Bush to pay Social Secutity to Illegal Mexican Workers

from JoeUser Forums




Last night Lou Dobbs had a segment about the totalization agreement between United States and Mexico which George W. Bush has agreed to with the President of Mexico. I listened in disbelief to what was being said. I could not believe the president would approve such a provision. In essence this totalization agreement allows U S Social Security benefits to be paid for work performed while Mexican workers were illegally in the United States.

This morning I searched Google to see if I could confirm this story. Unfortunately it is true. President Bush made an agreement with Mr. Fox and directed the U S Commissioner of Social Security to sign a totalization agreement with Mexico on June the 29th 2004. This agreement becomes effective 60 days after President Bush submits it to Congress unless either the House or Senate rejects the agreement. This agreement would in essence allow payment of the U S Social Security benefits on the basis of work performed while the recipient was illegally in this country. In addition, it allows for benefits to be paid with as few as 6 quarters of work while United States citizens must work 40 quarters to receive any Social Security benefits.

The Social Security administration has estimated that cost of this agreement would be approximately $525 million dollars during the first five years after enactment to Social Security.

It is time to demand President Bush explain why he would have agree to a provision with Mexico that would pay benefits to workers while there were illegally in this country and why we would give them benefits in 6 quarters when American citizens are required to work 40 quarters to get benefits. We need and notify our representatives and senators to oppose this change if in fact President Bush as the unmitigated gall to submit such a provision to Congress for approval. How can any president agree to pay Social Security benefits to people who are violating our laws? How can Bush propose paying millions of additional dollars from Social Security to illegal workers when he is running around the country telling us that the Social Security system is in financial crisis? It is time to force Mr. Bush to explain himself and to make sure Congress does not allow such a thing to happen to the Social Security system of the United States of America.
politics
12,566 views 45 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
I hope this wasn't your first ever disillusionment concerning Bush and his policies.
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
No, but this one MUST be STOPPED!!!
The Political Machine 2024
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
If a private citizen aided and abetted someone who breaks the law, they would be arrested.
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
It looks like you Bush supporters can not come up with a good excuse for this idiotic action by your esteemed leader!
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well as usual you don't provide links or proof.

It looks like you Bush supporters can not come up with a good excuse for this idiotic action by your esteemed leader!


Just as you never admit your mistakes or post in topics that show good thing about the U.S.
Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top
I can't speak for other "Bush supporters" but honestly I wasn't going to answer this because you don't bother to cite anything. To many times I have wasted 10 minutes replying to twisted facts and outright lies. To be honest, Col, your "facts" are generally so biased or flimsy that I don't even read your stuff much anymore.

As for the Social Security thing, I haven't heard enough about it to have much of an opinion. I Googled Bush illegal mexico social security, and evidently the normally anti-Bush press hasn't much interest in it either.

I used to read your articles regularly. Now I feel like I know what they are going to say before I even click the link. I think they could write a pretty effective AI that could blog for you, honestly. Maybe you ARE AI. Your two-dimensional nature makes one wonder...

You are a plant, imho. Your endless ranting is either coming from someone who is deranged and obsessive, or someone who is acting as a volunteer troll for Democrats. I tend to think the latter.
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
There are a lot of articles that address the issue. Just go to Google and search "Social Security Agreement with Mexico" and you find pages of articles that tell the story of how George W. plans to sell out the American workers and taxpayers to Mexico. One site I looked at is :
http://www.numbersusa.com/hottopic/totalization.htm

This Bush action is 100% indefensible by anybody who is an American!
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
ok whithout any heat.... are these illegals putting money in the s.s. fund? and if yes should'nt they be able to get some back?

A REAL AMERICAN{whatever that means}
moderateman
Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
Oddly enough, the only people who seem to be talking about it are home town political editorials, bloggers, and political rant sites. I'm not seeing reports from reasonably unbiased news agencies, instead of isolationist "FAX YOUR SENATOR!!!" rags.

Maybe they want to wait and see what is actually submitted to Congress for approval, instead of capitalizing on rumor and anti-government paranoia. Non-issue at this point.
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
When Bush does send the Totalization Agreement to Congress (notice he has kept it under wraps since June 2004- I wonder why?) we will be able to see how Bush plans to screw the Social Security system and the American tax payers. If this agreement is anything like what is outlined in this Blog, Congress should impeach Bush rather then approve this scurrilous proposal!
Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top
It looks like you Bush supporters can not come up with a good excuse for this idiotic action by your esteemed leader!


With this one, I wouldn't even try. I have long disagreed with Prs. Bush's stance on Illegal immigration. Once again though, he is not alone:
~The Supreme Court cites the practices of other countries (instead of the Constitution, like their paid to do).

~It also rules that convictions in other countries don't fall under the "no guns for felons" laws.

~Private citizens who break no laws, give of their time, communications equipment, airplanes and everything else to do the job on the border that bureacracy won't; yet are treated worse than the criminals crossing the border.

~And Senators and House members never seem to be able to come up with any ideas on their own. Prefering to make excuses for either the president, or just playing childish "that won't work" games when something is suggested.

I wonder. If they just quit the charade, disbanded that border patrol completely and made entering the U.S. as easy as going from state to state, would it really be any worse?
Reply #12 from PolMach Forums Top
Illegal aliens have SS numbers? Most get paid under the table, using a fault numbers or stolen number. How would an illegal get SS if there is no documentation proving input to the system? I understand those who was here legally then later staying past their time.

Just wondering.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
When Bush does send the Totalization Agreement to Congress (notice he has kept it under wraps since June 2004- I wonder why?) we will be able to see how Bush plans to screw the Social Security system and the American tax payers. If this agreement is anything like what is outlined in this Blog, Congress should impeach Bush rather then approve this scurrilous proposal!



Here you go with your bs. You can't even provide proof except for blogs. How can Congress impeach Bush for something they would probably approve, especially democrats.
Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
The illegals would have to work at least 6 quarters ( using a SS number) and pay taxes to collect benefits. The two issue are Americans must work 40 quarters before they get benefits while this law would give illegals benefits after only 6 quarters. Why would someone that is breaking our laws be provided the benefits of Social Security at all? Why would the president who tells us Social Sceurity is in financial trouble do something that would pay out hundreds of millions to illegal workers and make the financial problems worse?why would the President of the United States propose to treat illegal aliens better than we treat law-abiding American citizens? Why would the president of the United States proposed a change that will further create fiscal problems for social security?
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
Why would the president of the United States proposed a change that will further create fiscal problems for social security


the same reason he's spending money like michael jackson trying to buy off a boyscout troop; since the 30s, ending social security (and, later, medicare) was one of the prime objectives of republican conservatives should they ever manage to control the executive and congress.

by the time those aspirations began to seem like a not-too-far-distant possibility in the 80s, however, they realized they hadda problem. even if--and it's a big if--they could pull together the votes needed to wipe out social security, thier constituents wouldnt stand for it. wouldnt be no need for term limits for anyone legislator fool enuff to actually try to take social security down.

strategists like grover norquist proposed another solution and bush has been implementing it since day one.

all they have to do is keep cutting taxes and spending wildly until the day comes when enough american can be convinced we can no longer afford any social programs.

i don't know whether bush is actually planning to follow through on with the obvious abberation col gene has reported, but it seems--if nothing else--at least as cynical and machavellian as those neocons who hoped for a tragedy as significant as pearl harbor to help create the right conditions. (michael ledeen referred to pearl harbor as a 'lucky event' and his soulmates at pnac claimed--prior to 911--we needed a "pearl harbor event" for our time to push things along.)

col gene may seem like a blathering idiot to all yall, but in a time of lunacy, sanity is pathological.
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
this is the starving the beast theory. My feeling is that if the conservative Republicans create enough of a fiscal crisis there is a strong possibility the liberals will take back control of the House-Senate and White House and a backlash of increasing taxes on the wealthy to restore fiscal solvency would rsult.. I doubt today the majority of Americans would stand for major changes in Social Security or Medicare and would opt for increasing taxes especially on the wealthy to pay for these two programs.
Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top
By doing a Google search using "Social Security Agreement with Mexico", I found this here Link

BUSH MAY SPEND U.S. TAX DOLLARS TO PROVIDE SOCIAL SECURITY PAYMENTS TO MEXICANS LIVING IN MEXICO

"With Social Security facing projections of insolvency, an Administration plan would hasten that crisis by sending hundreds of millions of dollars in Social Security payments to Mexican citizens living in Mexico - including those who have worked illegally in the United States."

ILLEGAL ALIENS WOULD BENEFIT

"Under current law, people who worked illegally in the U.S. can only become eligible for Social Security benefits by becoming citizens or legal permanent residents. But officials at the State Department and Social Security Administration (SSA) are preparing a scheme that would pay benefits to illegal aliens who have returned to Mexico."
Reply #18 from PolMach Forums Top
Again, no one has answered my question. How do you pay a person that has no record of employment?

If this is true, then this maybe just another way of throwing a bone to the latino vote. But not really giving anything away. The first company that would admit employing an illegal would be closed down. In the end it could be a good PR move, but cost nothing.
Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
" By doing a Google search using "Social Security Agreement with Mexico", I found this here Link"


Yeah, um, as I said before I don't go to fire-breathing partisan agenda sites to get the skinny on new news. If I wanted the "The Sky is Falling" perspective, I can get that here, or on Lou Dobbs... *chuckle*
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top
"If this is true, then this maybe just another way of throwing a bone to the latino vote. But not really giving anything away. The first company that would admit employing an illegal would be closed down. In the end it could be a good PR move, but cost nothing."


You are dead-on, and that is what the Col is ignoring. This is for companies like the one Wal-Mart got in trouble for contracting to. Folks that pretend to pay full wages and benefits and then hire illegals and give them squat.

If the Col would like to offer an alternative outlook, he could, but he's into the whole chicken-little fearmongering thing...
Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yeah, um, as I said before I don't go to fire-breathing partisan agenda sites to get the skinny on new news. If I wanted the "The Sky is Falling" perspective, I can get that here, or on Lou Dobbs... *chuckle*


Did you even notice the URL?
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
Did you even notice the URL?


Uh, yeah. conservativeusa dot org. This is one of those wierd instances where the obviously left-leaning Col is going to find himself amongst the xenophobic isolationists on the far right.

Not what I would call an unbiased source of information about the proposal. Granted, if you want an issue already chewed, digested and crapped out in an outraged little package, then sites that insist you "Contact your congressmen!!!" and post their titles in angry ALL CAPS are just what you are looking for...
Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top
Not what I would call an unbiased source of information about the proposal. Granted, if you want an issue already chewed, digested and crapped out in an outraged little package, then sites that insist you "Contact your congressmen!!!" and post their titles in angry ALL CAPS are just what you are looking for...


The all caps are headlines. What WILL you believe, a sign from God?
Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top
Not what I would call an unbiased source of information about the proposal. Granted, if you want an issue already chewed, digested and crapped out in an outraged little package, then sites that insist you "Contact your congressmen!!!" and post their titles in angry ALL CAPS are just what you are looking for...


The all caps are headlines. What WILL you believe, a sign from God?


What's the matter? Can't find ONE single "unbaised" source to backup your outrageous accusations?
Reply #25 from JoeUser Forums Top
an't find ONE single "unbaised" source to backup your outrageous accusations?


worldweeklynewsdotnet and newsmux will be spinnin it out pretty soon im sure. surprised they havent already actually.