RTS Mission: Pride of Endoria

The impossible Reboot ship mission

I didn't have any monumental challenges with Mauna Roa.  That said, Pride of Endoria has me completely stumped.  I can't forsee this actually being winnable by the human because there are many wonky spots on the ship where, despite completely clear line of site, the AI won't fire until until directly adjacent to another unit.  Essentially this means your robots won't defend themselves unless you make them fire manually, or move them around so they will "notice" enemy units in plain site.

This is the mission where you defend a ship at sea called the Pride of Endoria, with Keller docked to you from another ship near the bow, and Blazer quickly overruning Terron across your stern.

Has anyone finished this mission?

1,541 views 14 replies
Reply #1 Top

Well, I finally beat it, although I had to resort to the Titanium alloy offer.  After that it's actually pretty straightforward.  If you don't get rushed by a rogue Terron fleeing from his base while you cap off the Kelleroids it's just a matter of strafing back and forth whenever your guys are fighting.  The extra alloy makes the difference between losing the intial fight for the bow, and afterwards makes your army unstoppable.

I did have a hiccup where it took me so long to capture the Keller base that Blazer captured Terron and my own base, but the Keller base is actually the easiest to defend and the yellow one is a death trap.  I just absorbed the Blazer troops rushing the bow near the resource nodes with two bots (1x repair, 2x launchers, 1x spitfire) while building and sending three more up the stairs on the south ramp.  Once Blazer started attacking those three I moved the other two up and recapped my base.

Reply #2 Top

Thank you for posting a strategy right after solving this mission! Personally I had completely given up on this map, but then I *do* have monumental challenges even with Mauna Roa. There was already a topic  dedicated to this particular map, although no winning strategies were coming forth.

The phenomenon of a stationary robot which should have a clear shot at a nearby attacker but doesn't fire I have observed on at least one other map, "Lyakusha's Residence" it is called, if I am not mistaken (something with "Lyakusha" in it, anyway, available on Peleng planets). In some cases, this 'not firing' can be attributed to another nearby robot blocking the shot which can happen in not so obvious ways.

But on "Lyakusha's Residence" it happens all the time with bots in completely isolated positions. I left this map unfinished, disgusted by this feature. It just seems impossible to build a static defensive position incorporating the turrets around your starting base, since many or most good places seem bugged in this way. Apart from that, said map shouldn't be nearly as difficult as the ship.

Reply #3 Top

I'm playing this game again, and this time I beat this map in the second attempt! That still had me almost howling in frustration, although I generally like the RTS portion of the game.

I was using the extra armor, and even when I succeeded, it was at times a very close affair. Much of that may be due to the problems imposed by the very sluggish controls and my inefficient (for this map at least) way of using them.

My usual strategy is building defensive positions except in the direction where I intend to expand. In this turtling I use dedicated attack/launcher robots with dedicated healers posted behind. This map is too cramped, however, for the robots used in the above strategy to work in the initial rush for the Keller base.

First Failure

This was the first time I experimented with jack-of-all-trades robots that have one repairer module. I also used, besides two launchers (in my first, failed attempt alternated with two plasma), one spitfire on most. These are very effective in the confined areas here.

My first attempt at the map still failed, probably because of several little things. One, I had alternated the heads of my robots between Locator, Firewall and maybe Dynamo, too. Keller uses Stunners often in this map, and my first two robots did get stunned and died without accomplishing much. In my second go I used Firewall heads exclusively on all my rushers.

Two, I am no good at keeping my robots moving in a fight. At least not when I at the same time need to send reinforcements for those that are inevitably going to die.

Three, I think I used Stunners on several of my robots. That proved disastrous later, see below. Also, I am not certain of this, but Keller probably uses Firewall on most of his initial bots as well.

Four, I manually tried to set my robots to capture the Keller base. For reasons unknown to me, this order often doesn't stick. Especially when I have a group selected and set them to capture the base, the game seems to give this order only to one of them and sets the rest to maybe take positions around that base. Can there possibly be only one robot that is manually set to capture a given base or factory? Anyway, at times I had my robots milling in the front of the Keller base uselessly, slowly being ground down.

When they eventually took the base, it was one robot from the very back moving forth. My trys to set the robot closest to capture this base were unheeded, probably because that one from the back already had that order. So I got the base, but I had already lost. My resources had run dry because of the makeup of my robots, Blazer had taken my initial base and was already coming at my back. I couldn't build any healers because too liberal use of Stunners had left me short in the critical resource. And I had made the mistake of ordering two defense turrets on the newly captured base.  These blocked the building queue for too long, anyway.

Second Attempt: The battle for Keller's base

Some of the mistakes I had made above went into the strategies for my next try: I was very sensitive about the resources used in the build of my robots. I think I used Firewall, two Launchers, Spitfire and Repair exclusively for the first ten. Accidentally I took the slow tracks for propulsion, but whether these hindered or helped (they offer the highest hit point bonus, after all) I cannot tell in hindsight. When again the disaster of the milling robots in front of the Keller base was unfolding, I finally had the brilliant idea of activating the capturing program. This time I got the base quickly!

But I wasn't even half there, yet, the really frustrating parts were still to come!

Defending the central Base

Blazer had capped the Terron base at about the same time and his rush to my base was building. I managed to weather this rush well enough but not without some difficulty: One problem I always have in tight-run situations is with getting freshly built robots to do what I want. I have the impression that I sometimes need to babysit them every step of the way, their target selection in close confines (in this particular case down the ramp from my base) seems at times completely nuts. I had switched my robot building strategy back to the mix of dedicated healers and attack bots. That proved fruitful in the clump that built on the ramp to my base where my attack bots where locked in the press of Blazer's.

The survivors of the battle at Keller's base were coming back (slowly) at the same time. I intended them to cover the sidewalks from the stern of the ship. For some reason that did not work at all. At least one should have a clear shot alongside the railing on each side. Maybe my mistake was trying to cram two on each side and they hindered each other somehow, I don't know. I then brought them into the fight by ordering them closer to the mouths of the ramps to the central base. There they did fire but were slaughtered quickly.

The Battle for the Foredeck

Anyway, after weathering the initial rush, I tried to get on the offensive and ordered my bots to build short lines on each side where the sidewalks meet the foredeck. Bolstering  three (I hoped, but only two would fit) launcher bots with three (I hoped) healers should be enough to hold these positions until the situation had stabilized. This plan backfired severely. These positions are too close to the defense turrets of the factories on the foredeck. Two bots with healers behind have no problem withstanding such turrets  and keeping them down as they get rebuilt, but only when not pressed by enemy bots at the same time. In addition to that, severe line-of-sight problems were hitting with the positions I tried my bots to hold. Sometimes one of them wasn't firing at all.

I was losing bots at an alarming rate and struggling to send in reinforcements quickly enough, while at the same time trying to fix those apparent line-of-sight problems by moving my bots around. I never got enough healers to the front to keep my launcher bots alive where Blazer was keeping the press up. And of course, my reinforcements tended to block themselves on their way to the front, then getting in the way of whatever survivors were still at the place where they should take position, dancing a frustrating, evil dance. So I found myself in a deteriorating situation with resources slowly but steadily running out (that overuse of the tracks propulsion system at the beginning came back at me since the corresponding resource became the scarcest), and what I kept building was mostly dictated by the materials I had left. I could only afford quad Launchers where I would have loved to throw in Stunners. Yet, had I made much use of them, I couldn't have afforded to replace my healers which were also dying all around.

Blazer had shifted his pressure, which came at the start of our battle from both his bases, to just one side after a time. I think he was beginning to run short in resources as well. On the side where Blazer kept attacking my position collapsed, and he was going for my central base again. On the other side I could stabilize enough to not be bothered by the periodically rebuilt turret. But I had trouble stemming Blazer's dash at my base. What turned out to work was manually selecting each target for my fresh attack bots coming down from my base. I was losing a couple of them, But Blazer was losing more. I managed to throw in a healer now and then, which in turn kept my attackers alive longer at first, then alive indefinitely when I finally found a defensible postion:

To Victory

So this is where the tide turned: At the base of the ramp from my central base I could position two bots so that they had a clear shot along the railing. I had to place them one  behind and slightly to the side of the other, which was enough to not obstruct the hind robot's view too much. Eventually three dedicated healers further behind kept them alive. Two probably would have been enough. The makeup of the attack bots was: 2 Plasma, Stunner(! extremely valuable here), Spitfire at the fore and a 4 Launcher bot behind. Both where with Firewall heads, Mortar and on Wheels, IIRC. Now Keller was bashing his head in against this position and I had a free hand on the other side of the ship.

From here on it was just mopping up. I built another healer and a mixed bag of attackers with some Stunners until reaching my robot cap, then took on the base where Blazer wasn't building bots ... describing it would be really boring...

Conclusion

I have no idea whether the defensive position at the mouth of the ramps from the central base is in some way key to succeed in the semi-turtling I was trying to do here. After all, I had the impression that at the time I was having success with this, Blazer had reached the point where his robot rush was toned down due to lack of resources. The bases on this map produce recources extremely fast, but not fast enough to build top of the line fullstack bots constantly.

It is clear that this map is designed to not tolerate turtling strategies well or at all (despite what other's may say, turtling can still be an  effective strategy on many of the RTS maps, maybe not the best, but it offers a relaxed way of playing this sub-game). My problem is that I am just no good at the alternative, rushing effectively myself. Maybe the automated combat programs have some merits here. This is certainly true for the capturing program when one is on the rush at Keller's base. I had been avoiding these programs like the plague after some misadventures on easier maps, and I didn't try attack or defense programs here at all.

Reply #4 Top

Does anyone beat this without the titanium alloy? I just ran into this mission and tried it at least 20 or more times doing different things (without titanium or reinforcements) and I think it's impossible for all but an RTS world champion. I can't manage to control my bots in the tight confines, and they can't get LoS on anything unless I move them, and moving them sends them spinning in circles going nowhere. There's not enough resources to reinforce a rush, and the only really defendable spot is the Red base... which I can't successfully rush.

 

If the map had been balance so that Red and Yellow would fight to a standstill, you could just take Blue and wait for an opening to grab the foredeck and get some turrets up... but even if I get lucky and my bots don't go running all over the place and I take the Blue base out, the Yellow base is at best in it's last 30 seconds, and at worst, Red has already gone after my central base.

Reply #5 Top

After writing my above piece I found the following source of downloadable materials for SR2:

Link

In the videos directory is one for the Pride of Endoria mission, among other interesting RTS maps. But all of the videos are some record speed runs of the respective maps, and the style of play used (probably by Malodarom, he posted the link on a another forum with only a tiny English language corner - scroll to the bottom of the page) is completely unreplicable by me, so I find little actual help in them. Of course, I don't know if these were played with extra armor, but probably not.

It is interesting that the player there seems to only ever use the Dynamo heads for his robots, if I am not mistaken.

What he succeeds at is excatly that which I tried many times without any gain towards Keller's base before: Build two or three kinds of specialized robots, dedicated healers among them, create a defensive line towards the bridge and hope that the healers heal faster than the front line bots receive damage. If you've consolidated (I never got that far), rush in to take the base. The extra speed awarded by Dynamo heads may be key in setting up the initial position.

 Edit:

This map is at least fit for speedy failure and retry cycles. In very few minutes you'll know whether you've failed or not. By now I am through almost all of the maps in the game, and Pride of Endoria (or 'Landing' from the planetary battles menu) must be among the three hardest.

The other two are Antenna and Module.

Module is the worst of these for me. Module has an untypical, highly damaging Laser device in the middle that itself cannot be damaged and has four factory-like (but otherwise not giving resources) control points around which you can take, so a portion of the central device doesn't target your robots. Apart from that there are just bases for all four factions around, and very few factories, two each in your and Blazer's area. The factions can only get at each other through that central area, and Blazer is the only serious opposition.

The interesting bit is that I actually won two Module missions in a row because those runs were glitched. Sometimes Blazer gets stuck and doesn't participate in the battle for the center. In that case you can just sit, letting resources build - starting resources are extremely low and it takes time to get a number of good bots built - and then take the other two bases at your leisure. Engage Blazer last, and beware, he'll get unstuck then and will have a huge pile of resources for a very extended rush. But when Blazer isn't stuck and goes for the middle, he'll eventually take that over and that is game over for me.

The hair-pulling part of it is, it takes a fair amount of time to reach the point of make or break, if you take advantage of a prominent position where you can engage in the battle for the center without putting yourself at much risk. This can be done by piloting an Antigrav/Launcher/Locator bot from the top of the rise to the right of the starting base. By taking selectively Blazer's incursors out, a complete takeover of the central area by him can be delayed, maybe prevented by one more skillful than me. Do this until you have enough resources to build a full complement of robots for a rush, and then try your best.

But the map seemingly screws the player very hard because of massive line-of-sight issues around the central area when your bots stay put - it is rather similar to the Pride of Endoria mission, only much, much worse. I several times reached the point where I had taken out Keller and Terron but just couldn't control the battle with Blazer in the center because of these issues.

Antenna I just won once at my first try through sheer luck, all other factions partying among themselves, and later after many failures once through a different glitch - one enemy bot got stuck, and the whole AI faction, the only other left, froze as a result. I happened to destroy that stuck robot last, didn't know what had caused my luck until then.

Reply #6 Top

ice find on the videos. I have a hell of time finding anything SR2 related, and there are a lot of files there I'm downloading and taking a look at. Hopefully they are mostly english. I'm grabbing the Endoria vid right now, it's probably just a successfull version of something I've tried as well :).

Yeah, just watched it... he's slick. That's what I would call a competitive RTS player. It's basically the same way I won with the Titanium bonus, only executed faster and in real time (I have to pause constantly). He got a few things going that I just couldn't manuver my robots into doing though, like getting the two rocket guards at the top of the norther ramp... I could only get one, and eventually got a 2nd one along the railing all the way to the east to support him, if a little late. He also very quickly jumps into a bot that one time to fire over the railing at the would be capturer, something I could never do in such a rush.

If that map editor in the files section works, I may just try to add a turret along the north and south ramps to help hold the mid-aft deck... it's just ridicuilous IMHO.

 

Reply #7 Top

Hey, you dug out a post with the link on this forum that I missed!

Hopefully they are mostly english.

I checked through much of that material, and no, sorry. Most is in Russian. I found Google translation on some Russian resource useful, but for the material in that package, I'm sifting through it at home without internet connection, and I am somewhat reluctant to install unicode fonts for that machine which without access to a translator wouldn't be so helpful, anyway.

Btw: had I grown up just 100 km farther east, my second language at school would've been Russian instead of English. :D

He also very quickly jumps into a bot that one time to fire over the railing at the would be capturer, something I could never do in such a rush.

Yes, I couldn't do it either, partly because my machine usually doesn't allow it. For some reason my computer runs at the start of a map and the first few times when I jump into a robot to pilot it very choppy, freezing for seconds. It got worse after I upgraded my graphics card, but I have an old AGP system and those are sometimes only half-compatible with the few cards that are still manufactured.

I am wondering, if the RTS stuff is programmed in a way that these ugly line-of-sight issues could arise when a computer is running at its limit. Sort of, instead of dropping frames, it drops AI.

I've seen these issues crop up seemingly out of the blue on maps that are otherwise 'normal'. The Lyakusha's Residence I mentioned above isn't normal however. There seems an invisible (to us controlling humans) sight screen around the starting base, and then that map is full of ramps that somehow may produce these issues. Piloting a robot helps to overcome this problem, of course.

Reply #8 Top

I played some more on this mission (got it presented to me in a new game) without Titanium Alloy and trying to employ some of the tactics in Malodarom's videos. I was getting somewhere although I didn't make it.

The Dynamo head certainly helps when it comes to taking control of the stern of the ship before rushing Keller's base. When I collect my robots there, I am losing just one, at most two, although now and then one gets stunned. Maybe I should modify the construction of my robots a little bit and use Locator instead of Dynamo on the healers. The further reach would help in the rush on Keller's base, where I usually lose too many robots on the bridges and beyond, but the reduced rate of healing compared to Dynamo could make the battle before that more costly. 

Also, I do not know whether activating the capturing program helps any to get Keller's base quicker, like I claimed above. With or without, the bots do crazy and daft things in front of the base. It seems just chaotic and luck may play more of a role than anything else. I mean, luck and skillful maneuvering, the latter I have only a small capacity of.

Of maybe five attempts, the first was the most promising. I had all three healers and probably two attack bots left after capturing Keller's base. With some irritation I had to learn what LordChambers actually meant by this:

Quoting LordChambers, reply 1
If you don't get rushed by a rogue Terron fleeing from his base ...

Of course they don't flee, the bastards! And make that 'a sinking feeling', not just 'some irritation'.

The 'our base has been captured' hadn't really registered in the back of my head, and when I wanted to select my base to begin producing the defending force, I was surprised to find it green! Capturing it back worked well but not without losses and then I just blundered in not keeping my healers out of harm's way enough, which twarted my attempts to keep in the positive when it comes to losing fewer robots than I gain resources to produce new ones.

In all later attempts I was losing too many bots in my rush on Keller's base and took too long to capture it, if at all. I typically left one attack bot back at my base to defend against potential 'rogue Terrons'. This makes the push at Keller that much weaker, maybe too weak (but Malodarom does this in his video, too I am realizing).

At that point I reverted to a save before the mission. On another planet in the same liberated system I had 'Reactor', which is very relaxed by comparison. I am hoping to eventually beat Landing without Titanium Alloy just for the achievement shown in the robot battles menu, but it is hard and nerve-wracking enough, even with help.

Reply #9 Top

Did it.

In the beginning I started like Malodarom is demonstrating in his video and again lost just one or two robots while grouping them on the ship's stern.

This time I took special care in correcting the placement of my bots in my assault on Keller's base. Until now, I selected a big group and ordered them directly in front of the base, then frantically tried to get one or more of them to do the capture, with or without capturing program.

A thing I might have missed, and that I am not sure of even now, is that there might be issues with capturing a base that has still defense turrets left. Anyway, this time I just ordered my group to the outer reaches of the space before Keller's base, letting them clear away the turrets, keeping the healers close behind. Only when the turrets were destroyed, did I give the capture order to a single robot, and immediately started to move the rest of them back - just like in Malodarom's video.

Keller had ceased production, and there was no need to monitor the capturing process any further, much less cover it with fire support. Sometimes I have the impression that the AI just gives up once no robots are left and the base's defenses are cleared away.

During that, the success of the whole operation was helped tremendously by the fact that Terron resisted Blazer longer than usual. Blazer's rush didn't last very long, and the time for my own offensive had come when I no longer needed to replace four or five bots during or after each wave. On the play described in my very loquacious post above I tried my offensive in the very first lull of Blazer's press, effectively throwing my bots away.

ps: Maybe we should start similar topics for Module and Antenna maps :D . I don't have any helpful tips for either of those. Module is problematical in that one probably needs to play lots of missions in a game before it is presented. And IIRC, it is among last in the planetary battles menu, so it is difficult to unlock there. Consequently not many people will have played that one.

Reply #10 Top

According to the RTS list, I have beaten both Module and Antenna, though I don't recall which ones they were, so I m,ust ot have had too much trouble. The last one I had great trouble with was Big Crater. I think I won it mainly by luck after having tried it 8 or 9 times. Once I realized it was pointless to try and hold any position on that one, I just did what the AI does and rampaged producing bots and taking plants while letting my old ones get captured. A little luck, and better bots finally won me that one.

Reply #11 Top

What you are describing as 'Big Crater' sounds rather like Antenna to me. Or maybe I am mixing the names of the maps up O:) .

What I take for Antenna has four production bases without any defense turrets at the shore of a lake inside a crater (which has an island with said antenna in the center), and lots of factories with spots for turrets around the outer perimeter. All bases and factories are initially held by Terron (green) with small groups of incursors by you, Blazer and Keller near three of the bases. All factions are starting out with a huge pile of resources (~7000 in each category for teh human player), and that is the problem. I cannot keep up with the AI producing robots at full throttle and then sending them out effectively at the same time.

When I beat Antenna without being so lucky that the other factions worked off their resource piles while (mostly) ignoring me, it was the way you described, except that Blazer just froze when I was about to give up. Until then we had both worked our way clockwise around the lake from base to base - the other factions had perished quickly. I was at a disadvantage, because I had a hard time taking bases and the factories at the perimeter at the same time. The AI is just issuing orders more quickly than me.

'Big Crater' is covered in one of Malodarom's videos, just called 'Crater'. That is you vs. Terron (in the crater with lots of factories) and Blazer (near your starting base with no factories). In that one, the usual course of action is to withstand a little assault by Blazer from the side and a heavy assault by Terron at the same time, then take Blazer's base quickly.

Malodarom then built for a frontal assault on Terron, which takes skill and is quite difficult. I just turtle at a line before Terron's front door (so his assaults hit that line instead of him doing a sidestep to claim some formerly neutral factories in the direction of Blazer's base), then work towards his back door, taking more and more factories until I invade with that much more force.

Reply #12 Top

Big crater is the big round one with no defenses. I call it that because it the map is called bigcrater.cmap. It very well may be called antenna in the rts list. In none of my attempt did the AI ignore me. Every time Keller would amass a great army and sweep clockwise, while Blazer or Terron (which ever won the northern base) would sweep counter clockwise, sandwiching me. Since Keller was the real threat every time, I just abandoned my bases as I swept clockwise building more bots at the new factory and putting up turrets along the border as I went (because turrets slowed Keller down a little). It was a pause fest as I scrambled to get my bots to capture things and move on quickly enough, but it seems like one I captured Keller's starting base the AI kind of petered out. It might have run out of resources because it started producing bots nonstop once my forces got to the starting base, and I had to make nonstop launcher bots from the north base to reinforce.

There could be factors I'm not aware of, but so far, Keller is the dominant RTS force. Blazer is only a threat if it has superior resources and position (because its aggressive as hell). And Terron has never been more than a pest, and only dangerous if trying to pinch me between another AI. Keller makes the best bots and seems to amass them quite readily. I think his bots do more damage too, My tanks can often only take two shots (while my launchers have to land 3 against the enemies tougher bots) from his launcher bots. I usually need 3 healers just to hold a line. I can't tell you how many times Keller has unexpectedly stormed through a position I though was secured though.

Reply #13 Top

Quoting Karstedt, reply 12
Big crater is the big round one with no defenses. I call it that because it the map is called bigcrater.cmap.

Ah, true.

Antenna = BigCrater.cmap

Crater = Krater.cmap

In the original SR2, most maps were rather known by their cmap filenames, as the planetary battles menu didn't exist in its current form, and the old version, the ROBOTRUMBLE pseudo-cheat listed the maps by their filenames, if I understand it correctly. That's a source of some confusion. But how do you get exposed to the filenames in the Reboot expansion? I had to resort to a document from Malodarom's downloads to get these connections (you can still look them up in the SR2 install directory's cache folder, I guess).

Btw: I recollect playing one map that wasn't listed in the planetary battles menu. It otherwise isn't particularly difficult or noteworthy, though. Currently the counter on the main menu icon of planetary battles shows 43 of 47 played. I have one visible mission unplayed (Reality Show) and another finished only with Titanium Alloy (Lyakusha's Residence). Now I am wondering whether the total mission count is wrong or if there are other unlisted maps, and how many of them.

 

[late] edit:

Well... to make an educated guess in trying to answer my above question about the total number of playable missions: The document about Planetary Battle maps from Malodarom's downloads only lists a total of 45 maps. Most likely only maps that have been finished without Titanium Alloy or additional Reinforcements are counted as passed on the planetary battles icon.

The missing two maps are most likely the demos that are playing when the game is left for a few minutes at the main menu. There are two separate demoN.cmap files for these, and the counter just fails to account for them.

Reply #14 Top

hi i hope i didnt necro this post but i searched everywhere to find a solution for this mission for that reason i post my solution here so someone else can use it

 

solution to this mission is to capture the green base not blue let blue capture your factory (ofcource u should wait for red to destroy most of green units) then let blue and red fight each other untill they exust their resources

reason: green have list resources available red have most and blue have medium green have the best defensive position (red also have a good defensive position but its initial resources wont let u capture it) so u can easily defend with 3 healer bot and 4 missile bot sometimes u must use manual control