jecy99

Drengin broken?

Drengin broken?

 

I have played a bunch of games with these guys now..  they rarely get over a couple planets, and for all intensive purposes, never amount to anything. Is it just a total luck of the draw why these guys have been doing not so well or is there more to it? I have found both them and another evil race, to be not all that tough, and i typically spend most of my time trading, and helping them.. just so i can slow some other races down..  the drath, torrians, and iconions, all seem to be doing better more consistently.  the Yor, and that big harry beast looking guy, also don't seem to last long..  

 

just curious what gives, is this luck of the draw? or something more?

 

I will most likely try a mod down the road, but i still want to get to know the races a bit more first..

50,933 views 45 replies
Reply #26 Top

The thing is, the AI isn't always particularly savvy about technology trading.  They may not realise that the benefits of those new techs are soon turned against them.

I also like playing with tech trading off because I then have to do all my own research, and so does everyone else for that matter.

By the way, it's not just races that you play that will get a .raceconfigxml file, if you customise any of your opponents then a file is automatically saved for them too.  Yes, backup or clear races from the folder before you switch mods. :)

You can totally make your own version of a mod, although I suggest you copy and rename the mod folder before you go fiddling - for sanity's sake and so you have a copy of the original files handy to look at.

 

Reply #27 Top

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
BTW, did you see in the new PC gamer interview where Modder's Head's are going to explode by the tool system they are releasing?

Yes, I did.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
I thought i would warn you, if your head explodes who will marvin have to compete with for best mod?

To be honest, I really hope, that I won't need to mod GalCiv 3. I only began modding GalCiv 2, because some bugs kept annoying me. One of them has been known since the release of DL, while the rest was added in the TotA beta. None of them has been fixed in the vanilla game.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
Btw, If i wan't to try your mod, or marvin's, Do i just install it like i did that APT1?  then go to the options/mods and click on Default, or APT1, or what ever your mods called?   then just back up/remove any race XLM that i played, that is in my documents folder and i'm good to go?  (i'm only playing alterians to this point in time so there will be only one anyway)

Yes, that's all. The only exception is, if you want to play the fixed campaigns in my mod. They require you to install them directly into the campaign folder of the game, because they don't work inside the mod folder. However, I provided instructions on where you need to put them, in the main post of my mod, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
Though i am wondering i naybe i could make my own version of the APT1 mod?

Absolutely. However, like MarvinKosh said, make a backup of the mod first. It's safer that way.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
Would it be possible for me to  Change how range and life support work in that mod, Along with changing the minors..

Sure, though changing the range requires a workaround, because we cannot modify it directly.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
I would really like to use that script i read about that  Minor's can work like powered up single planet races, Or act like Normal races.

That requires editing the RaceConfig.xml. There are two things you can do:

1. Change the <AIPersonality> tag of each Minor race from 3 to 11. This will assign the AI of a Major race to them, which is able to colonise planets.
This change doesn't work automatically, however. At the start of the game, the Minors will still be assigned their old AI. You need to save and re-load in order for the Minors to get their new AI.

2. Add the following tags to each Minor race:

<AIAbilities>100</AIAbilities>
<Aggression>50</Aggression>
<FinancialResources>100</FinancialResources>
<CPUUsage>100</CPUUsage>

This change will make the Minors smart. It also works automatically, so no need for the re-load trick, if you only use this.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
And is that random by default?

No, it depends on the changes. If you just won't the Minors to be able to colonise, then only change their AI. If you just want them to be smart, then only add the tags. If you want both, then do both changes.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
Can you set minors to the AI scripts you want?  Like say set one to use AI 11?

Definitely.

Quoting jecy99, reply 25
Range i would like to decrease the range of all ships, I think i would like to try 65% to start,  I also wan't to cut the range of life support in half.   and keep size and build time the same.  I really wan't to try to increase the importants of Life support..

Editing the Life Support modules is easy. You can find them in the file GC2Types.xml. The tag you need to change is called <Range>.

As I said, we cannot change the base range of ships directly, because it is hardcoded. The easiest workaround is to apply a penalty to the Range ability of all races. For this, you need to edit the <RANGE> tag in the RaceConfig.xml. Set it to the negative value you want. For example, if you want the range be only at 65% strength at the start of the game, then set the value to -35.

Reply #28 Top

 

Oh sweet, I am so doing this for my next game! Hmm maybe i will just do a little editing and start a new game..  It is a rainy Friday and i got nothing better to do.

 

Ok, i think i get it. Basically i need to manually make each minor the way i want it, so i can really make a mix of many types.

 

So basically i should just make a duplicate AP1 folder,  and play in that one..  basically Ap1_my_tweaks

 

(i renamed it JCT10,   the name of at the bottom of the bar, still says  APT1.3,  Is there some sort of other thing i need to change this?  I don't wan't to get confused when loading things is all.)

 

 

 

 

Reply #29 Top

FYI,  the Range value is different than what you thought.  I played with it a bit, and 

 

-300, is basically 9 squares, your planet in the center square, then the square around you.

It looks like -50 is One square..  I think i will set minors as -300, and then the rest of us at -200. see how that goes for now.  It might really give people that are off and alone a big disadvantage though.. but i guess as it should right?  at least in my mind. 

 

 

*edit,  The I need to change the values on life support, and i think i want to change the weight a lot too.  basically i want it so, if you use a tiny ship, and want longer range, it is basically going to fill the whole ship.  Then as you go up to better life supports, the weight does not drop, but the range increases.   Only the larger ships, with minaturization will be able to squeeze in multiple later.  though cargo ships could go with 2+ a module, to get more range.


I think this might work well, as long as the AI can use it. I wonder how the AI will perceive better Life supports to increase their range. I am just not at all familiar with how the AI builds ships. 

Reply #30 Top

 

all right.. after playing with Life-support for hours..  I am defiantly having issues getting it to work the way i want.  If i use the negative number,  you really have to crank it up to shorten the base planet range. -150 to see a decent distance, -200-300, to really shorten it up.  -300 is basically the starter culture border you start with.

 

But if i change those numbers to the high numbers, i run into a secondary problem. To get life support to increase range, you must start off with basic being +25..  going up to +60 get's you back to a little farther than base range..  So playing with the numbers might get me to where i want, as long as you only can mount 1 life support.

When you double the life support modules, something odd happens.  There has to be hidden numbers i am not seeing, with the negative integer.   Because when you stack 2 modules, say two +20's,  You will get more range than a single +40.

 

the other thing is, when you get to the larger range modules, and stacking them, you are no longer just adding the % life stated in the description, you are doubling giant ranges..

 

Perhaps i have to rethink my whole strategy on this, and use much lower values..  But at the same time i have to wonder if there is a way to restrict a ship to a single life support module.  Any thoughts on this? or do i just need to keep playing with the range numbers, and perhaps use weight as the main restriction. 


The one issue i am seeing with using weight, is there could be a secondary effect that you may run into issues with far off oppenets and using the Very heavy life support just to get there, if the home base team will just have to much advantage.  aka not using half the ship for life support, and being able to stack tons more weapons?

I can see how making a mod could suck away months of your life, and all i want to do is play with range a bit.. :P

 

 

Any thoughts on what i might be able to try next?  Perhaps i should go back to stacking more life support units at lower values.. go up a level now you can add 2, another level, add 3, another level you now have 4.. ect..  verse trying to use a single one

Reply #31 Top

The only way to severely restrict life support modules would be to vastly increase the size and/or cost.

You could also make their availability very limited - for example, get rid of all but one module and have that one on the last life support tech.

Reply #32 Top

 

I found these scripts in the other main races files..

 

<AIAbilities>100</AIAbilities>
<Aggression>50</Aggression>
<FinancialResources>100</FinancialResources>
<CPUUsage>100</CPUUsage>


But there is a difference, Every main AI,  has  AIAbilities set to 50,  CPUUsage is set to 0..   Why is this set differently on these verse the others?

 

Is it because they are set to AI 5?   I just don't understand how this effects things..

 

 

I also took a different route on life support..  I did a smaller -30 on everyone,  then i lowered the range a few ticks on each level..  the 5 levels would extend the range a full sector, each one goes like 20%.  I also raised the size to 5, for the first 2, then 4,3,2 for the next levels..  the idea being, as you invest to the upper levels, the ranges end up becoming almost what they are now.. But have to build their over time.   the early game reduction is now about a full 2 sectors, which is decent i think.  gonna give this a play and see how it is.

Reply #33 Top

Quoting jecy99, reply 32
But there is a difference, Every main AI,  has  AIAbilities set to 50,  CPUUsage is set to 0..   Why is this set differently on these verse the others?

Those are the standard settings for the Major races. They change, depending on what difficulty level you play on, and if you have "Force AI To Use Max CPU" active in the Options. I don't know, if the difficulty slider has any effect on Minor races, so I've set their values to the ones for Tough difficulty.

Quoting jecy99, reply 32
I just don't understand how this effects things..

AIAbilities determines what algorithms the AI uses. The higher the value, the better the algorithms. 100 is the max.

CPUUsage does exactly as it sounds. It determines how much CPU resources the AI is allowed to use for its calculations. Again, more is better, and 100 is the max.

Reply #34 Top

ok.. thanks for the info

Reply #35 Top

A quick update..

 

I got my life support modded up,  first two levels are 5, this lets you put 2+ sensor in your first scout ship. this let's you get about 3.5 sectors away from a planet.  I also upgraded the minors. I did a bunch of life support only testing this weekend, now i am giving the first real game a shot.  I'll let you know how it works out.   

Reply #36 Top

ok,  One thing i am wondering... The AI,  and the need to research lifesupport.

 

How do they decide that they need it? does the AI know that they have less range and might be more apt to research it?  Granted this is my first play through so i'm not sure how well they are playing with the changes.  I have noticed a few races, Terrans being one which are typically great expanders, being stuck with just a few planets.   

 

It could be the type of galaxy, and getting stuck in a bad spot..  (tight clusters)  I think next time i will try one that is more even..  

 

I do wonder if there is a way i can increase the AI need to research life support.   

 

I may also try going to cut the range down to -15, as well..  need to test more..  for me personally the range works great, I just wonder if it is hampering the AI..   


Ironically, the Drengin on this map are kicking but, and have 10 planets, i have 12.. so are keeping right up.

Reply #37 Top

Quoting jecy99, reply 36
I do wonder if there is a way i can increase the AI need to research life support.

You need to edit the TechTree.xml for that. Find the Life Support techs, and increase the value of the <AIValue> tag.

Finding the right value for this, however, is going to take some time. Even more so, as you need to make sure, that the AI has all the prerequisite techs too.

Reply #38 Top

 Yep. I'm not sure how far ahead in the tech tree the AI looks, but if your range tech is behind a tech that the AI doesn't value much, then it may not get researched.

Reply #39 Top

 

Ok, i looked through that tech tree thing,  It is hard to tell, but it seems like there is just one tech tree? I am not sure how the different AI's and different tech tree's work..

 

I did see those values, and life support read 15 or started at that i think, maybe 14.. anyways, they do change a bit, like go up by 1 or 2 on a level.

I was also looking at  other techs, and they had similar numbers.  I wonder, would just adding a point or 2 make it a decent bit more valuable?   Life support has artificial gravity,  then Logistics 1, which is a pretty good tech.

anyways, I wonder how much the AI will recognize the need to use the Life-support techs, to increase range..

 

another thing i did not think about was space stations. How much does the AI use space stations to increase ship range?

 

 

Another thought i had, was what if i increased the time it takes to create a colony ship.. I am guessing i can do that by greatly increasing the colony module build time.   I was thinking what if it took 3-4 times as long, that might really slow down expansion, giving the need to build military as you go, and slowly expand over time.   or at least slow the initial splat a while. because untill you had a factory planet going, they would be pretty slow to build. 

 

Have either of you played with slowing the rush down?

Reply #40 Top

Quoting jecy99, reply 39
Ok, i looked through that tech tree thing,  It is hard to tell, but it seems like there is just one tech tree? I am not sure how the different AI's and different tech tree's work..

The TechTree.xml is the main file where most of the techs are. The individual tech trees of the races are in the TechTrees folder.

When editing the TechTree.xml, keep in mind, that changes in the racial tech trees take priority.

Quoting jecy99, reply 39
I wonder, would just adding a point or 2 make it a decent bit more valuable?

Sorry, can't help you there. Only testing can answer this.

Quoting jecy99, reply 39
another thing i did not think about was space stations. How much does the AI use space stations to increase ship range?

It does use them quite often in my tests, but not always as good as I hope.

In my current test game, for example, the Drengin started out with access to only their home-system. No other habitable worlds in range. They've built some stations since then, but only in their home-system for some reason.
The Terrans, on the other hand, are doing quite well. They have 20 colonies and are currently building influencer spacestations in my territory to increase their range.

Quoting jecy99, reply 39
Have either of you played with slowing the rush down?

I haven't, because I think it's fine as it is. However, I believe MarvinKosh is currently working on that.

Reply #41 Top

Quoting jecy99, reply 39
Have either of you played with slowing the rush down?

  I suggest you only slow it down at lower difficulty levels.  I agree it is fine as it is;  it is possible to "win" this rush.

Reply #42 Top

I increased the colony module build cost to 100 without any adverse effects, other than the fact that of course, it takes a little longer to build colony ships.

Reply #43 Top

Ok, the more i play with the Race Range reduction, the more i think it is holding back races from expanding..   I think i need to rethink this..   I saw someone mention something about removing basic life support..  I wonder how you would do this?   Set range to zero?  delete the entry?  Not really sure

Reply #44 Top

You'd either need to delete the entry, or disable it by commenting it out. To do the latter, place the entry within this: <!-- -->. It should look like this in the end:

 <!--<LifeSupport Name="BasicSupport">
<DisplayName>Basic Support</DisplayName>
<Description>Extends the range of our ships.</Description>
<Cost>2</Cost>
<Size>2</Size>
<SizeMod>5</SizeMod>
<Range>6</Range>
<Category>Support</Category>
<Thumbnail>Support</Thumbnail>
<Model>Support0</Model>
 </LifeSupport>-->

No matter which option you choose, you need to edit the ship designs too, or neither you, nor the AI, will be able to build the starting ships. You can find all ship designs in the GC2Ships.xml, under Twilight\Data\English.

Reply #45 Top

cool thanks man..  I think i might give this a try