Should mages be initiated?

Mages with leather armor are just fine.

In fact, it is good in a lot of games to give them the extra defense even if they traditionally only use robes in those games.

I am more of a "cover up the weak spot" kinda player than a "beef up the strengths" kinda player, so keep that in mind.

Note that once you unlock "Aegis robes" they'll prefer those to leather...

I don't know i guess i'm more like Raiddinn and prefer a more balanced approach. So my mages wearing leather isn't a problem. But i guess it all comes down to what you want in your mod. If you'd rather have mages look more like gandolph then force them to use robes or if you'd rather them look more like Flemeth from dragon age allow them to continue to use leather. 

If i was to force them into robes only i think i'd add a bonus to defense and initiative. Maybe a +1 to each? that should make it so that the robes aren't as good as leather defensively making it unattractive to any melee fighter.

The current "Monk's Robes" item grants +10 to dodge and no bonus to defense.  If I could choose a +1 defense/+1 init robe over plain +2 defense leather armor, I'd do it every time, for every unit that would normally wear leather (just like I always pick the +1 init boots over the +1 defense boots.)

If you wanted to have robes be a separate upgrade path, you'd have to separate them out into a different item class (similar to how fire/ice staves were broken apart in LH vs. FE.)  The armor auto-upgrade criteria in the UI only looks at Defense.

Right, before Aegis robes mages and light units are all in leather and all look like soldiers, after Aegis robes all are in robes and now all look like mages. It's possible to add a trait, for example "Initiate" and assign all robes and staffs to be equipable only if unit has this trait of Path of Mage and all other weapons and armor non-equippable. Then this trait could be added to the list unit design traits.

All units - mages will be upgraded with this trait. More robes with +1 Def +3 Def  +5 Def and more staffs may be added to unit design system.

So all light soldiers will ramain to look like soldiers and mages will always look like mages. For soldiers having no more access to Aegis robes, Spectral Leather Armor with +5 Def may be added for unit design.

I only doubt in what bonus the trait Initiate should give. It should give some bonus which is valuable for mages and almost worthless to common soldiers. Perhaps penalty to physical attack may be good as addition, since mages deal non-physical damage.

Or may be Initiate should give just Healing? Every soldier doesn't need to be healer, players may prefer to give them Constitution, Prcision, ArmorProffeciency2 or other combat oriented traits, while future mages will have some magica benefit as Heal.

Interesting idea but it still allows to pack a mage in plate armor.

Wasn't she wearing robes when she wasn't a dragon?

Webusver, I like how you try to poll everyone about what they'd like to see in a mod.

You are talking about the mage units, right? I always imagine them as regular soldiers who have learned how to use staves. Like a mortar crew. So they can still wear any armor they like.

I just want to gather any possible ideas, make a good mod and return to gameplay. I think now that you are right. I remembered that Quendar arcane warrior has staff and armored in Arcane Armor. Also using 1 of 3 points to possibly not very useful trait will damage creativity in creating mages. But I think, that I'll leave opportunity for robes. Crastiloowa gave a good idea, I'll try to use it.

Depends on which dragon age your referring, i didn't specify which i suppose i should have. http://www.cosplayisland.co.uk/costume/view/44965

On Heroes: I would not mind if magicians could only use robes and leather armor and nothing above (except maybe some exceptional rare magic armor thingy). The main reason I right now don´t use staffs are for the + to initiative you get from other weapons, mainly daggers. But for example how could a black magician or necromancer not have access to a sacrificial dagger

Initiate" (or what name do you suggest?) which will allow to wear Staffs and robes and dagger and/or magic weapons (if that is at all possible without to much work) would be fine. If initiate would only give access to staffs and leather armor it would be mediocre but also pretty much a must pick ability.

But yeah, the Gandalf or old D&D concepts with nothing but staffes and robes would definitely work. But then there should be more staffs which are either neutral in initiative or magic staffs with a bonus to initiative. Or that the initiate trait gives you access to all weapons too (maybe include negative accuracy for anything other than staffs?) How else are the poor magicians going to survive if they can´t use any armor and always are slow to act?

On Units: Yeah go for nothing but staffs on these guys, in a pinch maybe some leather armor but nothing other than that and robes.

Silly me, could one just choose to not give their mages leather armor if they did not like that look?

I think the problem arises from the Upgrade feature.  Upgrading will go to the next "better" armor as a whole set, rather than piece by piece, and there's no option to upgrade to intermediate levels of armor.  So, for example, if you outfit your mages in robes, choosing "upgrade" will give them leather once you have that tech researched (although eventually this self-corrects once you research Aegis robes - but then you get robe-wearing archers for the opposite problem.)

Personally, I seldom can afford to upgrade armor (though I do frequently upgrade weapons.)

Can you choose not to automatically upgrade to the most recent armor for individual units or is that a global setting?

?? Not entirely sure what you're asking.

When you click the "upgrade" button for a unit, you get access to a dialog with three options

• Upgrade weapon - will change weapon type for the unit to the best (max damage from all damage types) for that weapon type that you have researched, incurring a cost in gold and possibly metal and/or crystal
• Upgrade armor - will change the armor for the units' members to the best (only considers defense) for that armor type that you have researched and that the unit has the traits to use.  For instance, if they are currently in Monks robes + Soldier's boots + leather greaves, and the unit has the chainmail trait, they will upgrade to a full suit of chainmail (and incur the relevant costs)
• Upgrade unit formation - will change to the largest available researched unit formation (number of figures in the unit) for a corresponding price.

You have to perform an upgrade individually for each unit that can upgrade, and you can upgrade each factor of the three above separately, but there is no global upgrade feature (would likely be ruinously expensive if available.)  

There is no option to chose upgrades to any equipment or unit formation less than the best currently available to you at your current research levels.

You can, of course, elect not to upgrade any individual unit by just not exercising the option.  However, that's the only way to give improved equipment to an existing (and presumably more experienced) unit.

I meant when they are initially built. I thought there was a box you could check in the Game Options to do this. Is the choice to automatically use the best armor/weapons available a global setting or can you tell mages not to take the best armor and everyone else to take it?

The only option similar to that of which I am aware is in unit design and is specifically for what the units get equipped with when trained. It allows you to create, for example, an armored spear-type weapons unit, which when trained will be equipped with the best armor and the best spear-type weapon you have available, as long as the unit is capable of equipping what you have. So at the beginning of the game the unit might have spears and padded armor, in the mid game it'll have mail and boar spears, and at the end of the game it'll have plate and pikes when trained. The unit upgrade order in the unit overview in the lower left portion of the screen allows you to upgrade the armor, weapons, and shields of a given unit for a fee, but pays no heed to settings in the unit design and considers only the defense rating (unless you want to edit the unit XML to change what gets considered when performing an upgrade).

Thanks to everybody for comments. That's what I've done finally in Patchwork mod - Added new racial trait "Monk Robes" (costs 0 to choose like Masterwork Chain mail) which replaces Leather armor with a set of robes. If you wish your light troops look like mages, or you prefer Dodge over Defence, this option is for you. Otherwise you just keep good old leather armor.

Also I added new class of troops - zealots. They fight with melee staffs. Staff class of weapons is expanded. Earlier there were just a staff and monk's staff with no possibility to upgrade. Now this possibility exhists up to Arcane weapons. https://forums.elementalgame.com/450250/page/2