Dems continue to look like poor losers...
from 
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Not trying to steal from Dabe's thread, but the same information is circling around in multiple sources.
Here's some choice notes from an article found via Yahoo: Democrats to Force Debate on Ohio Results
By ALAN FRAM, Associated Press Writer
WASHINGTON - A small group of Democrats agreed Thursday to force House and Senate debates on Election Day problems in Ohio before letting Congress certify President Bush's win over Sen. John Kerry in November.
While Bush's victory is not in jeopardy, the Democratic challenge will force Congress to interrupt tallying the Electoral College vote, which had been scheduled to begin at 1 p.m. EST Thursday. It would be only the second time since 1877 that the House and Senate were forced into separate meetings to consider electoral votes.
Sen. Barbara Boxer, D-Calif., signed a challenge mounted by House Democrats to Ohio's 20 electoral votes, which put Bush over the top. By law, a protest signed by members of the House and Senate requires both chambers to meet separately for up to two hours to consider it. Lawmakers are allowed to speak for no more than five minutes each.
So, Bab's Boxer has opted to waste 2 hours of tax-payer funded time debating the results of election that aren't in doubt, just to continue to provide ammunition to a bunch of crazy people that don't believe the results because -- unlike Washington State's King County - where more than 4000 "extra" votes (over and above the registered number of voters there) were included in the counting that eventually ended with a hand-count apparently giving victory to the Democratic candidate who wouldn't quit until after the result she sought was achieved) -- the democratic candidate for President of the U.S. lost.
What a great waste of tax payer money and law maker time.
But... let it go on, please. It is the absolute best chance of completely and totally burying the Democratic party and making it the "fringe" party. As sane individuals sit and watch this goofy theatre, knowing that 63 MILLION people voted for G.W. Bush for President, knowing that he got 52% of the vote, knowing that his victory was real and not imagined, perhaps more of that 58 million that didn't vote for Bush will realize what idiots many of the rest of the 58 million are, and they'll run for the sane position.
Underscoring that the outcome was not in doubt, Kerry, who conceded to Bush the day after the Nov. 2 election, said he would not join the challenge. The four-term Massachusetts senator was in the Middle East, thanking U.S. troops for their service.
In a statement, Kerry said there are "very troubling questions" about the Ohio voting and he would present a plan later to improve voting procedures.
This part is a surprise. Kerry presenting a real plan?!?! Since when. Would this be, what, the 4th or 5th (maybe) actual legislative action that Kerry would (maybe) be able to claim credit for?!
Look, were there problems in Ohio? Yes. 6+ hours waiting to vote is pretty insane - BUT IS THAT THE FAULT OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY or GEORGE W. BUSH? Hell No!!! Blame the local pol's for not begging the fed's for more money for more voting machines. Blame them for not opening more polling places. Blame them for poorly training the poll workers. Blame the rabid anti-Bush voters that ran to the polls and flooded them but did it in such an antagonistic Bush hating and bashing way that it also inspired the pro-Bush people at the grass roots level to get their selves out to vote as well.
Were there enough problems there to over turn the 125,000+ vote margin for Bush? Definitely not. So again, we're stuck taking Ohio (in place of Florida) and making it a cause celeb for fixiing voting issues.
Any -- read that again -- any idiot in Congress or in the Senate can clean a lot of this up right now by drafting legislation that mandates voting standards for the entire country for Presidential elections. It would have to be drafted in such a way as to be constitutional (since the Constitution cedes back to the States large amounts of power in this area), but it could:
... and any number of other improvements that could end all of this carping once and for all.
If Babs Boxer and her friends want to spend time on something, how about on really fixing the problem, rather than creating vague laws like the Help America Vote acts. How about helping these local elections officials rather than abandoning them and telling them that the system has been fixed.
Meanwhile, as a Republican, I hope that they (the Democrats) continue to screw up their party like this. It's great for the Republican party, and will keep up the "hate" so that we can be assured that Republicans will show up to vote in future elections.
Here's some choice notes from an article found via Yahoo: Democrats to Force Debate on Ohio Results
By ALAN FRAM, Associated Press Writer
WASHINGTON - A small group of Democrats agreed Thursday to force House and Senate debates on Election Day problems in Ohio before letting Congress certify President Bush's win over Sen. John Kerry in November.
While Bush's victory is not in jeopardy, the Democratic challenge will force Congress to interrupt tallying the Electoral College vote, which had been scheduled to begin at 1 p.m. EST Thursday. It would be only the second time since 1877 that the House and Senate were forced into separate meetings to consider electoral votes.
Sen. Barbara Boxer, D-Calif., signed a challenge mounted by House Democrats to Ohio's 20 electoral votes, which put Bush over the top. By law, a protest signed by members of the House and Senate requires both chambers to meet separately for up to two hours to consider it. Lawmakers are allowed to speak for no more than five minutes each.
So, Bab's Boxer has opted to waste 2 hours of tax-payer funded time debating the results of election that aren't in doubt, just to continue to provide ammunition to a bunch of crazy people that don't believe the results because -- unlike Washington State's King County - where more than 4000 "extra" votes (over and above the registered number of voters there) were included in the counting that eventually ended with a hand-count apparently giving victory to the Democratic candidate who wouldn't quit until after the result she sought was achieved) -- the democratic candidate for President of the U.S. lost.
What a great waste of tax payer money and law maker time.
But... let it go on, please. It is the absolute best chance of completely and totally burying the Democratic party and making it the "fringe" party. As sane individuals sit and watch this goofy theatre, knowing that 63 MILLION people voted for G.W. Bush for President, knowing that he got 52% of the vote, knowing that his victory was real and not imagined, perhaps more of that 58 million that didn't vote for Bush will realize what idiots many of the rest of the 58 million are, and they'll run for the sane position.
Underscoring that the outcome was not in doubt, Kerry, who conceded to Bush the day after the Nov. 2 election, said he would not join the challenge. The four-term Massachusetts senator was in the Middle East, thanking U.S. troops for their service.
In a statement, Kerry said there are "very troubling questions" about the Ohio voting and he would present a plan later to improve voting procedures.
This part is a surprise. Kerry presenting a real plan?!?! Since when. Would this be, what, the 4th or 5th (maybe) actual legislative action that Kerry would (maybe) be able to claim credit for?!
Look, were there problems in Ohio? Yes. 6+ hours waiting to vote is pretty insane - BUT IS THAT THE FAULT OF THE REPUBLICAN PARTY or GEORGE W. BUSH? Hell No!!! Blame the local pol's for not begging the fed's for more money for more voting machines. Blame them for not opening more polling places. Blame them for poorly training the poll workers. Blame the rabid anti-Bush voters that ran to the polls and flooded them but did it in such an antagonistic Bush hating and bashing way that it also inspired the pro-Bush people at the grass roots level to get their selves out to vote as well.
Were there enough problems there to over turn the 125,000+ vote margin for Bush? Definitely not. So again, we're stuck taking Ohio (in place of Florida) and making it a cause celeb for fixiing voting issues.
Any -- read that again -- any idiot in Congress or in the Senate can clean a lot of this up right now by drafting legislation that mandates voting standards for the entire country for Presidential elections. It would have to be drafted in such a way as to be constitutional (since the Constitution cedes back to the States large amounts of power in this area), but it could:
- establish standards that require easy to use and reliable voting systems which would include AN AUDIT TRAIL and a verifiable reciept that shows a voter who they voted for
- establish a national time frame for voting which could cover all of the U.S. and keep the media from rushing the gun in using exit polling to "call" an election -- make the voting window start at 12:01am on voting day, and make it end at 11:59:59pm on the same day (east coast times, I know it would be 3 hours earlier on the west coast), but set it long enough so that people that work shifts wouldn't be forced to miss work to go vote, and so that in most places people would have well more than enough time to get to the polling places
- establish safe, reliable means of voting via the internet and voting by mail
- require photo ID or other personally veriable information for proof of identification when an individual presents themselves to vote so that we don't have to worry about people voting twice, or more frequently
... and any number of other improvements that could end all of this carping once and for all.
If Babs Boxer and her friends want to spend time on something, how about on really fixing the problem, rather than creating vague laws like the Help America Vote acts. How about helping these local elections officials rather than abandoning them and telling them that the system has been fixed.
Meanwhile, as a Republican, I hope that they (the Democrats) continue to screw up their party like this. It's great for the Republican party, and will keep up the "hate" so that we can be assured that Republicans will show up to vote in future elections.
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