Rhadagast Rhadagast

Books - Where the bad guys win

Books - Where the bad guys win

I recently read 4 of Joe Abercrombie's books, and really enjoyed their "grit" and dark humor.  It got me thinking about if I've ever read a book that had a main POV character which was completely evil and wins, or had "good" main character(s) that in the end, utterly fail.

Can anyone think of (and recommend) any books published like that?

 

P.S. If you like Abercrombie, GRRM, or fantasy in general, I highly recommend The Broken Empire trilogy from Mark Lawrence.

 

 

144,810 views 28 replies
Reply #26 Top

Quoting GeomanNL, reply 11

Maybe the Discworld series... there's this Rinsewind wizard who wins the day, but is always very miserable in the end. I like the books about him, he is a nice anti-hero.
 

 

I wouldn't call Rincewind an anti-hero, he's a very very very reluctant hero who just wants a nice quiet life without adventure and is always put in danger and in an adventure by 'chance.' Or Lady Chance. ;)

Reply #27 Top

Two books come to mind. One I do not recommend, Shadow and Claw: The First Half of the Book of the Sun by Gene Wolf. The one I can sort of recommend is the Engineer Trilogy by KJ Parker. I wrote two reviews for them on Amazon so if its alright I'll copy and paste. I do not often write a review so keep that in mind when reading them. : )

 

Shadow and Claw review:

I really liked the beginning of the book. The idea of the main character brought up as a torturer in a sort of guild of torturers, except all the members were children that were 'donated' to the guild. Unusual, interesting, etc. BUT while the initial idea was great, the rest fails miserably. Firstly, there is nothing unique to the torturer's guild. There isn't discussion of guilt, or how it becomes part of the every day, or a blatant enjoyment of it, etc. The guild is very dull. By contrast the brief visit, in the beginning of the book, that the main character makes to the librarian guild is quite well done, but short. Then on throughout the first half of the entire series, at least as far as I could get, there are many events that happen with no real interweaving them into the story. They just happen. And Severian is always agile, prepared, unshakeable, etc. It makes me wonder if the author wanted to be the main character, like wanting to be Superman or Batman.

Also, the women in this book are entirely submissive, docile, failures at scheming, and breasts and thighs. All there for the main character's copulation any time he chooses, and they all love him and adore him...just because.

I've read the interpretation that in this being the main character's recounting of his life, he is lying to you in this 'recounting'. Unless there's some explicit indication of this, whether or not he is lying is debatable at best. Severian's 'lies' are not checkable since this is fiction. It is not the same thing as an autobiography of someone real so that fact checking can be done to some degree. Severian can be an awful, evil, vile person, but without variation in other characters, context, etc(which there isn't). it doesn't matter if he's lying. The women remain docile, pathetic, meat, etc. Reminds me of why I couldn't finish To Your Scattered Bodies Go by Phillip Farmer.

Lastly, the author's almost unrelenting use of archaic words is not interesting or done well. He just throws them in there. I think its sort of a nod to people who know them all, that if you do you're 'in the club.' Not to mention there all not from a certain part of the world from a certain time period. They're very inconsistent.

 

Devices and Desires(first book in the engineer trilogy, which I did finish):

I think the most important things you need to know whether to decided to read this book(and half of the second, which is where I am at):

The engineering technical explinations aren't too bad. Relatively easy to figure out without a thesaurus. If its annoying, that's a personal choice not a quality of the writing. Learn some new things! :)
The intrigue is decent. Not increadibly complicated, so depending on your prefrence it is almost too much or almost not enough, but it works.
The writing quality is above par. No Toni Morrison here, but enjoyable enough.

The bad stuff...
There are no powerful women characters. This book is set in a man's world without question. There are a group of trading women(family) with knowledge and such, but they can easibly be wiped out by any man with some semblance of power. And without reprecussions. As well the women in the book are invariably trivial and disinterested in bettering their own lives, particularly through any of their own doing. Exhibiting aspects of the world their in, understandable. But there is very little exhibiting of self determination, even a a desire for it.
The characters are not redemable. Selfish, arrogant, and not in a well devised way. Their negative aspects are superficial, under it all there's not much of anything else. Like an archetype without the needed extra added in.

So to summarize, longer length books that are essentially light reading with a decent amount of technical jargon and description. Don't expect a lot. However the book is good for easy reading if the length doesn't bother you.

PS-this is not fantasy. There are no dragons, wizards, etc. The world/characters/etc is fictional, but everything else is not. IE-engineering level about the end of the medieval era. Same thing for clothing, plumbing, etc. Little leways here and there.

Reply #28 Top

Quoting TheBirthdayParty, reply 27
Shadow and Claw: The First Half of the Book of the Sun by Gene Wolf

I've read the entire Book of the Sun, and while it was not exactly a light or easy read, and things get real weird in the second book, I did enjoy it and I'm glad I powered through it.

Devices and Desires looks utterly bizarre, thanks for the recommendation.