Yea, I remembered to take my meds today, so I'm a bit less psychotic and capable of coherent and rational thought, at least for a few hours.

Well...actually your right consumers arnt entitled to much these days. Stardock, I thought, was working to change that with its gamers bill of rights.

Whats the point of having rules of civil behavior if the very sponsor hires a man who's last product was a poster child for violation of said rules. Mr. Shafer might have a very reasonable yarn to tell but he needs stop hiding behind frogboy and come forward to face the music. If Stardocks shelters this guy then the Gamers Bill of Rights means nothing

Sorry but that's crap. Brad isn't sheltering anyone.

Jon Shafer made a lot of mistakes with Civilization 5 but he in no way, shape or form needs to come forward and "face the music". Different game, different place. He very likely would have signed a NDA anyway.

Your sense of entitlement is ridiculous.

Besides that, Firaxis and 2K Games are much more to blame for the fiasco that is Civilization 5 and they aren't speaking. Let them come forward and explain what the hell happened. I guarantee they won't.

You seem to be under the impression that Stardock is running a witness protection program. Grow up please.

I care more about what Jon will do at SD then what Jon did at Firaxis right now.

I just wish I had some idea what his ideas actually are for Elemental.

 Thats hysterical... I'm so going to send Robot Chicken a story board sketch pitch for that. If they accept, do not fear, I will give credit to every single one of you still arguing about this in this thread.

 "Its' ALIVE!!"

That works both ways Xia. Stardock isn't entitled to anything either. They've banked some customer loyalty points they've used heavily this last year, but that isn't indefinite, and it doesn't apply to everyone.

In the end, I just want a better game.

Perhaps some people should take a deep breath and wait and see what happens with Elemental.

Fans should not be concerned with the personal staffing decisions of Stardock. Only the quality of the game.

Brad was the one that brought up staffing and Elemental's disasterous release. He went on and on about policies and procedures that failed to bring his "finished" game up to snuff. Then he went on about how much the new talent was going to bring to the table. I generally don't pay that much attention to staff changes, but when you have the company talking about staff for what seems like at least one month since a bad release, people are concerned because the company says they should be.

How can you believe anything this company says when with one hand they offer the gamers bill of rights while with the other hiring, sheltering and embracing someone who would be its worst violator.

Provide definitive proof that Jon Shafer is the worst violator of the gamer's bill of rights.

Until then, this is merely slander.

Now this is silly.. while I WILL blame design decisions on mr. shafer.. the release state, unwillingness to properly support and inclusion of steam are all examples of decisions the suits would make. What that means is.. 2k and take 2.. not Jon.

I can't resist this thread just for comments like this.

According to you, it's bad enough that Stardock hired Jon. Now they're sheltering him! So they've built him a house, or let him live in the staff cafeteria, or put him up at the local YMCA...

I heard they built a hidden room for him in the crawl space under their building and equipped it with all the tools he will need for his work, along with a hot plate, microwave, running water, coffee pot, cot and sleeping bag, trunk for personal belongings, mirror and chemical toilet.You need a special clearance in order to enter. This is to keep him relatively safe from the Civilization Inquisition and random, deranged stalkers.

LOL - Well I just hope Jon gets lots of embracing from Stardock down in his cozy crawl space.

You will have to accept (which is difficult I agree) that the issues with Civ V truly have no fault with Jon (except maybe the loss of city health), nor most of the team at Firaxis.  People have been bashing him, and he's been the good guy all along.

I was not too kind when Civ V came out, in fact, I was awful.  Angry and filled with confusions as to why it was,,, what it was.  but I'm really sad I didn't follow scientific protocal and spend the time necessary to fit all the little bits and pieces together to figure out what was going on since we had so little info to work from. 

Ditto for me.

Good post.

Why are people so willing to give every businessman banker and crappy politician a pass these days? He was at the head of the ship that crash..whether its directly his fault or not doesn't matter...the man must answer for what happened on his watch.

Because nobody is perfect, mistakes are made, apologies are issued, forgiveness is granted, lessons are learned, and a better future is molded. That's how life is.

"One mustn't criticize other people on grounds where he can't stand perpendicular himself." - Mark Twain

I am curious. How would you have him "answer" for what happened? I mean i think this is just a symptom of the industry in general trying to talk circles around bad ideas, but really other than reassure people that he's not trying to dumb down Stardock products and be willing to do Q & A's, that's the most he can do.

Wrong button, double post

That's called "bait and switch". And it is dishonest. Why don't grow up, little boy and get a life.

So he went on to lead a game that is a financial success, and a critically acclaimed game, that some of the more loud mouthed unwashed masses aren't happy about. (People like you) Yet you want him to come out and face the music. You are either a retard, or someone whose intelligence borderlines on needing to be put in a state ran facility. If you really believe this, then I suggest you put on a second tin foil hat and don't leave the basement again for at least another 5 years. Good luck astronaut.

Actually that matters a great deal. Jon was not the president, king, emperor or supreme overlord where he worked previously. I'm sure he didn't work in a vacuum...

On second thought, why I am bothering with this. What dragoaskani said, but nicer.