Faction Ability Bonus % vs Absolute Value, and "Lucky"

from Elemental Forums

Hi all,

Yes terrible thread title I know, wasn't sure what to put because it's kinda a 2 part question.  OK so the "Lucky" faction trait has this which provides +25% dodge:

Code: xml
  3. <GameModifier>
  5.    <ModType>Player</ModType>
  6.    <Attribute>AbilityBonus</Attribute>
  7.    <StrVal>A_UnitStat_Dodge</StrVal>
  8.    <Value>25</Value>
  9.    <Provides>All units are +25% to Dodge</Provides>
  10. </GameModifier>

(As well as the Accuracy +25% bonus).

So my questions are:

1) This 25% dodge bonus seems to be rather un-useful, given that most line troops have a dodge of zero, their bonus 25% actually doesn't help increase their dodge.  Am I missing something?  Are their unit (other than sov/champs) that this would benefit?

2) Is it possible to change this to be a flat +5 dodge or some other absolute value?  I know how to create a unit ability that does this... but I can't seem to get it to work for a faction trait.  I've noticed that there doesn't seem to be any existing faction traits that have an absolute bonus (they are all percentage based) so i'm starting to think it can't be done.  Thoughts?

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

3,974 views 5 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

1) Well the bonus applies to every unit you control.

2) There isn't really a way to do this. Well, there is a long work-around which involves creating new unitstat, multiplying it to 0 then 100 for the faction, then applying that multiplied value to dodge using a trigger to autocast spells in tactical combat that you'd place inside all bloodline traits. It'd only work if you don't auto-resolve, and there's probably a rather big overhead on things like that.

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

Okaaay... pass on the workaround!  :O

 

Bit of shame, would have been nice to have been able to give basic line troopers a +5 or +10 base dodge bonus via faction trait.... not to worry. 

 

Thanks for the prompt feedback.   

:thumbsup:

Offworld Trading Company
Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top


Basic troops can get quite a lot of dodge if you design them that way.  You get dodge from any shield, from the Monks Robe and from choosing a warg as a mount.  Then there are 3 traits that give more dodge in various ways; Acrobat (1 per level), Balance (+5 dodge - 1 HP) and Lithe (+10 dodge - 5 weight). Then there is the air spell Evade which adds 6 dodge plus 2 per air shard.  There are lots of ways of giving basic troops quite a lot of dodge.

With careful design it is not too hard to get a basic unit with 20 dodge or even 40 if you really try (kite shield, monks robe, warg, Evade and some dodging traits), so that 25% bonus is extremely useful and can make the troops extremely hard to hit.  Enemy trained troops only have an accuracy of 70% plus 1 per level so they will miss high dodge troops most of the time.  Combine those high dodge troops with Blindness on the enemy and the only way they can be hit is by using the 3% hard limit on accuracy reduction methods.

That +25% bonus to dodge from Lucky is extremely powerful if you know how to make use of it, much better than a small flat bonus like you seem to want to add.  I'd stick with what we have  O:)

 

JJ

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

That's excellent feedback also, good stuff.  

Would have been nice to allocate a flat bonus in some situations... eg. I have a "Cult of the Serpent" faction trait and would liked it to give all units a small dodge bonus, so that basic unarmed spearmen/archers have a dodge say of 5 or 10.  A small percentage bonus just means it won't work on the el cheapo guys which is kinda what I was after in this case.  I guess I can accomplish something similar by creating a faction specific unit trait that does the same thing, which will work ok but take up 1 of the 3 trait slots.  Still not a bad idea...  Maybe "Mark of the Serpent" which gives +5 dodge and costs next to nothing.  That could work.   

However you made a good point.. a % bonus in a lot of cases probably can work out to be more advantageous... so overall probably not as important as I thought I guess.

So many logical helpful folks around here  :-)

Thanks.

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

Quoting UncleJJ44, reply 3
With careful design it is not too hard to get a basic unit with 20 dodge or even 40 if you really try (kite shield, monks robe, warg,

You're way too conservative.  I've had trained units with dodge in the 70s, and that's before they fortify.

A lucky wraith on a warg, with a kite shield, cloak of shadows, monk's robe, and the "Lithe", "Balanced" and "Acrobat" traits will be reaching for 100 once it gets a few levels.