UNDER promise, OVER deliver thread

You know... it's funny that you say that, because I was just thinking about how much I wanted to give it a try, but would have to wait until my vacation is over as my laptop doesn't have the horsepower that my desktop does (and I'm not at home)...

In response to your actual question:

There are probably two broad strategies that you can pursue with DLC that doesn't turn Ashes into a pay-to-play scam that's a bad deal for most players.

One would be to follow the Riot/LoL model and have some DLC that is primarily cosmetic improvements - where you can pay to get a cool skin in LoL that has not actual gameplay value - in Ashes some of the DLC could include interesting cosmetic ship parts, visual effects or the like...

The second tack to take would be DLC that improves gameplay experience that, with MP, could be available to all players in a game so long as one of the players has the DLC.  For example, cool maps - a game sponsor (as I stated above, I have yet to load up Ashes, I assume someone sponsors the match) that has "cool map xyz" can play said map with anyone he/she matches up with, even if those other players do not have the DLC...

I'll reserve this space for other thoughts on structuring asymmetric DLC attainment across the player base... 

cheers

I learned from FPS games that the biggest downside to DLC maps is that it SPLITS THE COMMUNITY! That's not good for multiplayer especially at release. Both of your current ideas do this.

I seem to recall the map editor was planned for DLC. You could do that, assuming you can make it ready by release or soon after. You'll want a way to share maps so friends could play the maps they create, though I suspect steam workshop support is a little ambitious to try to get done by release.

Yes, an art-based DLC (avatars, skins, icons, visual and sound effects, music) is frequently encountered in Deluxe rewards. Maybe there's something you can do with UI recoloring. You can add some special Steam achievements and Steam gifts.

But for folks like me who don't care about those things, just the gameplay experience, you'll want something else. Can you make a special match creation screen with a lot more customization options for the DLC? Unit speed, income rate, starting resources, starting resource capacity, other stuff many have been begging for in unranked matches. People without the DLC would get the standard options screen that we have now, but would still be able to join highly customized MP matches created by people with the DLC. Continuous advertising for the DLC

A little controversial, but the DLC could enable zooming out and/or zooming in an additional 25-50%. It's not clear anyone gets a tangible advantage by zooming out further, and more zoom in would be nice for folks who want to admire the unit art.

If I come up with more ideas, I'll post them in new comments.

Wasn't there a Sins DLC with, like more interesting worlds or something?

How did that work with MP?

Disclaimer: MP and selling DLCs aren't my forte, so use my input at your own risk!

What would cripple the MP experience? I can come up with:

• Split of the community, by not allowing certain players to join certain games ("thinning the graph")
• MP gameplay advantages for DLC-owners
• ...others?

Stuff that doesn't violate the above:

• Purely cosmetic changes (as mentioned above: theming, music, sounds; probably limited possibilities for an RTS)
• Extra offline applications (benchmarks/demos/sandbox mode, map editor, unit viewer with stats database, ...)
• Additional settings and options (although it's kinda weird to "sell" those separately, should be available to all)

What would also work (as mentioned already), are "asymmetric" features, where:

• ... only the host needs to have the DLC (maps, extra settings, extra AI ?)
• ... only owners can use options, but others can still play against them (extra race?!)

The host-only stuff might work okay, and give a slight incentive towards buying the DLC. The non-host stuff might give a strong incentive for buying the DLC (for example, if the Substrate, or a 3rd race, would be in the DLC, only the owners can choose the race, but others could play against them!), but perhaps the incentive will be too strong and make non-owners feel like the content is being rubbed in their faces?

I don't think maps in the DLC are a good idea. If the game already has a map editor, people can create their own maps and use maps made by others. I actually do not recall seeing any expansion/DLCs for a strategy games that involved only maps.

Some ideas:

 - Sandbox/unit test mode where we can try out different unit combinations in a controlled setting

 - A unit coloring option where we can customize the color of our units. The original Dawn of War did a good job with this. If we can choose from different unit models, even better.

 - I don't know how the campaign is shaping up, but extra campaign missions are another option.

And one point on branding: please do not call it a Day 0 DLC. That phrase has become incredibly toxic in the gaming community and will only attract a lot of unwarranted negative publicity to AoTS. Deluxe bundle/enhanced edition sounds much better.

I say keep the price at $49.99 and keep the day 0 DLC included in the base game, if a game is good people will buy it no matter what price.

Another suggestion is to have 2 game Pack and 4 game Pack.

Another thing that could be part of a DLC:

Colorization/theming of units, and especially drawing/importing a logo/flag, that then is displayed on every unit, but prominently on buildings and dreadnoughts! Of course, my theme/logo/flag would be shown to other players in MP (on my units)!

EDIT: The themes and logos would naturally make different players' armies look like belonging to different PHC/Substrate/XYZ "factions", and would make more plausible why they're fighting each other!

frog, you DID succeed in repelling my from that pile of crap,poisons and mutagens, so I will NOT be spending any more on 'new' game franchses with your mob nor on the elementally bad mess.

harpo, the ghost NON-subscriber

Dont make day 0 DLC. This is not a racing game, where you can sell additional cars or something on day 1 as part of some season pass. Neither is this FPS, where the additional multiplayer maps are worth of separate DLC pack... i would certainly not pay for just bunch of maps for RTS game, not 15 EUROs for sure.

There are many things worth the money, like additional gameplay elements and aspects (like things added to Sins with Entrenchement and Diplomacy expansions, making the game more rich and varied), then additional units and entire factions, perhaps some kind of additional single-player experience (something like general challenge in CnC Generals or SpecOps mission in Call of Duties), map editor...

I cant see how any of those could be optional on day 1 and not part of the base game though.

Just sell the game for 39,99  and fuck StarCraft and their pricing schemes.

I've been thinking, instead of maps or other in-game content. How about soundtrack, wallpapers, avatars, maybe an artbook, developer commentary and other stuff for the "deluxe version"?

With regard to pricing, there must be a price elasticity study available somewhere that will allow you to assess if the difference between $39.99 vs. $49.99 in terms of number of units sold, will be materially different.

And from there, you can use that info to determine what to include or not include.

Do NOT sell day 0 DLC. Gamers and the gaming press will tear you apart.

As others have said, this is not Starcraft. Starcraft has SP campaigns of very high production levels, a huge reputation behind it and a massive already in-place MP community. Ashes should stick to one price.

If you really want to do one perhaps eventually do a collectors DLC with the game music and lots of developer art etc. or something for enthusiasts who like that sort of thing.

Gamers like the idea that everything done before release is in the base game. Even DLC a couple of weeks after release is a bad idea as people will think it was already ready and could have been in the base game. Give it a couple of months at least before doing DLC.

If you do day 0 DLC, especially at that crazy price, I believe it will end very badly.

Good feedback guys!

You almost make me belive this really got cancer everywhere,thats wy this is in this days the most active game im in.

I just can tell ...Its too soon for DLC even just has a gift, you will notice if this goes that many will complain about the miss features,and carefull at this time like aviator says  might split a bit community.

Let 1 players see how good this game is then comes the DLCs because they will know worth the money.

For me i will buy Dlcs because i know in time this will be a good game ,but does all players belive that now?

For fifteen smackers, I would expect some new units or a new faction that plays differently.