Bush criticizes 'stingy' U.S. remarks (from U.N.)

Link here: Bush Criticizes U.N. 'Stingy' Comment

Some selected materials from that article:

President Bush defended American generosity Wednesday, even as his administration figures out how to pay for more help beyond the $35 million it has already promised to tsunami victims in Asia.
In his first remarks since the weekend disaster that so far has killed more than 76,000, Bush - like some in his administration previously - took umbrage at a U.N. official's suggestion that the world's richest nations were "stingy," and indicated much more is expected to be spent to help the victims.
"Well, I felt like the person who made that statement was very misguided and ill-informed," Bush said from his Texas ranch. "We're a very generous, kindhearted nation, and, you know, what you're beginning to see is a typical response from America."
Bush noted that the United States provided $2.4 billion "in food, in cash, in humanitarian relief to cover the disasters for last year. ... That's 40 percent of all the relief aid given in the world last year."



... and:


As of Wednesday, dozens of countries and relief groups had pledged at least $261 million in help for South and East Asia, said the Geneva-based U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs.
"There's no doubt there'll be more than that," said Jamie McGoldrick, the U.N. officer in charge of coordinating the international response from Switzerland. "The size of this thing is a challenge."
But measuring the generosity of the United States depends on the yardstick.
The U.S. government is always near the top in total humanitarian aid dollars - even before private donations are counted - but it finishes near the bottom of the list of rich countries when that money is compared to gross national product.
Such figures were what prompted Jan Egeland - the United Nations' emergency relief coordinator and former head of the Norwegian Red Cross - to challenge the giving of rich nations.
"We were more generous when we were less rich, many of the rich countries," Egeland said. "And it is beyond me, why are we so stingy, really. ... Even Christmas time should remind many Western countries at least how rich we have become."
Egeland told reporters Tuesday his complaint wasn't directed at any nation in particular.



(in regards to that last part, it was obviously directed at the nations that don't give such a high percentage of their GDP...)

more:


Natsios was quick to point out Tuesday that foreign assistance for development and emergency relief rose from $10 billion in President Clinton's last year to $24 billion under President Bush in 2003. Powell said U.S. assistance for this week's earthquake and tsunamis alone will eventually exceed $1 billion.
"The notion that the United States is not generous is simply not true, factually," Natsios said.
The United States uses the most common measure of the Paris-based Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, a group of 30 rich nations that counts development aid.
By that measure, the United States spent almost $15.8 billion for "official development assistance" to developing countries in 2003. Next closest was Japan, at $8.9 billion.
That doesn't include billions more the United States spends in other areas, such as AIDS and HIV programs and other U.N. assistance.
Measured another way, as a percentage of gross national product, the OECD's figures on development aid show that as of April, none of the world's richest countries donated even 1 percent of its gross national product. Norway was highest, at 0.92 percent; the United States was last, at 0.14 percent.



But here we come to the real problem. People look at the U.S. and use these misleading and easily corruptable statistics to say that the U.S. is stingy when part of the problem is that countries such as Norway have such a small GDP in relative comparison that they come no where near the totals we (the U.S.) do in terms of money given in aid to the rest of the world.

Statistics to prove that point are here: List of countries by GDP (nominal)

Compare the U.S. to Norway for example. The U.S. is at the top of the list with a GDP of (in millions of USD, 2003 year listed) 10,881,609. Compare that to Norway, at number 22 on the list with a GDP of 221,579. If I do the math correctly, Norway's GDP is literally 2% that of the U.S. Even Japan's GDP, number two on the list, is less than half (just under 40%) of the size of the U.S.'s.

If you take those corruptable numbers from the percent of GDP given in aid and multiply them out, you still see that Norway and other nations are contributing far less in REAL DOLLARS than the U.S. and Japan for example.

As always, it seems that U.N., and it's Euro dominated membership, looks at the U.S. and screams for us to be the saviors of the world while also insulting us for not generating enough money for them (the U.N.) to waste in kick backs and bribery schemes that keep horrific regimes in power.
6,681 views 22 replies
Reply #1 Top
Guess what, nobody called the US stingy. Find me a link where they did.
Reply #2 Top
It wasn't directed at any particular "named" nation, but it was a very easily perceived swipe at the U.S


the immediate reactions here from the right were clear enough. how dare the UN call the US stingy. quick answer they didn't. he could have just as easily been talking about the EU. A direct look at the numbers in the US make it seem as though we don't give, but they only include government money and do not include money and manpower from charitable organizations. Mr Engeland does not feel as though the US is one of those countries that do not give enough, and stated so. Its entirely a media event powered by those looking for "America haters" everywhere.
Reply #3 Top
the immediate reactions here from the right were clear enough. how dare the UN call the US stingy. quick answer they didn't.


Again, you want to play semantic games.

Ok, all people that make statements like the one I quote directly above are morons. Now, have I called you a moron or haven't I?
Reply #4 Top
Reply By: whoman69    Posted: Wednesday, December 29, 2004
Guess what, nobody called the US stingy. Find me a link where they did.


It wasn't directed at any particular "named" nation, but it was a very easily perceived swipe at the U.S., where it's perceived that we do not tax our citizens enough and do not direct enough taxes to relief efforts.

Unfortunately, as noted, it ignores relief efforts through many other means, and complete ignores the total REAL DOLLAR amounts that the U.S. and it's citizens provide in relief to the world.

Bush was right for saying the individual was mis-guided in the comments, and the individual was right to back track so obviously once reporters really started pinning him down on the comments and what they meant. (And btw, if the comments weren't aimed at the U.S., why'd the individual have to clarify them, declare them out of context, mis-spoken, poorly worded, etc., in response to U.S. media?)

... and btw, I'm nobodies web search engine flunky. If you want to take exception to comments, that's fine, but don't phrase them in a way that implies that someone else needs to work for you. I work for a living, as opposed to many liberals that seem to feel the world owes them something and if we just raise taxes a little more we can have the government pay for it.
Reply #5 Top
Again, you want to play semantic games.

Ok, all people that make statements like the one I quote directly above are morons. Now, have I called you a moron or haven't I?


"It wasn't like that...well you see...he really meant to say....you're a moron," Citizen terpfan1980. Great debating tactics.
Reply #6 Top

I think the president's response was right on the money. He calmly expressed his disagreement, shook the cheap shot off, and moved the American government into action. Bush is accustomed to getting bashed. But is telling that Old Europe's immediate reaction to the tragedy was to use it as a platform to bash America. Aren't UN personnel supposed to be diplomats? Why then do we subsidize an organization bent on America's destruction?
Reply #7 Top

the immediate reactions here from the right were clear enough. how dare the UN call the US stingy. quick answer they didn't. he could have just as easily been talking about the EU. A direct look at the numbers in the US make it seem as though we don't give, but they only include government money and do not include money and manpower from charitable organizations. Mr Engeland does not feel as though the US is one of those countries that do not give enough, and stated so. Its entirely a media event powered by those looking for "America haters" everywhere.


So, the UN in no way implied the US in their statement? Can you find me the quote where he corrects himself and explicitly states that he did mean the US?

Reply #8 Top
I work for a living, as opposed to many liberals that seem to feel the world owes them something and if we just raise taxes a little more we can have the government pay for it.


WHOOOHOO! Sa-lam! Gotta love it! You tell'em tf80.

Whenever the US gives aid to other countries for disasters, etc., all it does is buy us derision and cheap shots (but we continue to give anyway, a tribute to our nation's generosity).

I guess mom was right.....you can't buy friends. Hmmm......maybe we should stop trying. Wonder what they'd all do then?
Reply #9 Top
So, the UN in no way implied the US in their statement? Can you find me the quote where he corrects himself and explicitly states that he did mean the US?


Its been posted on other threads. If you're too lazy to look then you're too lazy.
Reply #11 Top
Its been posted on other threads. If you're too lazy to look then you're too lazy.


There's so many threads though. If you could just tell me the name of one with the quote, that'll be enough for me.
Reply #12 Top
Its been posted on other threads. If you're too lazy to look then you're too lazy.
---whoman69

there you go
--whoman69

You're such a sweet person, w69. You just make me all gooey inside. What's with the 'tude, dude?


Reply #13 Top
From what I read, he never ever states that he wasn't talking about the US. Although he's not focusing his remark entirely on the US, he is most likely referring to them too. Of course, it might be a coincidence that the percent of GDP he mentioned is about the same percent of GDP that the US dedicates to foreign assistance.
Reply #14 Top
Even though he did not specifically mention the US, there is very little doubt in anyones mind that he was refering to the US.
Reply #15 Top
Even though he did not specifically mention the US, there is very little doubt in anyones mind that he was refering to the US.


Especially to thin skinned conservatives.
Reply #16 Top
Especially to thin skinned conservatives.


And if there's anyone who knows thin-skinned when they see it, it's a liberal.
But, then, maybe they can't see it. This would explain quite a bit. Look, is there REALLY any doubt that he was talking about the US? Anybody? Is there anyone here, lib or cons, who has any doubt about this fact? Debate it all you want, but he meant us, as in US. You know, this keeps going back and forth with little change in the outcome. I say this...you say that. Look: he meant to impugn the US, and say we're stingy. How can he say this? i don't know. Maybe he really is uninformed; then again, maybe he's just a pretentious asshole who, as a UN diplomat, expects the US to carry the weight of the world and once again wipe the world's ass, just like we always do.
Reply #17 Top
Especially to thin skinned conservatives.


To whom was he referring if not the US? France?
Reply #18 Top
To whom was he referring if not the US? France?


Perhaps, the fact of the matter is he never said the the United States was stingy. Let's say for example you are rich. If there is a local charity drive and the chairman of that drive says some of the rich people were not giving enough, would that person be talking about you. If the shoe fits, wear it. If not move on and stop being so whiney. Now he's gone overboard and sent the national guard just to make the UN look bad. How many millions is that going to cost? Anyone that knows about international disaster knows that the bulk of America's efforts come in the name of our charitable organizations.
Reply #19 Top
Anyone that knows about international disaster knows that the bulk of America's efforts come in the name of our charitable organizations.


You're back to the rose colored glasses again.

You speak in terms of "anyone that knows", unfortunately much of the world either doesn't "know" or doesn't care to know.

The rest of the world revolves around handing money to their governments, and let their governments do things. That is now how things work here, and when lesser informed individuals from countries with high tax rates compare themselves to the U.S. they see a large gap -- without knowing or assuming anything about the charitable contributions you say anyone knows about.

Whether it mentioned the U.S. or not, it was a swipe, it hit us (U.S. citizens) and we were rightfully incensed about it. As noted, the guy wouldn't have been stumbling all over himself to try to clarify and apologize if he hadn't have done it.

It stands as yet another attempt by the holier than thou U.N. types to dictate that our tax structure isn't correct, and that as always, the U.S. is wrong, wrong, wrong.

Check out my other article where another (former?) U.N. type bitches and moans that the U.S. efforts are undermining the U.N. Yet more example of the U.N. types saying how wrong we are.


Finally, one quick thought here - much of this issue comes from the thought among the relief organization types, as happened with the Red Cross after 9/11 in this country, to be too concerned with looking ahead and wanting to sit on a huge nest egg of money that they'll have available in the future. They're constantly concerned that the money won't be there when they need it, so they try to tug at our heart strings and get us to give as much as possible, then they want to sit on the money and save it for the next rainy day, or several rainy days. All in the assumption that we won't belly up to the bar when needed or that they won't have the money they need to even get started with relief efforts.

The Red Cross did in this country, and it got them in major trouble when people saw how much money was collected, with only a small percentage going back out to victims of 9/11. We were all giving until it hurt, but we wanted it to go where to victims. When the Red Cross tried to budget those contributions to save a large percentage for the future, there was an up-roar. The answer from contributors like myself was that we'd gladly dig into our wallets again when needed, but that we had given for the now, and not for the future.

When the Hurricanes hit this year, I dug down again, and I've dug down for other purposes too. I don't need the U.N. to tell my country to take more from me in taxes so that I can be a lazy bastard and not have to make contributions to causes of my own choosing.
Reply #20 Top

Perhaps, the fact of the matter is he never said the the United States was stingy. Let's say for example you are rich. If there is a local charity drive and the chairman of that drive says some of the rich people were not giving enough, would that person be talking about you. If the shoe fits, wear it. If not move on and stop being so whiney.


Considering he was talking about donations in the form of GDP and considering the numbers he mentioned are around the same numbers the US government gives, I really doubt it's a stretch to think the US is one of the countries to which he is referring.


Now he's gone overboard and sent the national guard just to make the UN look bad.


Perhaps you're overreacting, and it's a complete coincidence that Bush is doing things outside the UN to help the victims. Unless you could post a quote in which he says he's trying to undermine the UN, one can pretend that it has nothing to do whatsoever with the UN just like the quote about rich nations being too stingy can mean every nation OTHER than the US.

Reply #21 Top
Now he's gone overboard and sent the national guard just to make the UN look bad


Shows what you DON'T know!!! He's using the national guard planes to deliver aid you fool! How is he supposed to get stuff there? Wiggle his nose? Does the UN have an air force to accomplish what the national guard is doing?
Reply #22 Top

Reply #15 By: whoman69 - 1/1/2005 9:50:09 PM
Even though he did not specifically mention the US, there is very little doubt in anyones mind that he was refering to the US.


Especially to thin skinned conservatives.


The opposite of no-brained liberals.