Need some advice!

I'm faced up against a Vasari Loyalist friend in a game, and I'm in somewhat of a dillema here.

 

I play the TEC rebels and we're up for a fight soon. He uses massive capital fleets, supported by a titan (that's it no supporting fleet, hahaha, silly of him). I would rush him and smash out his capital ships, but unfortunately, he asks that I don't immediately rush him and to be fair (he's new relative to me) I'll usually oblige. This ends up putting me at the disadvantage in his eyes, but his lack of any supporting fleet says otherwise. 

Anyway, I'm stumped about how I should go about destroying his cap fleet.

This is what I'm thinking:

1. LRF+Carrier spam, along with Titan to long range knock out a cap or two to send him scuttling back with gardas and hoshis supporting the fleet. 

2. Kodiak and hoshi pounding, with gardas to fight off whatever air support he has. 

3. Weak fleet w/ Titan + Lvl6 Akkan w/ Armistice (He'll do anything to kill my titan) to lure them to a heavily defended asteroid - this asteroid could either have a boatload of mines surrounding a starbase with PJI to keep the pounding on while he's retreating, or just mines and the BRB to knock his fleet. 

Some things I'm worried about:

1. He'll have all of his research, which bothers me because the DPS (at least, from what I've heard) for the vasari increases greatly (except the titan). This also means he can phase across planets. The Dark Fleet's also somewhat bothering, but what I did see of it was disappointing, so I'm going to discount it now.

2. He's moved all of his labs onto his caps, which is good and bad. I intend to go around smashing out his trading ports with an Akkan w/ Armistice + 15-20+ Ogrov fleet (Hoshis, Gardas, maybe a Sova for protection) before the battle. 

Are there any other strategies/tips/recommendations/comments you can give me? Thanks a ton!

8,406 views 6 replies
Reply #1 Top


I'm faced up against a Vasari Loyalist friend in a game, and I'm in somewhat of a dillema here.

 

I play the TEC rebels and we're up for a fight soon. He uses massive capital fleets, supported by a titan (that's it no supporting fleet, hahaha, silly of him). I would rush him and smash out his capital ships, but unfortunately, he asks that I don't immediately rush him and to be fair (he's new relative to me) I'll usually oblige. This ends up putting me at the disadvantage in his eyes, but his lack of any supporting fleet says otherwise. 

well first off you are putting yourself at a sizable disadvantage by banning early game pressure- The vasari have the strongest late game of any race and the TEC are the weakest late game race.

That said, him not building a supporting fleet is certainly in your favor



Anyway, I'm stumped about how I should go about destroying his cap fleet.

This is I'm thinking:

1. LRF+Carrier spam, along with Titan to long range knock out a cap or two to send him scuttling back with gardas and hoshis supporting the fleet. 

LRF will be shredded by his titan, but carrier bomber-massing would do the job nicely.  Just make sure to keep your carriers moving so they don't get titan'd to death.   Super late game bringing a few cielos for designate target would help too- but don't bring too many, they are going to die no question and feed his titan exp.

 

Once his titan is level 6 things get trickier as the Vorstra's level 6 ability can instantly kill large numbers of frigates in a small area.  At that stage it will benefit you to split your carriers in a few groups kiting in different directions.  But even then things will eb difficult- your best bed is to down that titan before it reaches level 6.

 


2. Kodiak and hoshi pounding, with gardas to fight off whatever air support he has. 

Depends how many skirantras he has. Kodiaks get torn to pieces by bombers and are only worth using if he doesn't have many bombers.  The chances of this are higher then usual though being that he isn't buildign a supporting fleet- just try to scope out how many skirantras he's building.

 

Also incidentally, gardas wouldn't be a great idea- they counter fighters, not bombers,(and it's bombers that counter kodiaks).  Not to mention late game flak frigates are titan food and don't tend to last very long.  So your support would be better as carriers carrying fighters since fighters are the counter to bombers.

All in all though massing carriers carrying bombers is usually a safer bet though.

 

I'd also like to note if he were ANY faction OTHER THEN the vasari loyalists, corvettes would be a great option.  Corvettes counter both titans and capitalships and are the best ships in the game for chasing down wounded capitalships.  The reason they don't work so well for vasari loyalists is ebcause the Vorastra titan is the only titan in the game who's AoEs can actually hit corvettes.

That said, corvettes would still be  an option if you're willing to constantly micromanage them in battle to keep them behind your fiend's titan, out of the brunt of it's AoE


3. Weak fleet w/ Titan + Lvl6 Akkan w/ Armistice (He'll do anything to kill my titan) to lure them to a heavily defended asteroid - this asteroid could either have a boatload of mines surrounding a starbase with PJI to keep the pounding on while he's retreating, or just mines and the BRB to knock his fleet. 

Some things I'm worried about:

 Building a titan would be a good idea in general.  The ragnarov has better focusfire then any other titan, so it will be flying death to a capship/titan fleet.  

 

Mines generally aren't worth using though and BRB is more of a frigate counter then a capship/titan counter, since titans & capships take 25% reduced ability damage and tend to have high shield mitigation when wounded.

Having an Akkan is always good though.


1. He'll have all of his research, which bothers me because the DPS (at least, from what I've heard) for the vasari increases greatly (except the titan). This also means he can phase across planets. The Dark Fleet's also somewhat bothering, but what I did see of it was disappointing, so I'm going to discount it now.

 Honestly the research that increases DPS a ton for vasari is phase missile research- since he's not building frigates this mostly means how much he benefits from said research will depend primarily on how many squads of bombers(read: how many skirantras) he has.

 

If he has a bunch you're going to need some fighters to deal with them.


2. He's moved all of his labs onto his caps, which is good and bad. I intend to go around smashing out his trading ports with an Akkan w/ Armistice + 15-20+ Ogrov fleet (Hoshis, Gardas, maybe a Sova for protection) before the battle. 

Are there any other strategies/tips/recommendations/comments you can give me? Thanks a ton!

 

You've got most of the main points in terms of composition.  Have a ton of carriers, mostly fielding bombers, but also some fighters if he has lots of skirantras, build a titan.  In terms of other frigates perhaps a couple cielos.  While his titan is still low level you could also get away with having a contigent of hoshikos, but try to not get these killed as they will feed his titan.

 

In terms of capitalships you should probably start with an akkan- It's Ion Bolt will be a huge asset in preventing his wounded capitalships from retreating.  Next I'd say grab A Dunov or 2-  Capships are nothing without their antimatter, and titans are likewise greatly diminished.  Having 2 Dunovs with maxed EMP blast constantly AoE AM-draining will take the fight out of his fleet pretty quick.

 

The Ragnarov titan's massive singletarget DPS & snipe will be a huge asset in focusing down the titan & capitalships & snipe will be strong for finishing runners.

In terms of focusfire, while the titan is still low level focus it first- you don't want it to grow and it should still go down pretty easy early on.  Later on if it does level up much you may do better to focusfire easier to kill capitalships first.

 

 

Well those are all tips for your main fleet.  Also remember to play TEC like TEC.  As TEC you're fightign a war of attrition- don't get commit everything to a single battle against his main fleet:  commit your mainfleet to the battle and then his his other borders with ogrovs while he's distracted.  Build a novalith or two and bombard his eco worlds.

 Uses steps like these and TEC's strong economy in general to ensure your economy stays superior to his, then do what the TEC does best: make trades- engage in a battle that costs you a few carriers and him a capitalship.  If you play your cards right your superior economy will leave you better able to recover your loses then he is- especially since any capitalship he loses when rebuilt goes back to level 1.

In short, while his refusal to build frigates may make a single decisive victory very doable, fighting single decisive battles is much more to the vasari's strengths then the TEC's- The TEC prefers to buidl a superior economy then chip away at the opponent with attrition and trades until the enemy fleet is nolonger capable of putting up much of a fight.

 

 

 

Also if all else fails, once he's a  bit more experienced lobby to allow early game action being that that is the main strength of the faction you play and his race is balanced around having a weak early game  :grin:

Reply #2 Top

I play the TEC rebels and we're up for a fight soon. He uses massive capital fleets, supported by a titan (that's it no supporting fleet, hahaha, silly of him). I would rush him and smash out his capital ships, but unfortunately, he asks that I don't immediately rush him and to be fair (he's new relative to me) I'll usually oblige. This ends up putting me at the disadvantage in his eyes

 

A poperly microed vasari loayist titan can kill be bloody murder to any fleet especially a rebel tec it just microphases into your carrier group and destroys them with maw.....and an all capital fleet prevents and denies feed for your titan since it is a informal game..get him at a star and carrier.....be warned running from that titan is near dam impossible I suggest dunnov wolf pack with concentration on heals and anti matterbombs to drain if it gets close and their lv 6 ability to ensure your titan keeps focusing on his titan.

you are in a position I always avoid as a tec (I play random) if you want to win you don't let things go to late game unless in a  comfortable position

 edit 15-20+ Ogrov fleet thing bad idea fleet supply best else where where it can attack a larger varity

Reply #3 Top

Thanks for the advice so far! Enjoy the rep, very good posts. C: 

Any other advice I can get will be greatly appreciated, especially regarding the following questions (and the one above). 

1. In this battle, would you recommend a Sova or a Dunov? 

2. How many Bombers would relatively quickly knock out a capital? I'm thinking about 70+, but I'm not sure. 

3. If I'm able to split up the carriers and kite them, would you recommend going for capital ships or the titan? I know he's extremely sensitive about the titan, so I feel that if I attack it, I might end up losing a chance to do some major damage to his fleet.

4. If someone loses a research lab, will the upgrades unlocked by it (e.g., health/shield upgrades, not fleet/structure upgrades) go away with it as well?

5. Are PJI's worth it?

6. Would pulling him to battle at a star or a heavily defended asteroid be better? 

Thanks again guys, great feedback!

 

 

Reply #4 Top

1.) dunov since this is late and sova losses it's advatnges(sova yes has dps but dunov keep things alive and keeps the enemy fleet at an antimatter disadvantage)

2.) for titans bobmer swarms of 100+ are not uncommon but a corvet swarm works well to

3.)Since you stated he is sensitive and you want to wear him down capitals first but if you want out of an area go for titan

4.)not that I'm aware

5.)pji are great edition to any defesne it cause them to either have to go deep into your defense to take it out or suffer the 7X build up time to defend which is great for bomber swarm ambushes 

6.) heavily defend where you have the advantage by the sound of it is going to be difficult to lure him into....but it's really up to you and situation. 

Reply #5 Top

Quoting goldenbullet, reply 3
1. In this battle, would you recommend a Sova or a Dunov? 

Dunov's are a must have when titans are around for their antimatter draining. Sova's are realitively weak late game, though if isn't building any frigates at all you might find it okay to have one.

Quoting goldenbullet, reply 3
2. How many Bombers would relatively quickly knock out a capital? I'm thinking about 70+, but I'm not sure. 

It's a good number, but the more the merrier. Just watch out for Kortuls and hanger defenses, they can jam/freeze your bombers if you don't manage them carefully.

Quoting goldenbullet, reply 3
3. If I'm able to split up the carriers and kite them, would you recommend going for capital ships or the titan? I know he's extremely sensitive about the titan, so I feel that if I attack it, I might end up losing a chance to do some major damage to his fleet.

Depends, especially early on the capitalships can easily be more of a threat than the Vorastra. High level Jarrasuls, Kortuls and Skirantras should all be priority targets over a level 1 Vorastra. However, you absolutely cannot let the Vorastra get to level 6, otherwise the Maw will be a mortal threat to your carriers, and it will be risky to engage with any frigates unless you've depleted its antimatter, effectively giving you the same handicap he has.

Quoting goldenbullet, reply 3
4. If someone loses a research lab, will the upgrades unlocked by it (e.g., health/shield upgrades, not fleet/structure upgrades) go away with it as well?

Generally stat improvements are kept even when the research labs are destroyed. What you lose are access to researchable frigates, structures and abilities.

Quoting goldenbullet, reply 3
5. Are PJI's worth it?

Yes! If you can get him to attack you at a fortified planet with PJI's, you're set to kill something important. Combine with the Akkan's ion bolt to keep the most important caps from phase jumping.

Quoting goldenbullet, reply 3
6. Would pulling him to battle at a star or a heavily defended asteroid be better? 

The star's antimatter regeneration will hurt your Akkan's attempt to drain antimatter, but if your enemy is using a lot of Kortul's with disruptive strikes to do the same thing to you it may cancel out (though they also have an ability cooldown reduction so I'd guess he'd have the advantage). In a titan vs titan fight though the Ragnarov has the advantage however, as its abilities all do damage and use antimatter. If he isn't supporting his titan well scattershot + snipe at a star could work very well, but my first choice would still be a fortified planet.