Under powered Tech trees

Eh?

In a game with a lot of different races, each with their own techs, there are bound to be diverse opinions on what is strong or weak, since different races have different themes and will be strong/weak at different things and have tech to reflect that.

Variety and diversity are good.  Making everything "strong" for every player of every race of every style is pretty much impossible.

Is it? If done well (I have faith SD will do it well), then yes. But absolute statements such as this one always is an extreme temptation for Murphy.

Also, don't forget the boundaries imposed by the physical nature of our universe. I contend that, simply because of the physical nature of our universe that the variances of tech trees between the many species in GC should be small in order to make the tech trees believable.

On the other hand, I would like to see an organic class of technologies added to the GC tech tree. This is something that purely metallic/mechanical (robot like, but including a broader definition) species would not have in their tech tree simply because they wouldn't have an example to model it from, hence they would not even think of trying to develop it.

Some fair points in the original post considering some of the terrible research in Sins. (+3% exp in your own star systems) (More $ from scuttling) (armor on trade ships)

Agree completely. The best tech trees are those that are situational and without "must have" techs. Although like I say above in Sins there are more than a few techs that are "Must never get"

Agreed that variety and diversity are good however we need to keep in mind that an end goal will likely result in similar products.

For instance just looking at weapons developed by differing countries  over the last century should provide the logic that a standard once developed is very influential in the design of the next generation.

To simplify this statement, if race A were to develop technology A race B would develop a technology similar to technology A so long as race B has any influence of race A.

For real world example see the adoption of the AKM amongst both combloc and noncombloc countries. Or as a different example the prolific and well known diesel and gasoline engines. The CZ-26 was developed long before the UZI however they share many things (operation wise) in common. If we as a race (including lore in game) are to be a derivative example of the rest of galactic civilization (haha see what I did there?) then it is likely that all races will reach a similar end game technologically.

Excluding however synthetic only races which probably have little use for gravity, atmosphere, medicine, or free will. However, given that example in itself. The Yor will still have need for gravitic influence (inertia based weaponry and navigation), atmosphere (consider galvanic corrosion amongst other things), medicine which for a syntheticly exclusive race could boil down to computer virus and other malware not to mention required upgrades in which to keep current with modern technology ( considering the Yor race specifically over a ten year span without some sort of upgrade regime they could be losing 10% to 50% of their synthetic population which could cause quite the hindrance galaxy wide.), free will does come into play for them as well..even if they managed to survive solely on stealing technology from organic races they would still only be as dangerous as the technology most recently stolen from said organic race, late game consequences could put a civ like this at a serious disadvantage due to the fact that technology advances in leaps and bounds.

To summarize, even if two races develop completely separate from one another the same goals will likely be achieved. Colonize base planet, develop planetwide political and governing system, emigrate to exoplanet  sphere, develop extra solar transportation methods, develop planetary terraforming technology, remix and repeat.

To use real life as an example. The American Indians were completely isolated from Western Europe for a long long time, however they still managed to develop migratory housing, farming, and archery, which were concurrently developed in Western Europe as well.

Any other technology tree development based on the lore of species differs only in a cosmetic way and to make the player "feel" as though the races are unique even if its not an accurate depiction of development.

This is MY opinion, fact or other opinion may refute the above.

-Aer

I also agree with that

Edit: Although... If it was an event it would halt their progression seeing as they probably no longer have their original boot-up disc

Tech Trees are as a result of the needs of the Core design of the Game. Not the other way around.

As an abstraction ...... its pointless creating some kind of complex tree ending up at the top end with some miniaturised super-weapon vaporising all before it, if it does not fit the Game Flow.

There are limits to that - of course - as base weapons for the core game must be created there - surprise - but as soon as you go past the Core elements, there has to be a need for that technology stream. Little point creating some fantasy super-stream if it does not fit the Game Play.

The tail does not wag the dog, the tail has a purpose for the dog. In any game using Tech Trees, the latter provide the mechanism to support game logic, Its not a simplistic way to create some Death-Star like ability etc etc, without the supporting game play to use it.

Merely creating a Tech Tree with Super-Abilities in isolation, or merely as an excuse to introduce tactical warefare, does not meet the reality of game design, it just gives a warm fuzzy feeling.

First of all the Yor wouldn't discover old Terran tech the Yor would discover old Iconian and Precursor tech.

Zydor r u talking about the Terror stars? If u r not can u be more specific.

     Well if we r using the American indians as an example we r forgetting about other technologies. Even though the base technologies were the same if u were very basic. The northwest indians had holes in the roof instead of chimneys. The natives uses canoes instead of boats. The polybesuabs had sails. The Aztecs had pyramids. The Incans had paved roads. A Tepee is similar to a tent. They both had pottery. Adobe is similar to brick. They both used pottery.

      There were some major differences to. The Europe used wheat instead of corn. The Europeans. The Europeans used gold instead of the barter system. The Europeans preferred the musket and the cannon over the bow. The Europeans didn't just have boats, but also had ships; even though, some of the canoes held up to 50 people and had sails. The Europeans preferred iron over tin, jade, and obsidian. The Europeans preferred the lance and the pike over spears. The Europeans preferred paper over buffalo hides. The Europeans preferred cotton and silk over buffalo hides.  The Europeans liked wooden silverware. The Aztecs preferred obsidian armor over the padded armor the Mexican decided on because it was to hot. Lets not forget the wheel that the Aztecs made a nice toy to give to their gods. How about the spinning wheel or the printing press. The Europeans liked swords. Europeans preferred wagons when the Indians preferred something that a dog can drag.

    I would like to contrast the Chineese. The preferred the repeating crossbow and cannons over the bow and crossbow; even though, the Europeans mad muskets after they got gunpowder. The Europeans did better with their polearms. The Europeans had better ships. The Europeans preferred plate over chain. The Europeans preferred shields while Japan felt sheilds were cowardly the Europeans preferred to make a lot of cheap sheilds while the Japaneese preferred to make a few good quality swords.

     When U really think about it there is a number of differences between the technology of different civilizations

Minor differences I can agree with you, however given the same amount of time elapsed the Europeans advanced multitudes faster than the American Indians or those in the Orient.

All of the cultures mentioned had spears at one point made out of stone. Then technology advanced and soft metals began to be used, and then progressively more tensile strength was added to said spear heads. I think that history makes a good case that none of the cultures of Earth developed so wildly different from one another that the "tech tree" of our history reflects what we experience in game.

Even if we were to make the case that perhaps on an alien homeworld they didn't have access to any radioactive material research into atomic fission and fusion would likely still occur.  Likely said Alien race would discover uranium or plutonium in exploring space and this would simply result in a +25% bonus to fission tech research.

I just don't see how such minor differences such as code of honor (japanese culture, also the european knights had a similar system), or tepees (which are simple nomadic tents take a look at the early tents of the nordic cultures or the mongolian nomads for something very similar) do anything but solidify the point that the tech tree system doesn't need an overhaul.

     U can always make things better. Go for it.

I agree we can make suggestions for Stardock to make a more perfect system. I just don't think that we understand the scope of what the developers have to do already on top of hiring exobiologist's as consultants to adequately design races that could not have evolved on a terran planet. Then you have to design individual tech trees for each race that make sense according to their limitations when likely the tech trees will converge roughly halfway anyway and not add any more to the game than if they had stayed on the route they're already on. I mean I'm more than willing to hear your side of it but, what is the net gain if they wen't that route?

The thing about different Tech trees is to make the game more interesting. I guess there r 2 sides to astrobiology divergent and convergent evolution. We actually know how it is going to work until we run across another ecosystem. I guess I got carried away with defending the way Stardock does things.The more we have different tech trees the deeper the game is. A deeper game would be  more exciting.

Testing