I'm with the OP on this. 

I'd note that at the same time this is on sale on Steam, Stardock is still selling it on its own site for $49.99.

I generally don't mind paying a little more to small developers, but enough is enough.  From now on, I'm buying from Steam, on sale.  I have more than enough games that I don't care about having things on release day.

Never have to worry sbout more money untill galactic civilizations 4, same here.

Oh, I strongly suspect they will offer bundled sales at some point.  They'd be fools not to.  But a "spend X amount of money and get all future products at a lump sum" would  in fact surprise me more than a bit. 

But package deals like "all DLC released so far when you buy X" or a discount when buying multiple DLC/expansions? Like I said, THAT I fully expect to happen.  And an End of Game Life "Ultimate" package?  Again, they'd be fools not to offer something like that, IMO.  But that's not really the same thing as a Founders Package, is it?

If a car dealer offers a special deal in May, nobody who bought their car in April runs back to the dealer demanding a discount - they'll be laughed off the lot.  I don't understand how people get upset about games going on sale - I see it all the time, for many games, and I never, ever get why it's a big deal.  If you bought the game, you did so because you thought it was worth it.  A developer boosting sales and interest in a game by offering a sale doesn't hurt you.  Sure, if you're patient and opportunistic, you'll score a deal.  But if you decide to buy it before it goes on sale, you can't get mad when it does.  Sales happen all the time, across many businesses, and there are no law suits filed or demands for refunds.  It's absurd that we would treat game developers differently - but game devs are treated differently from every other industry, and not always fairly.  Somehow gamers feel more entitled than consumers of other products, and I think it's time that changed.  Nobody lied or intentionally mislead anybody here.  Maybe you didn't understand what the Founders Edition (non-elite) was, and maybe there were communication problems.  But there was nothing malicious sorry, malevolent  going on here. The gaming industry is changing, and sales are now part of life for gamers and developers.  The stardock of the past didn't change prices for a weekend because nobody did back then.  But now, if you want to compete, you have to use every avenue available, and sales have turned out to be a benefit to developers, especially smaller ones.  Generating interest and getting people off from "on the fence" is a big deal.  You're going to have to accept the way things are now.  It's life.  It's business.  I don't think they put GC3 on sale because they don't care.  After all, with a game like this we all benefit from a broader, more active community.  It's not stardock that's changed so much as the whole PC gaming industry has changed.  You can adapt or slowly wither away...

BTW, I also fully expect that when my mooted-in-my-last-post "Ultimate GC III" comes out (let's say in 2022/23 or whatever) that it will sell for much less than $99.  But the thing is, and I hope most Founder Elites will realize this, someone who waits long enough will always play less than even the most generous pre-release goodie bag deal can give.  Well, unless we're talking about completely free, that is.

After all, I can go over to GOG right now and get tremendous bargins for games that are years old.

The great thing about the "free" DLC/expansions isn't so much we save more money than everyone else in the long run (Though we do if one considers buying on day of release or soon afterwards).  No, the great thing about the FE package is.... we don't have to wait for sales to get our great prices! And we certainly don't have to wait 'till 2022 or whenever to play the hoped-for deal to end all deals.

No, we get to play everything as it comes out, without looking forlornly through the glass window at all of the delicious candy that we aren't allowed to eat yet.

Will someone in, oh let's say 2024 or even 2022/3 pay less than one hundred bucks to get everything GC III related?  I'd be shocked if they didn't.  All one has to do is look at something like Civ V or Civ IV to see the package deals that they have running right now.

Thing is, I will have played it for seven to nine more years than that fellow would have.  Well, theoretically, that is. 

I call that a win for me, personally.

I aggree with the OP. The times that I felt as a valued customer are certainly over. And I say that that as a guy who pre-ordered Elemental back in the day and is quite happy about about how that turned out.

I know this has been said before, but things go on sale. I don't understand the outrage. Things have gone on sale for as long as there has been retail. Oh, and things go on sale on Steam all the time. Putting an item on sale is not an insult to people who already bought the product. Quite frankly it has nothing to do with people who already bought the game. If you looked at the game and decided it was worth the price they were asking, then stop worrying about the deals others are getting. This isn't even the first time CGIII has gone on sale, so it shouldn't be a surprise. Honestly, this is a you problem, it has nothing to do with Stardock not caring about consumers.

Distinction without a difference. Thanks for pointing that out.

False analogy.

When I pay more for any product or service than the next person, I don't blame the next person.  I don't blame the seller.  I accept the responsibility for my own decision and try to learn from my experience.

Here's hoping that those who do not know about Steam sales can learn what they need to know in just one lesson, and thereby save themselves money in the future.  Also, they won't feel the need to come dump their frustration on us.  I sympathize with their frustration, but not with their reaction here.

This is actually my point.

All change is not necessarily good change. 

Early access muddies the water between pre-release and release. Initially, it is quite good for the developers, although I don't know if it is good for the consumer or the industry.

I remember when companies sought out people to beta test their games so that their product would be better. Customers did not pay for the privilege to beta test. At some point they figured out that they could charge for beta access, even at a premium price. Score 1 for Game Developers, 0 for Game Purchasers. Now what is really funny is that game fans ridicule others for pointing out the non-goodness of this practice. Score 2 for Game Developers, 0 for Game Purchasers. It is so funny to see how this has shifted and how everyone has bought in. 

Consoles now have a huge Day 1 Patch for their games to make them playable. This was not always the case. Is this change good? I would say no.

Developers now lay off many employees after a game is released. This was not always the case. Is this change good? I would say no.

I think many people can focus on the details and lose the bigger picture.

My post was never about $15.

It was about a changing development strategy which is still in its infancy and I do not think is in the best interests of the consumer. We will see how it plays out.

It was about the rabid fandom of some who ridicule others when they pointed out the change. They point out that games always go on sale. They fail to grasp that giving discounts to games in beta is unprecedented. It has not happened until Steam early access, because it was not really possible for it to happen.

Stardock was able to catch the wave with GalCiv III and get a premium price from their loyal fans and then capitalize on this wave of early release discounts. On their next rounds of funding for games, I think they will not be as effective for normal pre-orders. I don't know what percentage of the community I represent, but honestly they will probably make more money on early release sales so I don't matter to them.

I realize people keep pointing out Steam sales, but can I offer a couple of questions to point out the uniqueness of this situation?

Prior to 2013, how many times has a beta, unreleased product gone on sale on Steam? 0. Early access is a relatively new revenue stream that really gained popularity in 2014.

Prior to GalCiv III, how many times has Stardock offered a pre-order on a game to its customers, and then put the game on sale on steam prior to release at a cheaper price? 0.

I understand that I am pointing out a nuanced position that Steam has been able to neutralize through its early access program. The lines are blurred. I get that. But I'm hoping I'm providing food for thought that it may be good for Steam but it might not be good for the consumer. As of right now, the track record of the early access program indicates most games are not satisfying consumers.

Stardock finally got a sale from me after I've been watching this game for a long time.  So the sale paid off for them in this case.

This actually happens a lot less now than before because of how digital distribution has made dlc and smaller expansions more viable.

You keep saying development strategy, but I don't see how putting an early access game on sale changes development from early access not on sale. You want this to be about development, but all your points are about sales.

Ad hominum attacks aside, nobody's ridiculing you, we're just don't agree with you. How do sales on an early access game negatively affect development? How do sales show that Stardock no longer cares about their customers?

It seems very strange giving a sale to a game that is not even complete or reviewed.

This is a function of stream. Steam will put things on sale periodically as part of the business agreement. There have been a few times where I bought something and it went on sale (or a bigger sale) the next day. Steam says all sales final. Deems the breaks. I am sure there will be a large sale for Easter/spring break. Usually at least on in summer and one in winter.

I would think Stardock was serious when they said last chance for their sale. Steam they have no to little control over.

Wrong.  Developers now can opt-in/out of Steam sales.  This is Stardock.

So let me get this straight. Even if it is Stardock and they are indeed generating sales via this Steam Sale. You are telling the board here that because of the sale they do not care about their customer base? 

That makes zero sense. 

If they told steam to do a 1 hour free sale and anyone who wanted a legit copy for free during the one hour how does that impact your enjoyment of the game? You bought the game at the time because you felt it was worth it. Now that its on sale its fun factor is less? 

Ashbury, I know you from our Distant Worlds forums. The Game GC III has had several reviews so far during beta discussing each 'incarnation' of the last two Beta releases, (Diplomacy and Combat viewer).

By the way Ashbury, are you going to uh, write up some mods for us if and when we go gold? You did some great work on Distant Worlds Universe and previous expansions (at least I think it was your work.)

If you hate the free market so much, we can always go to a socilaism model of making video games.  The old Soviet Union produced exactly one decent video game - Tetris. 

Stardock deserves to get rich.  They make great games.  I don't see how selling a video game for a cheaper price is somehow evil.  You got to play the game far sooner buying it back then at 39.99 rather than waiting until now to get it at 24.99.  I am sure like 5 years from now, galciv 3 will be a three dollar bargin bin item.  However, people are willing to pay higher price to play a good game now than wait 5 years.  Afterall, you could die in a car accident in 5 years or our world could end in nuclear holocaust in 5 years.

*sees thread getting more than a tad poilitcal*

Well, that was nice while it lasted.  See ya!

*hits EJECT button*

Quoting BuckGodot, reply 46

*sees thread getting more than a tad poilitcal*

Well, that was nice while it lasted.  See ya!

*hits EJECT button*

 

Am I talking about the retardicans or the demon-crats?  We are having an economic discussion.  Nothing polictical.

Check out Brad's post here.  And same reposted here.

Nice to see all you geeks,  or what you like to call yourselves nowdays are rich. I grew up poor,  and are still poor. I like a deal when i can find one. Thete will probably be another game that i can save money in the future,  so keep the sales coming,  so it can help the consumer,  snd next timr if you wait you csn save money well that's a no brainer.

When the complete edition come out iwon't need it because i will be the first to have it. The only reason  any one would wine about sales is because money is not scarce like me. A true geek makes due with what he had computer wise. Not shell out a million dollar for parts. Im pro sells. Keep coming.

Thanks for posting this. I'd like to quote an excerpt:

"But game studios and publishers are also going to have to catch up to the concept that once your game is available, it's available and they have a responsibility to make sure their customers never felt like they were "chumps" for getting in early." 

Note the Title:

Surviving this brave new early access world

As I have said from the beginning, this is a change in strategy from the developers (funding is part of development strategy). One that is obviously more beneficial to them as developers and one that is less beneficial to the segment of early adopters I represent. There are many times a leader has to make a decision for the best of the organization even though it is not best for a segment. I understand that as a leader. As a leader, I have to look at how changes I make will effect different segments and "put myself in their shoes."

During the first sale in November, there were several posts both here and in Steam about the sale which customers posted about being disappointed in the sale. The response to them was not kind. I chose to stay out of the flame war and email and private message Stardock instead.

It was only after I had not received a response from Stardock and a new sale begun did I post, hoping to create a dialogue. I did so believing that there were others who may feel similarly.

I tried to post in a reflective manner and one where I conveyed I understood the new dynamics, but was a casualty of them. I have appreciated most responses because of the conversation generated, disappointed in a few because of the inability to concede others might have a different experience then they do, and quite puzzled at a few who seem to have figured out my entire philosophy of life (which is strange because I am still learning and growing). 

Ultimately, I am thankful to Brad who recognizes that the new profitable paradigm that Stardock finds themselves in has unintended consequences to some like me.

On a different note, I was extremely pleased with how another favorite game of mine, Distant Worlds, was released on Steam. The team there put together the base game and two expansions along into a single complete package along with expanded modding capabilities into Distant Worlds Universe. They chose to release it on Steam, which is something I thought they should have done a long time ago. Everyone who bought the Distant Worlds Universe game received a $10 discount for each prior game/expansion along with a $10 pre-order bonus.

I gladly pre-ordered the game for $9.99. 

Matrix / Elliott (the designer) clearly extended a generous hand of gratitude to early users who had worked so hard to promote the game through word of mouth. I hope they have made a boat load of money off Steam!