Search
Forum Home | Login
pseudosoldier
pseudosoldier
Join Date 04/2004
0

Iraqi Elections - Will they mean peace? (A response)

Dear Bahu Virupaksha,

External Link
January 29, 2005 10:57:25 PM from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
I found a few things interesting about this Link recent article:

1. This is the first time that I've noticed the sub-title from the blog doesn't come over to the Forums post. This article's sub-title is, "America Looks for a way out but cant find the escape hatch". This idea is supported in the text by:

Bush has already stated that he wil [sic] withdraw his troops from Iraq if the new government asks for a withdrawl [sic]. It is clear that the USA wants to cut its losses and leave but does not want to do so in a manner that reminds the world of the American departure from Vietnam. It is hoping for a Allawi victory which would give USA more room for manoevring [sic].


If it is "clear" that the US government wants an easy out, why would they hope for Allawi's group to win? Isn't it more likely that a less friendly coalition of parties would vote our ground forces out? Or do you think we'll just be able to say, "Hey, Ayad, little help?"
Many who discussed the option of a either a full population referendum or a legislative decision for this purpose admitted they feared that it would appear that the US was looking for an easy out. I personally feel that it's a nod to the folks who have been questioning our legitimacy of being there in the first place. I think that anyone who would question the US's legal claim to be in Iraq in the first place, but then would also suspect our asking the Iraqis if we should stay as a duplicitous plot are simply looking to paint a target on the US government (or perhaps just Bush's administration).

2. It's the violence that makes the election suspect, but that's the fault of those trying to hold the election? There is a possible Sunni boycott of the process, so this invalidates the process in their eyes? "I'm not going to play the game, just stand here as you take the ball past me to the goal, so therefore you didn't really score..." If the Sunni fear for their lives (and many of them do, with pamphlets being collected on the streets bearing death threats towards anyone heading to the polls or even perhaps being on the street), then it is more understandable for them to not vote. But if they feel that not voting will make a difference (a concept that may be shared by some Americans ), they may find themselves sadly mistaken as they hand over their legitimate place in the government. In this, I agree with your build-up, but not your conclusion.

3. Most characterizations I can find of Allawi depict him as a very political being. The dates I could find for Allawi's membership with the Ba'ath Party are from 1961 (he would have been 17) to 1971 (10 years later). 10 years/59 years is a lifelong membership now... I know some SGTs that might agree with that, as far as the US Army goes, but still.
I, too, would be interested in seeing anything that would point to the Prime Minister's propensity for "using torture against his political rivals and ... [indulging] his passion for killing."

4. I actually agree with your main point, at least in theory. These elections may very well not stop the violence in Iraq. However, I think it will bring that end one very big step closer.
politics
Locked Post
Search this post
Advanced Search
Subscription Options
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
Hyperborean Wanderer
Join Date 10/2004
+1
Reply #1 January 30, 2005 8:40:36 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Testify, Brother!
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
Daiwa
Join Date 07/2001
+351
Reply #2 January 30, 2005 12:53:57 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Nicely done, pseudosoldier.

Time has shown Bahu to be mostly wrong in nearly all of his depressingly pessimistic posts.

Cheers,
Daiwa
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
Bahu Virupaksha
Join Date 09/2004
+6
Reply #3 January 31, 2005 12:59:14 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
I am in agreement with the tone of your post. I am not a defender of Saddam and his thugs, but my point is the Allawi was very much part of the Saddam sheme for many years until they fell out not on the issue of democratising Iraq but some other power gasme. I am in greement with you that whatever be the chances of his returning to power or not, his personal bravery I accept. But not his political judgement.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
daehaksang
Join Date 01/0001
+13
Reply #4 January 31, 2005 11:33:46 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
hey. i followed junielass' link to your blog, hope you don't mind.

i have a question for you.

do you know anything about laws concerning dual citizenship and voting? just wondering...i'm having a hard time finding anything pertaining to exactly what i want.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
Daiwa
Join Date 07/2001
+351
Reply #5 February 1, 2005 4:01:56 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Bahu - Allawi broke with Saddam & the Baathists about 25 years ago I do believe. He hasn't been "very much part of the Saddam scheme" for a long, long time. Whether the falling out meets criteria for your blessing or not, falling out with Saddam for any reason required a certain fortitude. I also challenge you to provide any concrete evidence that Allawi has been anything but a force for good since Saddam was toppled.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
pseudosoldier
Join Date 04/2004
0
Reply #6 February 1, 2005 4:32:10 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
daehaksang -
I don't mind you showing up here at all. It's been awhile since we've talked (I guess since your going away party at that Mexican restaurant?).

Were you talking about dual Iraqi-US citizenship and the recent Iraq elections? From what I can see from news reports on the web, dual citizenship had been outlawed by Saddam. However, once his regime was toppled, the new interim government opened it up to any Iraqis. The stipulations for being able to vote were Iraqi citizenship and being born before 31DEC86 (which would make them 18 by the end of 2004). Iraqi citizenship seems to be simply being born in Iraq, or your father being Iraqi (and having the paperwork to back either of these claims up).
There were many dual citizenship Iraqi-Americans that voted in the recent election.

I hope that helped. If it's not what you were asking, just let me know, and maybe I can dig up some other info. Take care, and stop by whenever you want.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
daehaksang
Join Date 01/0001
+13
Reply #7 February 2, 2005 12:29:45 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Yeah, that's along the lines of what I wanted. It's hard to believe that I can't find the exact information I want. Then again, I could be just not reading things as well as I should. But that does help satisfy my curiousity.

It has been that long. Time flies huh? You are more than welcome to read / comment on my blog; J has a link to me from her's.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
pseudosoldier
pseudosoldier
Join Date 04/2004
0
Reply #8 February 2, 2005 10:19:16 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
You are more than welcome to read / comment on my blog


I'll check it out!

Glad I could help.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
View all recent posts
Mark all posts as read Delete cookies created by the forum Return to Top
Stardock Forums v        Server Load Time:   Page Render Time:
Stardock Entertainment

Press | Support
Copyright © 2025 Stardock Entertainment. The Political Machine is a trademark of Stardock Entertainment. Steam and the Steam logo are trademarks and/or registered trademarks of Valve Corporation in the U.S. and/or other countries. All rights reserved.