[1.6] Why The AI Cannot Defeat Players' Stacks

from Elemental Forums

If I have one big problem that saps the fun out of LH it is that the AI cannot ever seem to kill my stacks. If I build amass a full stack of units I can then almost always defeat 5 times its weight in AI armies without losing a single troop. This is find is the biggest problem in the game right now as it sucks a lot of the strategy and difficulty out of the game. Below I will talk about the different reasons for this and how it can be fixed.

1. Unit Quality: Human players use significantly better units then the AI. As army sizes are limited this makes a huge difference. Now as a modder I have given the AI tons of good designs and tweaked the AI so it likes higher quality units much more but a significant gap still exists. This is mainly caused by how the AI does not build most of its troops in Fortresses. I always build 99% of my troops from Fortresses and it makes a huge difference. The bonuses the units receive are not small. Even with just a Barracks and Blacksmith that +2 Levels, +4 Defense, and +15 accuracy make a huge difference. Also if  you get a Strike Garrison on city level 3, which I always do, you also get +2 Initiative. This does not include the bonus from spells you can cast on dedicated troop producing cities which could also get you fire damage and 2 more Initiative. Imagine a fight between armies comprised mostly of archers, don't you think those bonuses are going to make a huge difference? The side with those bonuses is going to completely wreck the other.

2. Pathfinding: The AI has a lot of weird behaviors in this game. I constantly see it do very weird and suicidal things. Like sending a lone group of archers through my territory, and removing a single troop from a city under siege and sitting it next the the enemies entire army. Try this experiment, when the AI sends an army after you park a larger one right in front of it. They will stop and politely wait for you to kill them. The AI doesn't seem to grasp that's not a smart idea to throw units away suicidally. If your horribly outnumbered retreat...

20,826 views 7 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

Still frequently observing the lone hero and solo sovereign issue, as well.  It might make sense to send a lone hero forth to quickly hit unprotected goodie huts, but a solo sov is weakening an enemy AI's mana pool with every defeat.

I also always take strike garrison at Fortress level 3, and typically only build one troop producing fortress city.  Any other cities I settle are Towns or Conclaves. Other fortresses are only obtained through conquest.  

Would it be possible to disable troop production in towns and conclaves altogether?  Or make only archers and defenders buildable there by the AI?

Or just give non-fortress towns unique defenders based on race (thinking of your Blood and Mana mod, here) to make up for the lack of the troop building.  

Maybe towns could get a huge gildar bonus to the "produce gildar" option and conclaves give even more research and/or mana as compensation as well?

 

 

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

One further advantage of training troops in a fortress is the magic spells that may becast to add power to the troops trained there.  AI doesn't  do that, as of yet.

Siege of Centauri
Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top

Hmmm, I could probably manage to disable building units outside fortresses somehow. I can think of 3-4 things that might work. The problem is it wouldn't be a AI change so much as a huge gameplay change because I can't think of a way of making it AI only. You can have AI only unit designs but I can't think of any other code that discriminates between humans and AIs. 

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

I'm not a programmer.  Is there a way to entice the AI into leveling fortresses, enchanting them, (with spells that makes troops tougher) and then actually build troops there?

Reply #5 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

I could live with that gameplay change if it meant a more challenging game and it would help reinforce the difference between city types.

Every game I play, my first city is a fortress.  And it will have at least one essence slot.  It would be nice if I had to think more about it, or there was some advantage to building a conclave with magical troops or a boost to summoning instead...

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

Player customization.

Specifically being able to focus on a trait/design and sticking with it.

In general - initiative.  Initiative is such a HUGE impact to every battle that gearing up for initiative improves odds/reduces losses dramatically.  When I can add:

+3 from a lowly dagger

+1 from soldiers boots

+2 first turn from basic horse (other mounts have other effects)

+1 for belt of speed for 1 crystal

+2 via 'fast' trait

+1 per essence from a fortress (usually 3-4 for my main fortress) via aura of grace

+2 for strike upgrade

It isn't tough to get +12-14 initiative for mounted units or +10-12 for infantry.

Compare that to most designs that will bulk up on armor or initiative killers and it just widens the gap further.   I'm not sure on the equation, but I know my 25-30 initiative troops generally have twice as many actions per battle as an enemy.   Compound that with crushing blow or other effects with a delay and I can get 3-4 shots in per the enemy 1 (even if the enemy 1 is powerful).

Tie that in with dodge and I'll take my chances of dodging the 1 hit and getting in 3-4 per troop, where I can focus and take down the most dangerous foe.

 

Initiative alone makes it very difficult for mobs or the AI to eventually compete.    Add in any other damage mitigation and it is very simple to avoid damage altogether - meaning your troops/heroes are doing more quests, getting more loot and seeing more of the map.    While your cities aren't needing to churn out troops, they can be building infrastructure for the eventual wars.   (Pretending the AI actually played) the AI is then stuck recovering or moving more slowly to accomplish objectives.   Movement + initiative + dodge are easier mode.

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting jutetrea, reply 6
+3 from a lowly dagger

+1 from soldiers boots

+2 first turn from basic horse (other mounts have other effects)

+1 for belt of speed for 1 crystal

+2 via 'fast' trait

The AI can use these if you give it good unit designs. It's the other stuff that's the problem, like enchantments and improvements. I can mod in unit designs and tell the AI to build certain improvements or enchantments, but I can't make them actually build troops in the cities that actually boost them.