Hide opponents Type

There will be build orders?..

Maybe quick BO's for Generals, and if you have starting cash/skill choices.

I think it would be ok to have a "hide-faction" type of option in custom games, but in ranked it wouldn't make sense. You are fighting in an arena so you know your opposition

Not Necessarily Gnats3 if the Gods "Put" you into an arena you wouldn;t know your opponent until you met them on the field. Depending on the loading screen. I could see players not knowing their opponents in a ranked match until they see them. In custom games though you'd have to pick a character and everyone in the lobby would see that, unless like you said there was an option.


Besides the score screen in Supcom was always a little weird. Scathis did also say this:



I see not knowing your opponents type until you visually see him an extension of this philosophy

I just don't want my opponent to know what or who their facing unless they scout or I lay the smack down on them.

Hey all,

Thought I'd drop in for a quick comment.

If you choose 'Random' your opponents will not know which Demigod you are until they encounter you on the field of battle.

---

Mike "Tyo" Marr
Demigod Lead Designer

nice

I'll hide all game long so they never know

Never will I let you be on my team. Never...

I can just see TBO hiding behind the castle the entire game buying creeps... >.<

As an assassin... (thats a tongue twister)

Woot.

I think this should apply to anything - not just random. Just allow your own team to see who you are in lobby and the opposing team nothing. Then in game you don't know the opposition's demigods until encountering.

RapierX, why do you want to destroy the advantage random players have

Why should Randoms get an advantage?

Exactly, there should be absolutely no advantage for being rsndom. It should be a personal choice not a "I get the advantage of you not knowing what I am, but I know what you are so I can plan accordingly while you can't!" button.

because you have the disadvantage of getting a random demigod. Its a long tradition in RTS that you get something as reward for that : your opponent doesn't know what you are until he scouts you, supcom failed badly at this and as a result nobody played random.

Getting a random demigod isn't a disadvantage - it was your choice to random so deal with it. An inherent advantage should not be given to you for choosing random.

effectively you are eliminating random from competitive game then...

as a side note : random players are usually the most unbiased players when it comes to balancing and also lead to innovation in playstyles

I'm eliminating something because it's given an advantage that it shouldn't be given instead of being put on an even level with choosing a specific character? Aren't you pushing for more people to go random because they'd basically have an advantage of the opponent not knowing who they are until encounter? It should either be everyone is not known until seen, or everybody is known. No in-betweens.

Basically, the way I see it is this: in custom games, where you choose your demigod before hand, obviously the person going to random is going to know what the other people are, because he saw it in the battleroom before hand. For the others to not know the random faction until the random is scouted, makes sense.

For ranked, the idea that one person can see a demigod and the other can't, before either one has been scouted. I hated everything about the scoreboard in supcom, because it showed faction before hand, gave away bs info, etc. The way I see it, whatever in game player indicator Demigod has should be fairly similar to TA's: it shows the color and name of each player, and maybe some innocuous stat (in TA, it was kills/losses). That's it. So in automatch, no one would know what their opponent is until they encounter him on the battlefield.

Even then, random still gets that same advantage, just to a lesser degree. If I become a "top player" in Demigod, and it's well known that I use Sedna exclusively (much as it was well known that, say, Scyn used Seraphim exclusively), and you play random, you still have that same advantage, it's just not given away by the game.

Basically: I hate the idea that any info at all, whether I'm random or not, is given to my opponent in an automatch.

timmy, so the advantage is that I have to know all 14 matchups vs sedna and you have to know all 14 matchups with sedna vs other heroes - I don't see the advantage there. (14 is just a random number).

also I don't see why there should be any difference between custom- and auto-matches. Your view is inconsistent on that point.

So then if you don't see the advantage if you know the demigod being used, why insist on that "advantage" being there?

As I told you in IRC, that "inconsistency" is caused by me thinking in SupCom terms, where all players can see the faction chosen in the battleroom. As you mentioned, they could easily make it were you don't see what demigod is selected in a custom match.

The entire thread makes a big assumption, though. In principle, I can understand the want to not have any info available to anyone until visual contact.

But the assumption that everyone is making is that knowing the opposing demigod will make much of a difference in play style.

Until we know how the skills, items, etc are handled, that's a big assumption. Sure you could look at what we know of a Rook now (heals around friendly buildings, etc) and say well an enemy Rook is going to be defensive. But what if there's a skill build to turn it into an offensive juggernaut? Then knowing that your opponent is playing a Rook makes little difference, since you still don't really know what to expect.

So yes, while I would hop on to "don't give away metagaming info" bandwagon, I think it's a little early to argue about it before we know if it even makes any noticeable difference or not.

Timmyfred, as I said the advantage is mainly psychological, also my comment was only about that one point you mentioned.
Furthermore your "additional info for random players is unfair approach" assumes that Demigod will have a perfect balance were every random mix of 5 demigods will be as good as a picked and balanced Demigod Team. I would be very surprised if Demigod will end up that perfectly balanced.

Depending on how the game is actually structured, it can be. If Demigod is designed at the core to be synergized between the whole team (something like WiC for example, but hopefully not so religiously), if a team randoms they can get something that really doesn't work well together (all Assassins and no generals that just get overwhelmed by the enemy Generals' minions, or all healing Demigods that don't do enough damage to kill the enemy or push the front line, so on..). Even in not so extreme cases, it's easy for a random to end up with something that doesn't benefit the team as much as getting a certain specific Demigod would, probably.

Too many unknowns. Nobody actually knows how it plays

His name begins with a 'T' and uses two letters from 'you'

Yes, Tyo knows how it plays. But you notice that other than tell us that there's a "random" setting, he didn't actually say anything else. Thus, my point stands We don't know how it plays, and yet everyone is already arguing about it without knowing whether or not seeing opponents' demigods will make a predictable game or not. I mean, I know people are restless and anticipating the beta, and so they want to start talking about it already.. but some of these things are just silly at this point