Fight the "REAL ID" Act

The fact they are slipping it into the defense appropriations bill tells us that the lying scum knows it's unconstitutional. What, the cowards are afraid that the concept can't stand on its own?

Pathetic!! Thansk for the heads up. Just sent an Email off to Sen. Feingold and Kohl.

Maybe I'm slow, but I don't get what the hubbub is. The whole "national ID" thing was a lost cause after we all got social security numbers; after that the precident was set. Maybe someone could elaborate on why a national ID is so much more heinous than a state ID so the rest of us can share the outrage? I personally hate the idea of illegal aliens being granted drivers licenses, and I REALLY hate people here on 6 month visas getting drivers licenses that are good for 6 years.

Maybe if people cared more about their state and local politics and made sure the job was done right there, the Federal government wouldn't be so interested in hijacking their authority all the time. I'd be willing to bet that 90% of the people who whine on the messageboards about Bush here couldn't tell you who their state representitive, or even Governor is.

Baker,

The national ID is at its very BEST a government boondoggle that would appropriate tax dollars to a cause that will NOT make any significant moves towards identifying terrorists and/or illegal aliens, at its worst its a sinister scheme that will seriously erode our liberties and lead to the creation of a martial state. My guess is, it's somewhere in between.

But again, we must look at the fact that they are slipping this in with another bill to see that their agenda is underhanded. If they thought it stood a real chance to stand on its own, they would have launched it on its own.

We have seen far too many violations of the US Constitution; to justify this on the premise that it's "just one more" is not a reasonable argument. Yes, the states need to step up to the plate, but yes, it's also true that the federal government is acting in blatant disregard to principles of the Constitution that, our founding fathers, at least, held dear. I was not around when social security was proposed; I'm not in favor of THAT system either. We've gone too far down a slippery slope as it is; going further down it cannot be justified by our past mistakes.

I support this

My name is moderateman and I do not support this!

but i do support bars codes tatooed on foreheads or computer chips fused with the heart.

"at its worst its a sinister scheme that will seriously erode our liberties and lead to the creation of a martial state. "

Okay, I understand that is what people are thinking. And usually that is what people say and move on. What I would like someone to do is state HOW it will seriously erode our liberties and lead to the creation of a martial state.

Like I say, maybe I am slow. Your employment is already tracked. Unless you refuse to pay taxes your total income information is basically public. I'm nationally identifiable by my SS#, which you basically hand out on every major transaction.

I think a far MORE heinous infringement of our privacy is the PRIVATE intrusion of credit information peddlers and the digital warehouses that track us from credit transaction to credit transaction.

Doubleplushappy, big brother shall take care of all our needs. Privacy ungood, the government knows mostright.

" Doubleplushappy, big brother shall take care of all our needs. Privacy ungood, the government knows mostright."

That's an example I see quite often on matters of national security.

Curiously you don't get much of that kind of response when the courts are forcing families to watch their daughter starve to death, or forcing states to accept Roe v. Wade, or when people want to cut education or social security. We've reached the point that I have to call the authorities to take care of stray dogs. That's probably three or four steps away from needing to apply for government approval to wipe your butt...

Not to toot my own horn, but I think Relinquishing Control Breeds Authoritarianism. If you hand over enough personal responsibility to the government, and make it big enough to eat you, eventually it will.

Wow, i am really surprised no one has use the 1984 argument yet!

1984 is sooooooooooo 21 years ago.

Seriously, when I asked "How" above, it wasn't rhetorical. I would really like to know how this will abused. To me the info available to them will just be redundant, since they could have gotten it anyway.

Terrorism terrorism terrorism 911 terror terrorism terrorism terrorism terrorism 911 terrorism terrorism 911 terrorism terrorism terrorism terrorism terrorism terrorism....Every single liberty US planners have revoked always and mandatorily carry the overtones of terrorism or 911 or a threat against America. When will Americans understand that giving up liberty doesn't give you security. That's a truism all real freedom loving Americans should come to understand. The dumbing down of the American people is one of the greatest implementation s the US planners have come up with. And they work fast too these days. How many years ago was it when a common American would have considered a mandatory identification card and a government-controlled database of everything about you as something worthy of a Stalinalistic or Maoist society. But no longer. Will Americans ever get back the balls they used to have, or have the American people been castrated with no hope of returning to the peaceful sympathetic America of old? I tell you with no doubts whatsoever that this is the tip of the iceberg. Forced internment of American citizens is imminent, though still a few years away. Gideon there is no hope of stopping this overweight freighter in a quick realistic manner. It's happening and Americans will tolerate it as usual. As long as it's under the guise of 'terrorism' there seem to be absolutely no end to the dumbification of the American public.

let's wake up "one nation under God indivisible" not 50 different systems with their own little regulations on something as important as the able to identify the people that are in this country. An American citizen should not object to something that clearly identifies them as an American. we need to do is make sure that we have standards in this country that enable us to safeguard our people or we have nothing! we need to realize the Real ID act is need and we ned border system that lets the government no who is in this country, where they are and when they leave.

"Forced internment of American citizens is imminent, though still a few years away."

And if they gas us to death, no doubt there will be folks like you in 60 years pretending they didn't, and that we spent our internment swimming and watching plays...

let's wake up "one nation under God indivisible" not 50 different systems with their own little regulations on something as important as the able to identify the people that are in this country.

COL,

Funny...the founding fathers disagreed with you pretty strongly on this issue.

 

Good to see someone else is raising Cain about this despicable legislation. Good job, Gideon.

Good to see someone else is raising Cain about this despicable legislation. Good job, Gideon.

Not to toot my own horn, but I think Relinquishing Control Breeds Authoritarianism. If you hand over enough personal responsibility to the government, and make it big enough to eat you, eventually it will.

Frankly, Baker, that's why I was shocked to see you support the act. You've always been a reasonable champion of individual liberties and responsibility.

We are a nation of individual states, each with it's own government and it's own laws and regulations which is what was intended when this country was established. As long as they don't conflict with the Federal constitution, each state has the right to determine it's own laws and standards. Any time the Federal government imposes itself on these state rights, we lose some measure of freedom.
If Immigration (a Federal Agency) did their jobs with regard to foreign nationals entering this country the whole thing would be moot.

Never said I supported it, Gid. I just fail to see the horrific potential of it, and I can't for the life of me get any of the doomsayers to explain what is in store.

There is NOTHING more basic than our security as a NATION. Without security we do not have freedom. The states have NOT done the job that is clear!

I really don't see the problem with a national id system. You are not giving up any rights or liberties for it.

Never said I supported it, Gid. I just fail to see the horrific potential of it, and I can't for the life of me get any of the doomsayers to explain what is in store.

Baker,

Truth be told, in my opinion, we probably won't see any immediate repurcussions from it, outside of a tremendous increase in unlicensed drivers (poor people who don't have the means for one reason or another to purchase all of the needed documents to get their national ID), which basically endangers everyone on America's streets.

But in removing our freedoms, the government hasn't relied on one sinister magnificent gesture. They've relied on a systematic series of compromises that have gradually undermined our freedoms so that we quietly accept the sacrifice of our freedoms. Common sense tells them that a single magnificent act would lead to revolution.

I wasn't around to speak to the issue of social security or other infractions of the government. But I AM around to speak for this, and I will.

There is NOTHING more basic than our security as a NATION. Without security we do not have freedom. The states have NOT done the job that is clear!

"He who would sacrifice a little liberty for a little security deserves or receives neither". Too bad you think Benjamin Frankli was full of shit, COL.

 

The problem is you are not giving up any liberties here.

"But in removing our freedoms, the government hasn't relied on one sinister magnificent gesture."

What freedom is being removed?

""He who would sacrifice a little liberty for a little security deserves or receives neither"."

you have yet to explain how a national standard for driver's licenses sacrifices Liberty. I'm honestly beginning to think you can't...