As an officer that spent 30 years taking and giving ordres, I resent a Commander -in-chief that when it was his turn to obey orders, choose to disobey the orders and regulations he was to follow. He then used his father's contacts to escape the consequences of not following orders. I have NO respect for a person that refused to meet his obligations but expects others to obey his orders now that he is the boss! This is a very BASIC flaw in GWB!

As an officer that spent 30 years taking and giving orders, I resent a Commander -in-chief that when it was his turn to obey orders, choose to disobey the orders and regulations he was to follow. He then used his father's contacts to escape the consequences of not following orders. I have NO respect for a person that refused to meet his obligations but expects others to obey his orders now that he is the boss! This is a very BASIC flaw in GWB!

You "still" have not grasped the obvious yet! Whether you or I respect him is immaterial! Your NOT even in anymore. For that matter neither am I. So whether or not we respect him is irrelevant! He's in office! NOTHING you say or DO will change that! And he's in until 2008! Get used to it. All your whining means nothing!

" I have NO respect for a person that refused to meet his obligations but expects others to obey his orders now that he is the boss! This is a very BASIC flaw in GWB!"

By all means, no one is saying you have to respect him. Heck, if he somehow is able to run in 2008, don't vote for him. Work to keep him from getting re-elected.

Outside that, I'm pretty much clueless as to what you hope to accomplish...

The fact Bush was elected in 2004 does not change what he is or what he has done in the past. The reality is that if GWB had beed treated like ANY other officer that did not obey orders and regulations, he would NOT have been granted a "Honorable Discharge". That would most liklely have prevented GWB from running for President. Can you see a candidate running for President that received a "General Discharge", which is most likely what he should have been given. Rather he was allowed to get away with failing to meet the obligations he took upon himself when he was commissioned and escpaed punishment because of his fathers contacts. Then he is elected to the highest office in this Great counry. You may dismiss his behavior but to do so is dead wrong! That turns your back on the millions of our brave military who followed their orders even to the loss of their lives!

Col you are just obsessed with Bush. You can't change anything about his service, and you can't change the fact that he was elected and re-elected. Get over yourself.

The fact Bush was elected in 2004 does not change what he is or what he has done in the past. The reality is that if GWB had beed treated like ANY other officer that did not obey orders and regulations, he would NOT have been granted a "Honorable Discharge". That would most liklely have prevented GWB from running for President. Can you see a candidate running for President that received a "General Discharge", which is most likely what he should have been given. Rather he was allowed to get away with failing to meet the obligations he took upon himself when he was commissioned and escpaed punishment because of his fathers contacts. Then he is elected to the highest office in this Great counry. You may dismiss his behavior but to do so is dead wrong! That turns your back on the millions of our brave military who followed their orders even to the loss of their lives!

It changes EVERYTHING! The reality is what he did or did not do in the past is a moot point. I dimiss NOTHING! Nothing tht YOU can say or DO changes anything! He's in until 2008! DEAL with it! And just an FYI do NOT EVER AGAIN question the way I feel about Americas dead! Not with the way you run your mouth.

I did not question the way you feel. Your problem is that when the facts do not agree with how you think, you refuse to see the truth. I said to turn your back on how GWB failed to meet his military obligations is to say the hell with all those who did follow their orders, many of whom died in that effort! One of my best friends gave his life 10 days before he was to return to his family from Vietnam following his orders while Bush hid out in the Guard and did not even follow the orders and regulations of the National Guard! That is some Commander-in-Chief!

Your problem is that when the facts do not agree with how you think, you refuse to see the truth.

That is so funny coming from you. How many times has the truth through real facts, not polls, been shown to you? How many times have you admitted your mistakes?

It doesn't matter what happened in the National Guard. He was elected and re-elected. Get over it.

One of my best friends gave his life 10 days before he was to return to his family from Vietnam following his orders while Bush hid out in the Guard and did not even follow the orders and regulations of the National Guard! That is some Commander-in-Chief!

What is it with you? I never saw anyone complaining about Clinton. And what he did is considered faaaar worse than what you claim GW did. Clinton met absolutely NO military obligations! And BTW you can stop dodging the reasoning I put forth.

It changes EVERYTHING! The reality is what he did or did not do in the past is a moot point. I dimiss NOTHING! Nothing that YOU can say or DO changes anything! He's in until 2008! DEAL with it!

Even though you do not agree with the above quote, it matters not!

Clinton and Cheney were far more honest then Bush about not wanting to be sent to Vietnam. They used deferments to stay out of the military while Bush used daddy's contacts to get him in the National Guard, which during Vietnem, was a very good way not to be sent to fight while giving the illusion of military service! Add the fact Bush did not meet the committments he agreed to when he was commissioned in the Guard, makes Bush is far more dishonest then either Cheney or Clinton!

Clinton and Cheney were far more honest then Bush about not wanting to be sent to Vietnam. They used deferments to stay out of the military while Bush used daddy's contacts to get him in the National Guard, which during Vietnem, was a very good way not to be sent to fight while giving the illusion of military service! Add the fact Bush did not meet the committments he agreed to when he was commissioned in the Guard, makes Bush is far more dishonest then either Cheney or Clinton!

Can you show who exactly these "contacts" were?

Clinton and Cheney were far more honest then Bush about not wanting to be sent to Vietnam. They used deferments to stay out of the military

Wrong answer! Now try again! Yes Cheney used deferments, Clinton on the other hand did not.

Clinton's Military record: Bill Clinton registers for the draft on September 08, 1964, accepting all contractual conditions of registering for the draft. Given Selective Service Number 3 26 46 228. Bill Clinton classified 2-S on November 17, 1964. * Bill Clinton reclassified 1-A on March 20, 1968. * Bill Clinton ordered to report for induction on July 28,1969. * Bill Clinton dishonors order to report and is not inducted into the military. * Bill Clinton reclassified 1-D after enlisting in the United States Army Reserves on August 07,1969 under authority of Col.E.Holmes. and takes oath of enlistment. * Bill Clinton fails to report to his duty station at the University of Arkansas ROTC, September 1969. * Bill Clinton reclassified 1-A on October 30, 1969, as enlistment with Army Reserves is revoked by Colonel E. Holmes and Clinton now AWOL and subject to arrest under Public Law 90-40 (2)(a) 'registrant who has failed to report...remain liable for induction'. * Bill Clinton's birth date lottery number is 311, drawn December 1, 1969, but anyone who has already been ordered to report for induction, is INELIGIBLE! * Bill Clinton runs for Congress (1974), while a fugitive from justice under Public Law 90-40. * Bill Clinton runs for Arkansas Attorney General (1976),while a fugitive from justice. * Bill Clinton receives pardon on January 21, 1977 from Carter. * Bill Clinton FIRST PARDONED FEDERAL FELON ever to serve as President. All these facts come from Freedom of Information requests, public laws, and various books that have been published, and have not been refuted by Clinton. Aside from an improper application of public law, the events outlined above are basically correct, at least until the author draws the fallacious conclusion that Clinton was a criminal for his actions. A complete account of Clinton's elaborate draft-dodge is given in the reference cited below, but the gist is this: Eighteen-year old Bill enters Georgetown University and registers for Selective Service, as required by law. His status as a full-time student earns him a deferrment. In his senior year, Bill receives a Rhodes Scholarship to study at Oxford University. In February of 1968, the Federal Government eliminates draft deferments for graduate students and Bill once again becomes eligible in March of that year. Clinton subsequently, though family and political connections, obtains a Navy Billet from the local naval reserve unit and temporary draft protection from the Garland County Draft Board, allowing him to start at Oxford - special treatment that was not uncommon for Rhode's Scholars of the day. Clinton completes his first term at Oxford in December, 1969, and is ordered to report for a physical in January, which he did. In April 1969, Bill was ordered to report for induction. However, delays in International mail delivery resulted in Clinton receiving his orders after the induction date had passed. By this time, he had begun his second term at Oxford. Regulations allowed him to complete the term, but he must report for induction by July 28, 1969. Once again utilizing extensive political connections, Clinton gets accepted into the University of Arkansas ROTC program on July 17, nullifying his draft notice. Clinton would not have to enroll until he completed basic training the following year. In the fall of '69, Clinton opts to return to Oxford, rather than enroll in the University of Arkansas Law School. While at Oxford, Clinton contacts the draft board to drop his ROTC deferment and return to active status. By this time, regulations had changed, allowing graduate students to complete their schooling before reporting for military duty. Clinton had a high enough draft number to virtually ensure he would not be called.

There is no doubt Clinton and Cheney did not want to serve in Vietnam. My point is that neither did Bush but Bush unlike Clinton and Cheney made it look as if he served but did not fulfull the responsibilities he agreed to when he accepted a commission. The Air Force spent a lot of tax payer money training Bush to be a pilot and that was his job in the Air Guard . When he failed to attend drills and maintain flight proficiency and did not take the required flight physical he failed no only obey orders as an officer but was unable to fulfill his function in the Air Gurad. He then applied for an early release and an honorable discharge.. The help Bush had getting into the guard was the former Speaker of the Texas House. I do not know who protected Bush from receiving puninhment for not attending drills and taking his physical. I also do not know who approved his early honorable discharge. However, his CO was pressured by the then commandig general of the Texas Air Guard.