be like, though. Modern audiences demand leniency - unless you're specifically playing a game BECAUSE of its difficulty (which, I'm sure we're not when we play SC:O). If the whole purpose is break-neck difficulty, that type of thing is acceptable, like Dark Souls. But in a game like this, no one will want to 

What if you left 2 (Or 1 if the species is Asexual) on a planet and they repopulated? 

Okay, now THAT would be excellent. I'd accept that. But if I come back 12 days later and find a respawned gold deposit? NO!

Besides, I don't think you're going to include respawned ore (or even bio) because then you wouldn't HAVE to explore past the first good resource-rich planet you find! Defeats the whole purpose, right?

^ Nah, he's just pulling our leg.

Darn it Vaelzad! I was just about to produce and elaborate and detailed response describing the idea of having creature and resource reproduction by not harvesting every bit! Now I have to scuttle it, scuttle it all!

Biological life forms should re-spawn relatively quickly, but metal and resource generation should be slower (like one or two game years? Maybe the order of resource reproduction could be dependent on the material's value)