Yeah, it bothered me that the banking centers cost so much to build.

Hey Marvinkosh, been following your progress for awhile and playing with your mod installed since it first came out, so I felt an obligation to came here and say Thanks for your work and time. With all the AI problems and other bugs afecting the way I play this game, and feeling that stardock is not giving a dam about this game anymore, is good to see some people like you putting some effort and time, so we can actually have a balanced and fun gameplay.

I'm sure Stardock does give a damn, but unfortunately there's what you would like to do and what you can actually do given what else is on your plate.  I mean really, even I'm not putting as much time into this as I could be, because there is another project I'm working on that I can't really drop on someone else.

Anyway thanks for dropping by and letting me know, it makes me glad to know there's someone out there enjoying improved gameplay, and that's payment enough for my time.

New version posted with the changes I mentioned on the previous page, top post has the details as always.

Reason why Terrans have Xeno Communications and Universal Translators as Core Technologies is because first of all, they are cheap techs which, in the early game at least, makes them easy to research even if the AI has the research slider set to like, 20% while it cranks out colony ships and builds market centres.  Second of all, the Terrans with their Super Diplomacy ability and inherent Diplomacy bonus gain an advantage in being able to negotiate for stuff that they want.

Made a few changes to the Torian tech tree, they weren't researching the new Space Weapons tech which leads to (for them) Beam Weapon Theory and Lasers.

I'm also rotating out the Terrans from testing, and bringing in the Drengin at long last.

Excellent! Very keen to see what you do with the Drengin, I haven't been able to make them competent myself, always vying with the Drath for last place whether modded or unmodded.

Haven't tried out your Yor changes yet but the Torians are owning in the latest game - colonized twice as much as anyone else, but also developed planets sensibly, researched yellow techs and are building wonders left, right and center (in recent turns have seen the Galactic Monument, Orbital Terraformer and Nano Recorders pop up, all of which are usually reliably mine to get at my own pace). They seem to have gone Beam in this game, and tech trading is off so I assume they researched it for themselves.

Yeah.  The Torians do pretty well now even with the default AI, but they are so much better at developing planets if they have a different AI set.

Which AI do you find they're best with? I have them on 8 at the moment and it seems to work for them.

The Iconians just surrendered to the Drengin (also flipped to a working AI, I think 8 again) so they now have as many planets as the Torians. Interested in seeing how the Drengin deal with this and whether they still suck when they are gifted a huge empire.

I've been playing with Torians on 8 for my current playtest.  I have the Drengin on 11 but, as I've only made minimal changes to their tech tree, I don't expect them to be focused in their technological progression.  That said, they are doing fairly well for themselves.

I find Drengin on 8 to be extremely powerful - generally, I put races whose natural personality tends to be aggressive on 8.

Well so far I have found that the Drengin focus a bit too much on manufacturing.  It's causing their economy to drag much like the Terrans and Altarians did with those awful early factories. I will need to get to work on that so they build a more balanced economy.

I've also streamlined the Torian tech tree some more.  They were getting a bit stuck, researching everything except what they needed to progress forward, which meant that their early fleets consisted of fighters with Particle Cannons, which are quickly out-classed.  I've made their Central Mine available later on in the tech tree, meaning that Basic Mines stick around for a while.

I've now done preliminary streamlining on the Drengin tech tree, grouping what I consider to be essential technologies into Core Technologies, and adding Technology Progression in there too.

I have also switched out Basic Pit for Massive Slave Pit, which is a Super Project that the Drengin can use to boost production considerably on one planet.  Black Market is now Black Market Sector, which is another Super Project which provides a considerable economic bonus to one planet.  The first lab (Slaveling Imagination Lab) is changed for an Experimentation Centre, again a Super Project, which provides a small amount of research on the planet it is built on but provides a 15% empire-wide research bonus.

I still need to test it out of course, but in theory it should give the Drengin the basis for a better economy.

Sorry for not updating lately.  I needed to finish up another project I was working on.  I have some time free so I should be able to pick up testing again and see what's what with the Drengin.

Okay well, for starters, the Drengin have way too much love of those extreme colonisation techs.  I've moved those to after Tech Progression II and III so that they first actually have the research infrastructure to waste time researching those, and in the meantime they have some kind of weapons to keep them from being bullied by the Altarians.

Rather than waste a whole bunch of time starting another new game, I'm going to use cheat mode and get the Drengin finished with that stuff, and then see what they do.

Apart from a few oddities, like researching Medium Scale Building a little too eagerly (they had Frigates loaded up with Sparrows!) the Drengin are doing pretty well for themselves now.  I'll need to give it another run tomorrow.

I've posted a new version which incorporates the changes to the Drengin tech tree and improvements that I mentioned last month.  I've played it out and they seem pretty solid, so long as you use personality 11.

I personally find the Drengin work much better on personality 8, though I'm admittedly using a different mod. They also seem to play more "Drengin-like" then what they're like on 11.

Well I guess I'll have to give that a try at some point.  If only I could play ten games at once.

Okay I noticed that Drengin Ion Cannons cost quite a bit more than Mass Drivers, despite the fact that they get only 1% off the sizemod of Mass Drivers (and take slightly less time to research).  I've lowered the cost appropriately to 24.

Could you perhaps include a brief description about how to install this mod for the ignorants such as myself...? I'd love to try this out.

So how exactly did you work around the Drengin's obsession with manufacturing techs? It's been an increasingly obvious characteristic of their behavior in my own games.

First of all, you should check that you have a mod folder.

C:\Documents and Settings\Username\My Documents\My Games\GC2TwilightArnor\Mods

(This may vary depending on operating system)

If it doesn't exist at all, create it.

Extract the ZIP file to the mod folder.  You should then have a folder inside Mods named SWFix_ModIV.  This is the mod folder you want the game to point at.

In-game, select the mod folder you want to use.  If you can't seem to select a mod folder, you may need a fix mod for that screen.  See here.

You also need to check 'Use mods', obviously.

So my latest test game is looking promising.  The Torians and Altarians have taken an early military lead, as they usually do, but the Drengin are definitely nailing the early weapons research and if they start churning out their ion-cannon fighters, well they are going to annihilate those guys, 'cause the Torians still only have Particle Cannons, and as for the Altarians well I don't know, but I will find out.

So far as working around the obsession with manufacturing techs goes, like the other races the better and shinier stuff is on the other side of Technology Progression projects.  There may still be some tweaking to do, but essentially the trunk of the tech tree gives each race what it needs to keep up in terms of research, and it can pursue the branches it has access to if it needs them at the time.

Whether the AI sees these future techs on the other side or not, if it can't research them now, it cannot really be obsessed with them, and it has to unlock better research facilities even if it isn't going to build many of them.

Okay well the Drengin are now pursuing a good research strategy, only trouble is they are still being outnumbered three or four to one in terms of colonies by the Torians and Altarians.  Of course, even I'm being outnumbered by those guys, but I have enough that it's not hurting my chances.

So what I was thinking was, rather than having the Drengin play by the same rules as the other races (having to spend ages and ages researching Planetary Invasion) perhaps I should give them a hefty discount on that tech, put it right in there after basic space weapons, and let them go and do what they do best - invade the Torian's brains out.

I also think I will have to nerf the Torian mine improvements, as that's what is giving them such a big leg up in the first place.  They shouldn't be the galaxy's leading industrialists just because they've spammed their most basic improvement on nearly every planet they own.

Ugh, no wonder the turns are slowing down.  The Torians are fielding over 3000 fighters, all equipped with the basic particle cannon.  The Drengin ships are far superior, but against the sheer weight of green power, they just can't win.

So I think I will change the pre-requisite tech for the basic particle cannon, and only militant races will get that tech.  It's a pretty short list, because apparently only the Drengin and Thalans have aggression over 50.  I've made an exception for the Korath and Arcean, because their super abilities work better if they have some kind of weapons.

By giving that weapon its own tech, each race will still get the pre-requisite for Battlestations, but they won't all get a highly inefficient particle cannon.