Is Michael Moore "anit-American"

How his "documentaries" affect our Nation's standing in the world

from JoeUser Forums
Mr. Moore is among the growing number of Americans who trash our nation, our Military, and our Domestic and National Polices.
"Bowling for Colombine" was an interesting film and raised many serious questions that should be addresed but nevertheless it portrayed the majority of Americans as gun toteing, inherantly violent, and aboslutly ignorant and/or unwilling to change the status quo of our nation. This is greatly emphaised by my Japanese pen-pal writing to me asking if Mr. Moore's statement that "virtually every houshold in the United States owns a firearm." And his assertion that the vast majority of firearm owners take little or no action to safeguard thier weapons from children.

I can handle his opinions, I take them with a grain of salt, ( actually many, many grains) but his most recent film. "Farenhit 9/11" was completly over the top for me, especially as a soldier. To add insult to injury, upon his visits to foreign countries he continued to bash our country. Saying such things to the French of all people, that "we should have listend to them." and his comments go on and on and I feel no need to quote him further unless it is needed.

Under his illusion that he only wants to air out our nations flaws he is unquestionably among the most arrogent "anit-americans" that I have ever had the displeasure of hearing, seeing, or reading.

I am intrested to see how agrees with me and more importantly who does not, and why.
politics
27,298 views 56 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
Not a bad theme for an article but man... F7 is your friend!
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
"F7" sorry, ill check it out. damn greywar, I can't decide if i like you or not, I do respect you, because while you help me out you are somewhat sarcastic!! I love it. keep it up! hehe
Elemental: Reforged
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top

I can't decide if i like you or not


I admit freely that I was a complete dick to you on our first "meeting".... my apologies....

Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
accepted on one, and only one condition. Keep helping me out here on JU. You know it said " its better to keep ones mouth shut and be thought of as a fool, than to open it and prove it." ---keep taking the egg of my face--
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top

Keep helping me out here on JU.


We aim to please, (unless I am drunk then I aim to be a dick fairly often:) )


 


its better to keep ones mouth shut and be thought of as a fool, than to open it and prove it."


Hmm I should have used that one on my John Stewart/Carlson Tucker article.

Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top
Is Michael Moore "anit-American"

By: Dysmas
Posted: Monday, October 18, 2004 on One soldier's Opinion
Message Board: Politics
Mr. Moore is among the growing number of Americans who trash our nation, our Military, and our Domestic and National Polices.
"Bowling for Colombine" was an interesting film and raised many serious questions that should be addresed but nevertheless it portrayed the majority of Americans as gun toteing, inherantly violent, and aboslutly ignorant and/or unwilling to change the status quo of our nation. This is greatly emphaised by my Japanese pen-pal writing to me asking if Mr. Moore's statement that "virtually every houshold in the United States owns a firearm." And his assertion that the vast majority of firearm owners take little or no action to safeguard thier weapons from children.

I can handle his opinions, I take them with a grain of salt, ( actually many, many grains) but his most recent film. "Farenhit 9/11" was completly over the top for me, especially as a soldier. To add insult to injury, upon his visits to foreign countries he continued to bash our country. Saying such things to the French of all people, that "we should have listend to them." and his comments go on and on and I feel no need to quote him further unless it is needed.

Under his illusion that he only wants to air out our nations flaws he is unquestionably among the most arrogent "anit-americans" that I have ever had the displeasure of hearing, seeing, or reading.

I am intrested to see how agrees with me and more importantly who does not, and why.


Ya better believe i agree with you or " your dead where you stand mister.". For those that don't know the preceeding was a "John Wayne" movie quote. But hell yes I agree with you!
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well good lol. "you know it, I know it, yellow dog knows it" I imagine most people do agree, I can't see very many points of dissention but you never know.
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
Oh, there are plenty of people here who will happily argue that Mr. Moore is some sort of rotund demigod, but as far as I'm concerned his idea of "convincing you with facts" involves slanting and spinning the facts so heavily that you get dizzy from the blur.
Reply #9 from PolMach Forums Top
On most every point in life it is easiest for me to make a sports analogy. Does the fan of a particular football team hate that team because he gets frustrated with the direction of the team? What if that fan complains endlessly about the coaches game decisions, the players effort and preparation? Maybe you can relate to a situation like this. Have you ever badmouthed your favorite teams ownership, management, coaching or players? Did you do this because you hated your favorite team? There is an old saying that the opposite of love is not hate - the opposite of love is indifference. Basically, if you think Moore is doing these things because he does not like this country and he hopes these things hurt America, then he is anti-american. If you think he is doing these things because he wants this country to be better and he is channeling his frustration through film, then no he is not anti-american.

FYI - this post is coming from an Airman's opinion who remembers hearing straight from many military peoples mouths that they hoped for bad things (Mostly economic) to happen to this country during the 90's because they didn't like Clinton and wanted something bad to happen on his watch.
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
I never realized that calling Americans stupid is a sign of love. I guess that must mean that people who call liberals stupid must really love them.
Reply #11 from PolMach Forums Top
There is an old saying that the opposite of love is not hate - the opposite of love is indifference. Basically, if you think Moore is doing these things because he does not like this country and he hopes these things hurt America, then he is anti-american. If you think he is doing these things because he wants this country to be better and he is channeling his frustration through film, then no he is not anti-american.


I said he is doing it for the 'benjamins' and nothing else, because if he really cared he would have donated money to those soldiers he exploited in his film.

Speaking of Mikey and his movie I have hosted David Kopel's 59 Deceits in Mikey's F 9/11: Link (pdf file)

To make it easier to obtain and easier for me to link to.

Booga Booga Ooga
- Grimmity Xoogity Boo
Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
While I appreciate your spirit of dissent, I feel that you are not quite able to see MM in his true perspective. F911 is a tough ecxpose of the fraud that has taken place in the name of fighting terrorism.. I do not think tha t he is critical of the soldiers who are afterall doing the job for which they have been sent. He is highly critical of the political leadership not the soldiers. In a Democracy we must distinguish between the actions of the State and Civil Society. Being critical of the American state which is indulging in untold crimes in Iraq , is not the same as being anti_American. The civil society hardly has a role to play in this crisis, and MM is only putting accross a valid, if at times, extreme argument against involvement in Iraq.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top

Reply #12 By: Bahu Virupaksha - 10/19/2004 2:57:50 AM
While I appreciate your spirit of dissent, I feel that you are not quite able to see MM in his true perspective. F911 is a tough ecxpose of the fraud that has taken place in the name of fighting terrorism.. I do not think tha t he is critical of the soldiers who are afterall doing the job for which they have been sent. He is highly critical of the political leadership not the soldiers. In a Democracy we must distinguish between the actions of the State and Civil Society. Being critical of the American state which is indulging in untold crimes in Iraq , is not the same as being anti_American. The civil society hardly has a role to play in this crisis, and MM is only putting accross a valid, if at times, extreme argument against involvement in Iraq.


Once again this shows what you don't know or don't want to know! F911 is a proven collection of lies! 59 of them to be exact! If he wanted to show that America is moving in the wrong direction he should hsve quoted fact not fiction! And given your repeated mouthings of how the US is commiting war crimes I would tend to question your patriotism!
Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well then Bahu Virupasksha it will be interesting to see what the counter film to Moor's " Celsius 4/11" will show. I watched F9/11 and will absolutly watch the counter film. Will you and if so, will you be willing to change your opinon or are you steadfast in your belief.
As for your statment "the American state induldging in untold crimes in Iraq" well the representives of the "American State" are the soldiers and the vast, vast majority are serving exceptionaly well in such adverse conditions. As for "untold" what do you think of the so called Abu Garaib scandal. It was told and the soldiers were punished, although I don't agree with it. There are more serious forms of "hazing" on college campuses. And in my view, if you need to scare or intimidate these criminals in order to gain information TO SAVE SOLDIER'S LIVES then good. By the way, those Iraqis who were involved were not "regular people rounded up" they were confirmed enemy combatants so they DID have information.
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
Oh yes, on that note, I signed a petition at "Patriot Petitions" to drop all charges against Col. West for his actions. What he did was not uncommon at all especially for Iraqi soldiers, the main difference is that after Iraqi forces gained information they probably would've shot him dead right then and there. He was protecting his soldiers and all other forces, and that is the JOB of an officer. I would put him in for an MSM or LOM any day. ( Meritorious Service Medal, Legion of Merit"
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
mabye they should create an award soley on the actions of one to save or protect another, in conjuction with the other awards
Reply #17 from PolMach Forums Top
Well then Bahu Virupasksha it will be interesting to see what the counter film to Moor's " Celsius 4/11"


Go get Fahrenhype 9/11. I rented it the day it came out (in the local Blockbuster). There was an entire section for Moore's propaganda piece and only one copy of Fahrenhype. In it, there is an interview with the soldier that lost his arms (depicted in Fahrenheit 9/11) he is more than a little unhappy that Moore used his image in his film without his consent.
Reply #18 from JoeUser Forums Top
To be honest, Moore is anti-American. That is not only because he is against Bush and the Iraq War. Afterall, he also against the Afghansistan War. He simnply against everything American stands for. He is against free market society, he is against free specch (except his speech), he plays racial card all the times. The guy is just ANTI-?
Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
I damn well believe he is upset that a person like Moore used his immage in a film like that.
and yeah, Morre is not only anit-american he seems like he is anti-pretty-much-anything.
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top
Michael Moore has no soul.  He is a disgusting blob of garbage that was merely fortunate enough to be birthed in the US.  He stands for nothing but his own greed and arrogance.  He will knowingly splice bits together to serve his own purpose and pass it off as fact.  He's scum of the lowest caliber and most definitely anti-American.
Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
he seems like he is anti-pretty-much-anything
He's defintitely anti-basic hygiene but he must be pro-glutony.
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
lol true and true. He is absolutly fortunate to be born in America, and its that same blessing and advantage that he uses against us, and by proxy, himself. I imagine he would have a different view if he was born in 3rd or 2nd world country. Iraq is a good example. I can't even count how many people came and told us of Saddams brutality, and even my unit's translator had sever scars on his entire body, head to toe, litteraly, due to torture at the hands of Saddams regime. I bet muhammed, the translator, has a problem with Moore's american bashing.
Reply #23 from PolMach Forums Top
The facts in F9/11 are somewhat spliced together and the movie does present a clear one sided view of GW. To say someone is UNAmerican for excersing their constitutional right of free speech is itself UNAmerican.

This country was founded on dissent and freedom of opression. While F9/11 might be one sided it does at least try and level out the rethoric that the Bush camp spews. Loyality clauses to go hear your President Speak. Arresting people that want to protest or putting them in speical areas where they have no access to the President and the media so he is always seen in a positive light.

If F9/11 did not do anyting else it at least showed the world that we have a current bafoon in the whitehouse. Everytime the president speaks he cracks me up. He is hands down the worst communicating president that we have had since media could record their words. And for the most part when Michael Moore says America is mindless he is right. We act like sheep to slaughter just go along with the daily dose of garbage (what the media feeds) like food in our troth fattening us up. All the while the real issues are killing us.

I mean we have kids dying for religion and oil and we are concered with Gay marriage and Janet Jackons boob. Gimme a break.

The christain right has invaded the white house and i just wish someone would make a movie exposing how much religion has been brought into American poltics. Makes me want to vomit., and before you call me a pagan I am a christian I just belive in seperation of church and state.

Flame away.
Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top

Reply #23 By: Mobcoa - 10/22/2004 12:52:58 AM
The facts in F9/11 are somewhat spliced together and the movie does present a clear one sided view of GW. To say someone is UNAmerican for excersing their constitutional right of free speech is itself UNAmerican.

This country was founded on dissent and freedom of opression. While F9/11 might be one sided it does at least try and level out the rethoric that the Bush camp spews. Loyality clauses to go hear your President Speak. Arresting people that want to protest or putting them in speical areas where they have no access to the President and the media so he is always seen in a positive light.

If F9/11 did not do anyting else it at least showed the world that we have a current bafoon in the whitehouse. Everytime the president speaks he cracks me up. He is hands down the worst communicating president that we have had since media could record their words. And for the most part when Michael Moore says America is mindless he is right. We act like sheep to slaughter just go along with the daily dose of garbage (what the media feeds) like food in our troth fattening us up. All the while the real issues are killing us.

I mean we have kids dying for religion and oil and we are concered with Gay marriage and Janet Jackons boob. Gimme a break.

The christain right has invaded the white house and i just wish someone would make a movie exposing how much religion has been brought into American poltics. Makes me want to vomit., and before you call me a pagan I am a christian I just belive in seperation of church and state


100 % wrong! F 9/11 showed everyone with a brain that michael moore likes to lie and twist facts! in F9/11 it was 59 falsehoods!
Reply #25 from JoeUser Forums Top
To say someone is UNAmerican for excersing their constitutional right of free speech is itself UNAmerican.


I've got to disagree with you on that; it depends very much on what the original speaker is saying. If he's running around saying "I hate America, the president is a worthless jerk, I hope the country goes into a 100-year depression, gets scarlet fever, and dies," then I have absolutely no problem saying that he's acting unamerican.

To say that someone is unamerican for exercising their free speech right to call someone else unamerican is itself unamerican.