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Hillary: Universal Health Care for Everyone!

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Hillary: Universal Health Care for Everyone!

http://abclocal.go.com/kfsn/story?section=nation_world&id=5151141
from JoeUser Forums
Yesterday on ABC's Good Morning America Hillary Clinton attended a staged town hall meeting filled with selected members, and obvious supporters. During her "meeting" Hillary pledged the following:

"We're going to have universal health care when I'm president - there's no doubt about that. We're going to get it done," the New York senator and front-runner for the 2008 nomination said.

Of course Hillary was largely unchallenged by the host Robin Miller, and was never asked any tough questions that Hillary might have to actually answer like how she intends to pay for all this? But this is what the 2008 Presidential election will look like for democrats......a clean pass from the media.
democrat
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Reply #26 from JoeUser Forums Top
what they do in mass. is their plan. go argue with mitt about that. you and dog are contending that hillary is endorsing a one payer system, which she clearly is not


The problem is you can't get a straight answer from Hillary, and you can't trust the media to ask her any questions that she might actually have to answer.

One option is the single-payer system, which they have in Canada. Medicare, which has very high satisfaction rates, is also a single-payer system. Another option is to build on our current employer-based system.

That is what they have done in Massachusetts, what California is considering, and what Sen. Edwards has proposed. I know from the battles over health care that I have been involved in it's going to take more than a plan to achieve universal coverage.


Clinton: My goal is to have a health care system that provides quality, affordable care to every American. On way to achieve this goal is to have a national health care system where there is only one source of care and the government runs it.

That is what they have in Canada, and it is called a single-payer system. Another way to achieve universal coverage is to build on the employer-based system.




Reply #27 from JoeUser Forums Top
The problem is you can't get a straight answer from Hillary, and you can't trust the media to ask her any questions that she might actually have to answer.


Clinton: And the reason I haven't sent out a plan and said, ‘Well here's exactly what I think we should do,’ is because during this campaign I want the ideas that people have. I want to hear from you who have different perspectives about what you think will work.

and do ya think she's gonna roll it out almost 2 years out just to have the punditry spin it backwards and sideways and distort it and do everything else they like to do? at least credit the woman for not being that dumb, regardless of which side you are on. this posturing is nonsense. fact is that she simply doesn't have to cater to the right wing pundits. they and their flock aren't voting for her anyway, lol

and as far as reply #22 goes, i'm sorry, i'm not gonna fall for that tangent of talking about he entire history of every government spending allocation for over 2 centuries. and broad charts on annual spending won't accurately reflect individual spending measures and their impact on efficiency and productivity. but if it's an example you need, here...my wife lived thru this and can tell you 1st hand about having less of a budget and getting more done as was proposed...
WWW Link


now if dog would send me a link for his quotes above of senator clinton, we get back to the subject, ok? lol
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Reply #28 from JoeUser Forums Top
talking about he entire history of every government


I said one - not every. Not up to the challenge?
Reply #30 from JoeUser Forums Top
did you notice the link?


And that was done by the private sector when? I did not say when government could reduce its own expenses (an anathema, but happens in States and locals), but where the Government took over AND reduced costs from the private sector. Trimming finger nails in the Federal offices is not going private to public and saving money.
Reply #31 from JoeUser Forums Top
but where the Government took over AND reduced costs from the private sector


ok...how bout the epa's "FCA" program?
WWW Link

Clinton: I've been fighting to get electronic medical records for every American. The reason is I think it will save us money, time. It will avoid duplication. An independent study says we'll save $100 billion if we did this. So, I hate to put more money into our national health care system until we get the cost down and we have a better system to take care of you.

are ya arguing with the above proposal? anytime you can consoladate and standardize anything it saves cost and time.


Reply #32 from JoeUser Forums Top
ok...how bout the epa's "FCA" program?


Consolodating government programs into one? Again, where is the example of a private industry being taken over by the state where money is saved? Politicians will say anything to get elected. But they rarely keep those promises. Sometimes due to outright lies, and sometimes because they have no clue as to what they are talking about.
Reply #33 from JoeUser Forums Top
Don't you guys get it yet? Only Bush has hand picked audiences.

We all know anyone from the left has diverse people from all walks of life with many differing opinions and are allowed to ask any questions they want to, it was just happenstance that no one questioned Hitlery at her "interview" and the hosts were so enchanted with her in depth opinions and propositions that they felt no questions from them were needed, Hitlery had it all covered.

Heil Hitlery!
Reply #34 from JoeUser Forums Top
Heil Hitlery!


  

He's Baaaacccckkk!   
Reply #35 from JoeUser Forums Top
Personally, I don't know why we're even sweating this. Do you honestly think that America "wants" 4/8 years of "more" Clinton? I doubt it. This will only happen "IF" she gets into office.
Reply #36 from JoeUser Forums Top

Her audience was hand-picked and the person who initiated the "health care" issue was someone who worked on HillaryCare I.


i asked for evvidence, not another accusation.


I don't know....sounds kind of hand picked to me. Notice there were none there "against" her.


Clinton opened her latest campaign swing with a live broadcast from the Science Center of Iowa, where she spoke to more than 200 activists at a town meeting about health care issues. It's an issue with which she is very familiar. After her husband won the White House in 1992, she headed an effort to put a universal health care system in place. That effort eventually collapsed under pressure in part from the insurance industry


Link
Reply #37 from JoeUser Forums Top
Again, where is the example of a private industry being taken over by the state where money is saved?


ummm,,,guess ya missed this,,,

19. Has FCA been effective in addressing privatization questions?
Yes. When Greensboro, North Carolina, implemented its recycling program, it was required to compete with the private sector. To do that, the city had to evaluate the program and decide whether the private sector could meet Greensboro's standards and costs. Now the city is running the service because it out-performed the private sector
Reply #38 from JoeUser Forums Top
still no proof whatsoever that this audience was hand picked.

in fact, since the former task force staffer identified himself, it leans against that premise. a "hand picked" audience doesn't usually advertise the fact that they are associated with the candidate.

and i'm still waiting for a reference on dog's quotes above...guess they were fake,,,big surprise there..the typo kind of gave that away.
Reply #39 from JoeUser Forums Top
19. Has FCA been effective in addressing privatization questions?
Yes. When Greensboro, North Carolina, implemented its recycling program, it was required to compete with the private sector. To do that, the city had to evaluate the program and decide whether the private sector could meet Greensboro's standards and costs. Now the city is running the service because it out-performed the private sector


Um, did they take it from the Private to the government? That says they did it themselves, and it was never private. I will even allow you to excise one instance of an entire industry (instead of an entire industry since I was not specific before). Greensboro wrote the rules and then bid against private companies with their rules - not with rules in place prior to the implementation of the program.

But go ahead. Let Hillary run health care like a municipal garbage collection agency. If she even can. They both will produce the same result - garbage.
Reply #40 from JoeUser Forums Top
and i'm still waiting for a reference on dog's quotes above...guess they were fake,,,big surprise there..the typo kind of gave that away.


LOL.  Yeah, I'm faking Hillarys healthcare plans. 

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=2982554&page=1





Reply #41 from JoeUser Forums Top
Personally, I don't know why we're even sweating this. Do you honestly think that America "wants" 4/8 years of "more" Clinton? I doubt it. This will only happen "IF" she gets into office.


actually miler, we agree here somewhat. i seriously question whether hillary will win the nomination, let alone the general election. it's hardly the "done deal" the clinton camp and theri supporters would like us to think.
Reply #42 from JoeUser Forums Top
on your other point miler, see reply 36, which ya missed or ignored. when someone is a plant, they usually don't announce it. like when the gay porn guy was a plant of the GOP in the washigton press corp. or the whole armstrong scandal a few years back with the GOP.

just because the bush administration was found out for stacking the deck at town hall meetings, of course, the right wing has to charge "they did it too" despite 1 shred of actual evidence. a planted questioner doesn't announce it.

Reply #43 from JoeUser Forums Top
LOL. Yeah, I'm faking Hillarys healthcare plans.


i thought that might finally bring ya out of the shadows instead of having guy fight your battles for ya, lol....

and that is the same place i got quotes from, except in yours, you cut her off to change her meanings so it appears she said what you want her to say, not what she actually said and intended. a textbook "taken out of context" quote.

i apologize for the underhanded tactic of accusing you of fabricating the quotes. you didn't do that, and i apologize but i wanted to clear the air on that. i had asked for your reference several times. and in the end, the quotes were simply manipulated and cropped to change the meanings, not fabricated. again, i apologize for the accusation.

Reply #44 from JoeUser Forums Top
Clinton:We have to build consensus. We have to build the will. That is why I have not proposed a specific plan and why I am not interested in pushing just my plan.

I want to sign into law our plan — a truly and uniquely American plan. This is what my conversation with the American people is all about. And I am focusing on three principles: coverage, quality and competitiveness. A plan for universal care must deal with our competitiveness issues — today our businesses can't compete in the global economy because they are buckling from out of control health care costs.


this is what senator clinton is doing. all the right wing pundits want her to prematurely "lay out her plan" for them to piss all over for 18 months. do ya think she's that stupid people? ok,,,maybe ya do,,,but do ya think the people advising her are that stupid too?

of course, if you are satisfied with spending more on healthcare than anyone else and ranking badly on things like infant mortality, life expetancy (we're now down to 31st there!) and so forth, then feel free to poo-poo anyone who even dares suggests that this grand experiment in unfettered "market based, free enterprise, corporate health care" has failed miserably in leaving over 47 million americans, many of whom are children who don't have the same choices us adults have, uninsured and left for dead.

and it's not a choice between unfettered capatalism and "socialized medicine" so don't go there...we, as americans can do better. and by hearing from anyone who can contribute to finding a way towards better health than our current, on your own system, we will be.


Reply #45 from JoeUser Forums Top
i thought that might finally bring ya out of the shadows instead of having guy fight your battles for ya, lol....


Nobody is fighting anything for me.  People are free to make their points here, so go on with that nonsense.


i apologize for the underhanded tactic of accusing you of fabricating the quotes. you didn't do that, and i apologize but i wanted to clear the air on that. i had asked for your reference several times. and in the end, the quotes were simply manipulated and cropped to change the meanings, not fabricated. again, i apologize for the accusation.


The quotes were from Hillary, she made clear statements of what she wants.  Regardless of the specific details she wants a national healthcare system, and that alone is a bad idea.

But anyways, I have serious doubts Hillary will get anywhere in her campaign, and if by the slim chance she would ever end up as President, HillaryCare II would fail just as the first attempt.

do ya think she's that stupid people? ok,,,maybe ya do,,,but do ya think the people advising her are that stupid too?


Yes and Yes. 






Reply #46 from JoeUser Forums Top
of course, if you are satisfied with spending more on healthcare than anyone else and ranking badly on things like infant mortality, life expetancy (we're now down to 31st there!) and so forth, then feel free to poo-poo anyone who even dares suggests that this grand experiment in unfettered "market based, free enterprise, corporate health care" has failed miserably in leaving over 47 million americans, many of whom are children who don't have the same choices us adults have, uninsured and left for dead.


First off the 'over 47 million" number has been disputed several times by mismanagement of the Census Bureau.  It was recently lowered by a couple million because of programming errors, and they admitted the data has been flawed since '95.  If I remember correctly I read where this "number" also includes illegal immigrants and does not take into factor people who choose not to be uninsured.




46.6 million are uninsured.

That number, from the Census Bureau, is misleading. It makes it seem like there are that many who simply can’t get coverage. Fact is, this group is constantly changing, and most of the uninsured soon have coverage again. A Congressional Budget Office report found that 45% were uninsured for four months or less — just 29% lacked coverage for more than a year. Businesses are dropping coverage.

Nobody chooses to be uninsured.

On the contrary, evidence shows that a large portion of the uninsured population could get coverage if they wanted it. The Census report notes that nearly 40% of the uninsured are young, under age 34. At least some of them may have concluded that their money was better spent on something other than health insurance.

In addition, a report from the National Center for Policy Analysis reports that about 14 million uninsured adults and children are eligible for government coverage.

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Reply #47 from JoeUser Forums Top
Regardless of the specific details she wants a national healthcare system, and that alone is a bad idea.


no , she doesn't necessarily. show me her plan that endorses "nationalized healthcare"

and the details were you cropping her statements to make it look like she was all for the single payer option.

People are free to make their points here, so go on with that nonsense.


lighten up francis (lol),,,notice the "lol" i was kiddin with ya...it's ok if ya missed it, as long as ya got that now.

and on your last point, you may want hillary and her advisors to be dumb enough to lay out a plan to be pissed on for 18 months, but i doubt she or they are. but we do agree that her road to at least being the nominee will be much rockier than any of her early polling would suggest.

Reply #48 from JoeUser Forums Top
I've practiced in the equivalent of a single-payer system with a captive audience - the military. If you're in need of trauma care, it's great. Anything else and it ain't pretty, for physicians or patients. The only saving grace was that there was a private system to fall back on. If that were eliminated, I shudder to think how the wheels would grind to a halt, if not come off altogether. The bureaucratic convolutions the private sector has to deal with already (much of it admittedly self-imposed because behemoth size breeds to conceipt that micromanagement can be done effectively) are stifling enough. When everything you do requires a triplicate form & review/approval by the regional authority, forget efficiency.
Reply #49 from JoeUser Forums Top
evidence shows that a large portion of the uninsured population could get coverage if they wanted it.


talk about disputed. these claims have never been properly substiantiated in my view. and whether you want to dispute the 47 million by a few mil is moot to me. if it's 10 million, if it's 1 million,,,i would want to find a way to get them the care they deserve.

you seem to think that i am defending hillary's "plan" and that ain't so...

1) she hasn't laid out a plan. so i have no idea whether or not i support it.

2) her stated goal is to get as much input from all sides to form a consensus on the best way forward. our health care system sucks for how much we pay into it, and i agree with her there.

3) that doesn't mean that i, or she, are all for single payer, nationalized health care. i, like many, are looking for improvement. like i said, if you are happy with the situation in health care, that's your right as an american to feel that way and voice your opinion.

4) on the other hand, it is improper to try to create a postion she hasn't taken by taking quotes out of context and speculating the worst possible case scenarios and presenting them as if they were facts. that is shoddy and irresponsible writing in my view and it needed to be pointed out.