Research - Age of War

As someone who tries to win games with as few battles as possible I find the middle age being the 'age of war' off putting. It seems to imply that war is inevitable. Is this the way the game will go? It would certainly put me off.

Even changing the name to 'Age of Conflict' still implies aggression, but not necessarily all out war.

 

28,750 views 28 replies
Reply #1 Top

The age of collision. The age of cultural expansion. The age of Sovereignty. The age Diplomacy. The age of trade.

 

DARCA. ;)

Reply #2 Top

Age of Love!

 

 

 

 

(But seriously, I think you are right.  Having it predetermined as an Age of War might not reflect how a particular game is being played (Even though cultural expansion strategies could also be seen as a form of Culture War).   My guess is that the idea is that around mid-game is when a lot of conflicts start to become more engaging.  But still, I wonder if it would be possible to have that middle age's name be flexible... dependent upon the types of researched mainly pursued up to that point.  If it is clear that a player is pretty much stockpiling and advancing in combat research, perhaps Age of War is not too far off.  But maybe if research and building variables are different, the second and third ages could have names reflective of those decisions?

Reply #3 Top

You asume the name is based on player behaviour... 

Maybe the devs will force war on you by making the AI much more agressive when they reach that era themselfs

Reply #4 Top

Quoting Dumhed, reply 2

cultural expansion strategies could also be seen as a form of Culture War

Cultural expansion strategies are invasions. Be them about Torian fastmeat chains or carefully placed immigrant baby booms in foreign planets. :p

I'm ok with the name being war. And not everybody will play peaceful (including AIs).

Reply #5 Top

It is possible, that even a more pacifist type player will be engaged in war mainly because they will be forced to defend themselves.

Still, I understand the OP concern.  In sandbox games, theoretically, you can set your opponents and such that "war" would hardly be a feature.  Even cultural incursion wold not be necessary if you just forge alliances with everyone.  (I'd be surprised if many people play this way... it sort of removes much of the fun of features like ship design which really wouldn't matter in a game like that).

Overall, however, the naming of the just seems to leave the door open to too many situations where what is happening doesn't match the age - unless there are meta events which trigger changes in gameplay.  (But my sense is this not the kind of thing they would do outside of the campaign).  I mean, if races spawn close together, widespread war among races can begin far before the 2nd age comes.  Or, in a really well balanced game, heated war and buildup might not reach its fiercest until the third age.  The idea of Ascension is applicable only if research victories are in play.  

In other words, the more I think about it, the more I feel that the naming of the ages has the potential to be incongruous with what is happening in the game (unless the naming of the ages could be flexible and reflect what is happening.)

Reply #6 Top

Age of Conflict sounds much better in regards to this complaint, and I would prefer that instead of Age of War.

Reply #7 Top

We are still playing with the Age names, and even the number of ages. There are some good suggestions here, that should help.

Reply #8 Top

Quoting mormegil, reply 7

We are still playing with the Age names, and even the number of ages. There are some good suggestions here, that should help.

THIS sounds interesting!

Reply #9 Top

Quoting mormegil, reply 7

We are still playing with the Age names, and even the number of ages. There are some good suggestions here, that should help.

Does it make more sense to do this perhaps?

1) On the main technology page only indicate what your CURRENT age is and a bar indicating how far you are to the next age

2) On the Tech tree, indicate all ages and when you'd hit them

to me this aleviates problems with the current system where the UI element on the main Technology page, more or less limits the # of ages, because you can't fit all that text on there. I'd say you could get maybe 4 total, 5 if your really make the ages succinct. But more than that would be impossible to fit. Not to mention localizations may have bigger problems fitting in even 3 ages! It also makes things UI consistent in that it is a 'bar that fills up' like anything you build and such.

 

Reply #10 Top

Quoting ParagonRenegade, reply 6

Age of Conflict sounds much better in regards to this complaint, and I would prefer that instead of Age of War.

 

You beat me to it. Conflict does not imply obligatory war, It is more general and would better suit the bill.

Reply #11 Top

I'd be interested to know what function these ages perform other than being cosmetic (and opening up the next tier or research).  

If it is limited to this, then my fear would be the potentially restrictive nature of almost any age name.  If you played a sandbox game on a huge map, with only one or two opponents, its very possible that significant conflict wouldn't come into play until much later, regardless of research progression.

I don't know if it is possible, but one solution could be to cause the "ages" to be tied to a secondary set of variables, that might help.

My suggestion would be:

  • Have several options for the age names for each second and third ages.
  • Tie age names to the meeting of certain variables, including research, military build-up, or actual conflict, or treaties and alliances.
    • For example, if your entire tactic is diplomatic, the second age would be the Age of diplomacy.  This could be determined by research pursued and number of treaties actually established.
    • For players that just reach a certain total of research without really specializing in anything, you could just use a generic term that covers a wide range of play experiences. "Conflict" might do just fine since there is conflict of some sort for everything.
  • Provide a tangible benefit to the type of age you have entered.  
    • For example, if it is clear that you have been engaged in military build-up and research, and you enter the Age of War, then in addition to opening the next tier of research, you also have certain researches available that would not otherwise be.  Or, it would trigger an event that provides some other benefit.
  • One alternative would be, other than automatically assigning an age, to trigger an event which allows the player to chose what he/she will call his age - selected from a preset list of available ones.  Again, what is available might be tied to game progress.  
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Reply #12 Top

Quoting EvilMaxWar, reply 10


Quoting ParagonRenegade, reply 6
Age of Conflict sounds much better in regards to this complaint, and I would prefer that instead of Age of War.

 

You beat me to it. Conflict does not imply obligatory war, It is more general and would better suit the bill.

What about Age of Strife?

Reply #13 Top

Well given that the first is age of expansion and the last is age of transcendence, the age names seem kind of fixed on the level of development of your civilization in as much as the current goal pervading the game at that particular point. I agree that age of war seems a little misplaced as it implies that conflict, in this case armed conflict is inevitable, which is not the case (or at least I hope as that would not leave much room for other avenues to victory).

I think age of society, imperialism,  or domination would be more fitting (linked by ideology with benevolent, pragmatic, and malevolent respectively) as it would reflect the goals and outlook of your particular civilization by that point in the game as you would no doubt have established an ideology by then. I think that those choices work as they are vague enough to incorporate multiple facets (society can be just as much about diplomacy and culture as it is about trade, technological advancement, or "peacekeeping", and imperialism and domination can have multiple connotations as well) yet distinct enough to fit with a particular ideology, so you do not have some malevolent Drengin Empire going through the age of diplomacy or commerce even if that was their research focus prior to reaching the next tier of development, because even if that was their research focus, I would strongly believe that their overall focus is to dominate the galaxy (even if it is through words and trade in this off kilter example). I think it gets back to the essence of what the other two age names really are about, focus and mindset more than just what happens to be going on at that particular point in the game. Just my thoughts though...

Reply #14 Top

To add to my prior post, by outlook and goals for the civilization I primarily mean how that civilization views itself with respect to the greater galaxy and the type of attitude it takes toward other civilizations. The reason I chose those particular names is because I believe benevolent ideology values all life and wants to great a sense of harmony or enlightenment for its citizens and the galaxy at large so a sense of a galactic society or community would be their aim, pragmatic ideology looks to exploit the galaxy within reason and some morale concern as well as expansion of power and influence through rational means hence imperialism, and malevolent ideology cares little for morality or valuing life at all and is focused entirely on concentrating power through any means hence domination. I just wanted to be a little more clear about what I meant as I know goals and ambitions can be kind of vague. Again these are just my thoughts, I do not dare to dictate any absolutes on this matter, just think it would be a nice touch is all.

Reply #15 Top


As someone who tries to win games with as few battles as possible I find the middle age being the 'age of war' off putting. It seems to imply that war is inevitable. Is this the way the game will go? It would certainly put me off.

Even changing the name to 'Age of Conflict' still implies aggression, but not necessarily all out war.

 

 

There should be five ages. The age of exploration, the age of expansion, the age of contention, the age of reckoning, the age of transcendence.

 

Good?

Reply #16 Top

Quoting Dumhed, reply 11

I'd be interested to know what function these ages perform other than being cosmetic (and opening up the next tier or research).  

If it is limited to this, then my fear would be the potentially restrictive nature of almost any age name.  If you played a sandbox game on a huge map, with only one or two opponents, its very possible that significant conflict wouldn't come into play until much later, regardless of research progression.

I don't know if it is possible, but one solution could be to cause the "ages" to be tied to a secondary set of variables, that might help.

My suggestion would be:


Have several options for the age names for each second and third ages.
Tie age names to the meeting of certain variables, including research, military build-up, or actual conflict, or treaties and alliances.

For example, if your entire tactic is diplomatic, the second age would be the Age of diplomacy.  This could be determined by research pursued and number of treaties actually established.
For players that just reach a certain total of research without really specializing in anything, you could just use a generic term that covers a wide range of play experiences. "Conflict" might do just fine since there is conflict of some sort for everything.

Provide a tangible benefit to the type of age you have entered.  

For example, if it is clear that you have been engaged in military build-up and research, and you enter the Age of War, then in addition to opening the next tier of research, you also have certain researches available that would not otherwise be.  Or, it would trigger an event that provides some other benefit.

One alternative would be, other than automatically assigning an age, to trigger an event which allows the player to chose what he/she will call his age - selected from a preset list of available ones.  Again, what is available might be tied to game progress.  

 

This is an excellent idea.

Reply #17 Top

I was going for Age of Strife as well but was beaten to it :P

Reply #18 Top

I would tend to suggest that research 'ages' be named for some important or key technology or set of technologies within that era, rather than handing out vague names like 'Age of War' or 'Age of Expansion' or 'Age of Strife.' Age names like that would be best applied to what is happening within the galaxy, rather than to certain portions of the tech tree. After all, who is to say that the early game is an 'age of war' for me, whereas the late game is peace, happiness, and sunshine? No, better to call it something along the lines of the 'Age of Fusion' or the 'Age of Antimatter,' as that likely says something about the key technology of the era (for example, the Age of Antimatter might be ushered in by the development of an antimatter reactor small enough and safe enough for use on starships, enabling the use of much more powerful engines, weapons, defenses and whatever else than was available with the preceding power generation technology).

Regardless, the exact names of the 'ages' of the technology tree don't matter much. I would nevertheless prefer that the names had something to do with whatever the key technologies of that age are, rather than having the Age of War when nobody is fighting and the Age of Ice Cream and Lolipops when everyone and their brother is committing genocide on the neighbors.

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Reply #19 Top

I agree; armed conflict should not be an inherent age. I don't know what ages are in the game now, but here are some, not in order.

Age of...

  • Colonization
  • Discovery
  • Expansion
  • Progress
  • Enlightenment
  • Ascension
  • Age of Ages [collective "ooh" from audience]
Actually, what's the point of having the Age associated with tech research? Shouldn't it vary depending on the galactic political situation?
 
Age of...
  • Discovery
  • Expansion
  • Colonization
  • Industrialization
  • Trade / Commerce
  • Research / Technology
  • Rebellion (internal conflict)
  • Contention (external, morals come head to head)
  • Tension (arms race - increase in military might, but no conflict yet)
  • Conflict (isolated outbreaks of war)
  • Hostility
  • War
  • Total War
  • Genocide

Note that those don't have to occur in any specific order. You could go Expansion -> Contention -> War then back to Industrialization -> Trade or whatever. Point is, it's situation-dependent instead of hard-coded.

Reply #20 Top

Quoting jim_viebke, reply 19
Actually, what's the point of having the Age associated with tech research? Shouldn't it vary depending on the galactic political situation?

I suspect that the research eras are intended to allow you to give a general indication of where you are, technologically, rather than requiring knowledge of where a specific tech is.

As far as what ages should be named for, though? That varies considerably, depending on who is talking and what they're talking about - the Age of Sail and the Victorian Era overlap are not mutually exclusive time periods, but one is defined by the dominant naval propulsion technology while the other is defined by the reign of one of England's monarchs. Since the age names appear within the tech tree rather than somewhere else, I assume that the ages are used to define technological epochs rather than to define periods of political, social, or colonial activity (or some other thing which can be characterized in a manner which divides the history of the thing into various 'ages').

Reply #21 Top

stone age, tool age, bronze age, iron age imo. 

 

wololo

Reply #22 Top

Quoting EleventhStar, reply 21
stone age, tool age, bronze age, iron age imo. 

I think GalCiv is a little later.

Reply #23 Top

The Age of possible conflict, though likely some diplomacy and cultural expansion, with maybe a little more exploration; or getting stomped by alien hordes.

Reply #24 Top

Age of Exploration/ Age of Expansion/Age of Elevation?

 

 

 

Reply #25 Top

Quoting jim_viebke, reply 22


Quoting EleventhStar, reply 21stone age, tool age, bronze age, iron age imo. 

I think GalCiv is a little later.

 

In one Age, called the Third Age by some, an Age yet to come, an Age long past….