General Pants General Pants

Scientific Accuracy Mod

Scientific Accuracy Mod

Preview of a work in progressI

Just wanted to let folks know that I will be putting up a mod on Nexus sometime in the next month or so. This mod, or rather series of mods, is an attempt to add some quantitative and qualitative science to the game, based on recent research and observations. These mods should be somewhat modular, in that you can swap them out (except you will need Stars for Systems). My goal is to offer a mod that changes the game only to make it more realistic, without disturbing the underlying gameplay too badly (except where demanded by realism). Here are some features:

 

STARS:

Mostly just window-dressing. The stars in the mod actually look more dull than in the vanilla game, and are harder to tell apart by color, but that is closer to reality. Also, because of how the game is programmed, there is no variation among stars of the same type, which was something I tried desperately to achieve.

 

  • All of the major spectral types are represented
    • Except O, it is too rare
    • Carbon stars are not implemented, and I'm not sure I should bother
    • No purple stars (I've considered adding purple and green as 'Precursor stars')
    • All four types of brown dwarf are here (and they aren't brown, either)
    • All of the main types are available in dwarf (main-sequence) and giant sizes (sorry, no supergiants or hypergiants, they are too rare. )
  • Scientifically accurate RGB colors for the photosphere and in the corona effects
  • Mathematically converted brightness and radius based on logarithmic transformations
  • Giant stars take up more than one hex (and you can't pass through the extra hexes)
  • Protostars, with accretion disks (I'm kind of proud of this one)
  • Stellar remnants are enabled, including:
    • True white dwarfs (not the main-sequence dwarf in the game)
    • Neutron stars
    • Quark stars (I just made up how they look, but it is sparkly and neat... that's science)
    • Pulsars (these are cool, but I may need to ask Stardock about how to get the effect right)
    • Magnetars

 

 

STAR SYSTEMS:

The heart of realism is, in this case, the systems. The proportions and salient characteristics of stars are actually worked out here.

 

  • Proportions of star types directly reflect proportions in the galaxy (lots of red dwarfs)
  • Multiple star systems are present and abundant, and they aren't all the built-in binary kind
  • Systems will actually have habitable planets based on the star type (so, F, G, and K stars are the most likely to have habitable planets, and multiple habitable planets)
  • Yes, there will be habitable worlds for red dwarfs. It could happen.
  • Stars are represented by color-coded icons on the strategic map (bigger for giants), so you can direct your exploration toward likely candidates
  • Many different system configurations, based on recent observations. Systems vary by:
    • star type
    • number of stars
    • age
    • mass
    • degree of gas giant migration
  • Systems go in logical chains: for most there is a young version, and old version, and giant version, and a remnant version
  • Special non-habitable planet types fill the systems out:
    • Chthonian planets
    • Hot Jupiters
    • Rogue planets (may have habitable ones someday)
    • Dwarf planets (can be mined)
  • I plan to add megastructures (ringworlds, sphereworlds, 'panel worlds') if I can work out the graphics

 

 

PLANETS:

Science fiction is about worlds. Worlds are some of the most important characters in sci fi, and I think the worlds in the game should be as diverse as they are in science fiction while also reflecting current scientific thought. Because of the abundance of so-called Super Earths (which have, on average, higher surface gravities), much of this has centered around gravity levels.

 

  • Worlds are unique, like they are in science fiction
    • All planets will have traits
    • Planet trait names have been changed to sound more sciency or science fiction-y, and less glib
    • There will be ultimately be many types (I have 200 spec'd out, but that will NEVER happen, there are about ten new ones actually implemented now)
    • Their abundances are based on what little information is available, but you should have only a few worlds of the same type in any empire!
    • I plan to add worlds from science fiction, including the well-thought-out planets of Niven's Known Space series
    • Includes habitable moons and double planets
    • May later include habitable rings, habitable nebulae (the Smoke Ring)... maybe not
    • No gas planets... that doesn't make much sense: the chances of life evolving on a gas giant, much less evolving intelligence, is just about nil. Add to that the fact that no one else can or would colonize a bottomless mass of gas... Bespin was not a colony, it was a mining base.
  • Easily colonized worlds will be the exception, not the rule ('vanilla' planets are likely to be much more rare than, say, frozen worlds)
    • All planets have a gravity rating, and there are low-and high-gravity versions of many worlds (there is one super-heavy type, microgravity is on hold for later)
    • Most planets in the habitable zone will be habitable, but most will require some technology. Eventually all will be habitable, with the right technology.
    • Extreme planets are more complex now, with 'marginally extreme' planets (as implemented in other mods) as well as super-extreme worlds
    • Implements heavy and unstable types of extreme worlds
    • Has several new types of 'extreme' planets (light, volcanic, iron, extreme weather)
    • Some planets have more than one trait
    • Has 'extreme branches' (e.g., the Barren branch) with multiple planet types that require similar technologies and procedures to colonize
    • The planet icon system has been changed. Icons are color-coded by extreme branch, and shape-coded by gravity (heavy planets have square symbols, light planets have bullet-shaped symbols)
    • Extreme planets will no longer be better than other planets (the vanilla game has to entice you to colonize them, here you won't have much choice
    • Mars is now extreme (it is probably best considered barren, but I came up with a new category so you could colonize it immediately)
  • Planets use the same radius transformation as stars (i.e., they are 'in scale')
  • When you get new colonization technologies, you get more hexes on your planets (basically, when you get frozen colonization you can colonize Antarctica)
  • Planet class selection has been redone so that class is selected from a curve of possible values rather than flat probabilities (class 11 is average, most planets cluster around there). There are different curves for different worlds
  • Planet class selection is now based on stated criteria, such as how much space there is to live on the world.
  • Planet traits are now all 'physical,' relating to the natural characteristics of the world. Cultural planet traits (such as the 'ghost world') have been relegated to Precursor Worlds where they belong
PRECURSORS?:
If all that is ever done, I have a ream of new Precursor worlds I'd like to try. That gets into a lot of other stuff, like events. For now, I have just modded the existing Precursor Worlds to fit in with everything else (i.e., their planet class selection now makes statistical sense).

 

 

Promises promises, right? Wrong. This is here. Right now, Stars is past Beta, everything listed here works, and it is simply a matter of me putting it together into a package for Nexus and testing the install. Systems is in alpha: the systems are spec'd out, but only a sample are programmed (for testing purposes, everything works). Planets is still in development, although the pieces are already in place. I'm still working on the game design aspects. This is a project I am working on while I am on sick leave, so it is slow going.

I will try to get some screenshots when I can. I'm sure some of you modders out there are eager to take this thing apart and use the parts for your own mods, so I'll do my best to document and provide background so you understand what I did and why. If you care.

NOTE: Not all of these concepts or the executions are original. I will endeavor to include credits for the major ideas and original implementations. Rest assured, the work itself is my own, and not a hack of someone else's mod.

 

269,190 views 63 replies
Reply #51 Top

Quoting leiavoia, reply 50

Let's see if we can get some developer feedback to make this work.

It might be worth a try. I've never seen the site you list, but the Devs read these forums too.

The problem is, the devs' job is to make the game playable to the common gamer, not to make it modable to one idiot. They made these changes for a reason, and my bet is that reason is playability. They are essentially cosmetic changes that make systems simpler/ more readable (except the system probability code, not sure why that is the way it is, but they mut have had a reason to change it). And there are similar, much older issues like the planet selection system, that have been known for a long time and 0still apparently haven't been addressed (rumor has it, I haven't had time to check).

The shipyard doesn't work effectively, the fleet builder is incomplete, and those are both playability and customizability issues that affect a much larger number of players. The simple fact is that this is NOT a simulation of the real galaxy, and most players play for the play experience, not for the creative aspects of the game, much less modability. They may lose, at most, one player by not addressing the issues I brought up.  If I were them, I would put this on the way way back burner (like GCIV back burner), behind the shipyard and fleet builder issues they haven't even acknowledged.

 

Reply #52 Top

OK, sorry for all the drama. A quick pep talk from another modder (thank you!) has me looking for ways around the issues and ways to keep going. Maybe we can get some progress with the devs, but until we do, here's my plan, divided into smaller, bite-sized chunks.

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod I: Stars. This is core mod.

  • The stars as I have them now. That way others can mod them, and there will be some basic science out there (not to denigrate any of the other great star mods out there, they are each scientific in their way). The probabilities will be eyeballed, but what can you do?
  • Dwarf planets, because there is no reason not to.
  • Hot jupiters, neptunes, and earths, chthonic planets, and maybe rock giants should all be in there.
  • A set of preliminary systems. These will be simple systems like in the game now, but designed so that if the devs fix the code, they will be more what I want them to be. Still not 'scientifically accurate,' but better.
  • Binary and trinary systems, because that seems to be what people are interested in. This is where my effort is going right now.

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod II: Planets 1. This is a simple mod, previously unannounced. I'm tired of the same three gas giants.

  • New textures and gradients for giant planets (one or two borrowed from others, several adapted from GC2).
  • Hopefully some new gradients and textures for dead and uninhabited worlds, maybe some new gradients for habitable worlds.
  • New planet class distributions to make planet class behave more like a natural variable and not a flat distribution.
  • A new radius function to bring planets into the scale system of stars (no, they won't be tiny, habitables will be smaller, giants larger, but all will be quite visible).
  • Radii for planets will be distributed rather than simple flat probabilities.

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod III: Systems 1. This will introduce more accurate systems.

  • Assuming the code hasn't been changed yet, systems with more lanes.
  • This means fewer systems per map. Boo!
  • More distinct system types, based on science (science!).
  • System types with frequencies approximating real ones (again, the more they fix the engine, if ever, the better I can do this).
  • More multiple star systems.
  • Home systems (including Gauntlet's, thanks man!) will be redone to fit in better.

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod II: Planets 2. This will be the first run at more realistic planets.

  • Most planets should have traits, most traits will be extreme. This is as much to make planets more unique as to make them really 'extreme.'
  • True 'extreme' planets will be more common, and 'shirt-sleeve colonizable' planets will be more rare.
  • Most planets will be, in some way, unique. Large maps will obviously have repeats.
  • Planet types based on science will be included.
  • New planet arts.
  • Heavy and tectonically unstable worlds MAY be introduced, but I don't want to really change the tech tree yet.
  • Again, proportions will likely have to be eyeballed, since the probabilities don't seem to work in the galciv map generator.

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod III: Systems 2 This is contingent on them fixing some of the code.

  • The systems from Systems 1 will be compacted back down to normal size so you can have more per map.
  • More system twiddling. Hopefully by then I will have the automatic generator up and running and there will be hundreds of systems (taking a long time to generate maps), and each one really will be unique.

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod II: Planets 3. This will be the second run at more realistic planets. This will likely wait to see if they do a third expansion.

  • More 'classes' of extreme planet (carbon worlds, weather worlds, runaway greenhouse planets [that's a biggie], hopefully moons).
  • Obviously new planet arts. I'm looking forward to adding phosphorus, sulfur, and carbon textures! Yay geology!
  • Hopefully new race traits (fully aquatic, methane, ammonia);
  • Extensive new techs for the above, and a revamp of how colonization works to be more realistic.

General Pant's Civilization Pack. This will be a separate, expanding mod done along the way in the vein of/ in tribute to Gauntlet's Race Mod. It will have the option of integrating into the latest GPSAM iteration as we go. The first races are awaiting fixes to glitches in the ship designer. So far, they will be the el-cheapo ones with smaller ship sets, easier citizen portraits, or done ships: See: https://forums.galciv3.com/481533/page/1/#3666926.

 

No release dates have been set, but I am again planning to release GPSAM I: Stars before I leave for vacation in early July (and will not have regular access to the Internet). Th June 19th deadline does not seem feasible at this time. I have too much to do in the next week and a half. Some of it involves cool extinct critters, though!

 

Reply #53 Top

On the advice of another modder, I thought I'd challenge myself. Here is eight hours' work on gas giants:

http://i.imgur.com/zs1yCJr.jpg

Reply #54 Top

Plan looks good, General Pants, and so do those gas giants!

Reply #55 Top

Quoting ScrivenerOfLight, reply 54

Plan looks good, General Pants, and so do those gas giants!

Thanks, the encouragement helps. Much of the credit for the textures goes to GC2 and LogicSequence's HRGM textures. I have tried to track him/ her down on here, to no avail. That mod was a real inspiration.

Now back to reprogramming my PERL script so I can input multiple star systems. Gotta give the people what they want!

 

Reply #56 Top

Spamming my own thread. I have found that updating this thread forces me to refocus. one of the reasons this is taking so long, and the reason it seems so disorganized, it that I have terrible adult ADD and I have yet to find a medication that really helps. ADD is a real pain in the ass. I am alternating between scripting and making new planet graphics right now. The more I switch around, the easier it is to stay focused.

Scripting the systems is alternatingly intense, boring, and frustrating.The programming for translating codes for multiple stars (up to four, five is just too many) is complete now, but not fully tested. That took some real work, since I didn't intend the original script to do it, and I had to figure out how to fit them on screen.

The next script, which may not be done before beta, is to generate system codes automatically. I need a model for planetary systems, so that I don't have to program every variation in by hand. But now I need to develop an explicit solar system models and make a script that will 1) reproduce them, 2) extend the model to different system configurations, and 3) extend the model to multiple stars. Not all of these have to be done before beta, but if I can, I'd like to. Mostly, again, to get the multiple stars out there.

Dwarf planets are really getting my goat, because the graphics don't really look good. Again, a ship component that is just a plain, mono-textured sphere would help.

Packaging is a strategy, and one I'm really struggling with. Compatibility with other mods is an issue, and making it easy to incorporate updates from Stardock into the mods is an issue. Staging is also an issue, especially with making installation tractable for non-modders (I don't want instructions that say "take this file out of this mod," it needs to be automatic). I'd like to find a way to allow people to take parts of some mods and use them separately (especially the planet graphics). The .xml system is NOT designed that way!

On the other hand, the giants look even better than they do above. I would like to emphasize that the new planet arts will mostly NOT be scientific. Some parts will be: the sizes will be better, rings will be more likely, moons will be everywhere (of course, only one per giant), but colors are kind of imaginative, and won't correlate with size or chemistry in any meaningful way. Dead planets aren't presenting nearly as many problems. I may post a quick tutorial on how to do planet arts. The full GPSAM: Planets I may slow your load times and galaxy generation quite a bit.

P.S. For Horemvore: I think I have a way to do habitable gas giants now. I'll let you know.

Reply #57 Top

GPSAM_Stars_0.01b is almost out. I am sorting out a Windows file handling issue.

Has anyone ever encountered the problem where Windows won't update file modification dates or file transfers? I moved some files to a subfolder, and they stopped working. I moved them back and they still didn't work. I recopied them from another folder, and GCIII still can't access them. I'm pretty sure it is a Windows problem, because the modification date issue has occurred outside of GCIII.

Anyway, as soon as everyone can agree that there are texture files in the folder, I will upload to Nexus. In the meantime, I am working on gas giant gradients. I now have 54 textures (ok, half of them are just less extreme versions of the other half), and about 71 gradients (about half are inverses of the other half). A ludicrous map shouldn't have many repeats. I'll stop when I start seeing Jupiter generated randomly. or when I run out of relatively unique options. Loading may take a while.

UPDATE: The problem is not with Windows apparently. I am in the process of going through each file now. Fun! Can anyone think of why the particle effects and halo show up, but not the star textures themselves? The texture files appear to be fine, and are available to the mod. It is weird.

For posterity: the problem, documented elsewhere, is that textures won't load if you have periods in your folder names. Not difficult to avoid!

Reply #58 Top

The Beta is up!

 

GPSAM I: Stars

This mod will have its own page, I will add the link here ASAP. Please put material related to the mod there, so I can keep it organized! I will continue to update on other aspects of GPSAM here.

Link to dedicated topic here.

Reply #59 Top

Quoting General, reply 53

General Pant's Scientific Accuracy Mod II: Planets 1. This is a simple mod, previously unannounced. I'm tired of the same three gas giants.

New textures and gradients for giant planets (one or two borrowed from others, several adapted from GC2).
Hopefully some new gradients and textures for dead and uninhabited worlds, maybe some new gradients for habitable worlds.
New planet class distributions to make planet class behave more like a natural variable and not a flat distribution.
A new radius function to bring planets into the scale system of stars (no, they won't be tiny, habitables will be smaller, giants larger, but all will be quite visible).
Radii for planets will be distributed rather than simple flat probabilities.

This may be divided up: I'm likely to punt the planet quality curves until a later mod and keep this one completely window-dressing, It may come with files to either change only the dead worlds or all the arts. I'd like to give people options, and the ability to use these textures in as many ways as possible and with as many other mods as possible. The devs (quite reasonably) didn't spend as much time on the dead planet graphics, and I'd like to make better ones available to as broad an audience as possible.

I'm considering changing the name on this one... it isn't really "scientifically accurate," so much as it is pretty. Well, prettier, anyway. I could just say that GPSAM in this case stands for "General Pants' System Aesthetics Mod." Details.

Reply #60 Top

General Pants' Super Awesome Mod

Reply #61 Top

Another look at the giants... luck of the draw had these a little too similar, but if you add the ones up top, you get an idea of the diversity that 50 textures x 100 gradients will give you:

http://i.imgur.com/q0ouB8z.jpg

Also, a preview of the dead planets so far... they won't be this big, this is for testing:

http://i.imgur.com/QVnDmGr.jpg

Reply #62 Top

GPSAM will feature asteroids and dwarf planet that are a more accurate very light grey instead of the bizarre brown used in the game. If I can mod the asteroid ship components, I will try to do that as well.

Reply #63 Top

As announced elsewhere, all parts of this mod are on hold for v3.0, and for when my personal situation calms down. I have the gas giants mostly done, the uninhabitables are a bear. Right now I'm playing Shogun to distract myself. To quote a dude who lost his job for shooting off his mouth, "I shall return."