[Gameplay] Make tactical combat more realistic and "gritty"

Let the other guy hit back BEFORE they die

from Elemental Forums

Something was bothering me about the tactical combats - and today I finally figured it out:

In essence the combats boiled down to "whoever strikes first wins". My sovereign has been roaming the countryside killing everything left and right without taking a single scratch. That 20 Attack, 5 HP guy? Killed him with my 10 Attack, 10 HP Sovereign - sure he'd have turned me into minced meat if he hit me, but I hit him first and he died without resistance.

So my suggestion is that the other unit hits back before damage is dealt - e.g. I hit him for 6, he hits me for 9, damage is dealt - he's dead and I'm at 1 (I got lucky) This way you no longer can mow down entire hordes of enemies with a "Uber" unit with a extremely high attack and high speed - without taking a scratch.

To summarize:

 

System now:

1) Attacker hits

2) Defender takes damage

3) If Defender still alive: Defender Retailates

4) If Defender still alive: Attacker takes Damage

 

New System:

1) Attacker hits

2) Defender retaliates

3) Attacker and Defender take damage

28,557 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

I personally think that would be a better system.

What I see as pros of the new system:

1) Shorter tactical battles. It will effectively halve the time of hand to hand combat in situations when there is a counter attack.

2) It will make battles more challenging.

3) There could a new special ability called "First Strike" that works as the old system, so the old system could be kept  as a smaller part of the new.

 

What I see as cons of the new system:

1) It could be somewhat difficult to implement?

 

Your thoughts?

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

Seems cool, especially considering the possibility of a "First Strike" ability which basically does what the old system did.

 

I'd prefer First Strike to be an ability that only heroes can learn.

Elemental: Reforged
Reply #3 from Elemental Forums Top

Nooooooooo!

 

First strike should be weapon specific and action specific.

 

We need charge function, facing, and weapon lengths!

Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

I don't see a problem with the system itself, but it does not solve the problem you described.

 

The problem isn't "whoever attacks first wins", that's just the result of the problem.

The problem is that the ratio between HP and the damage can easily turn most heroes into "glass cannons" .

 

In a simultaneous combat round, instead of getting one unit easily killed, now you get two. It still doesn't encourage the heroes to participate in melee combat, in fact it does exactly the opposite...

Ranged units and spells will become stronger, and heroes will still easily die.

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

And add to that by the time the SoV gets into any serious combat (threatening life type stuff) he has Magic that can negate the enemies retalitory strike capabilites.

Besides, why is a SoV fighting hand to hand. He/she has some rather potent Magic for killing stuff at range. If it getting to your SoV alive, then he/she should be running away... ;)

The issue still is about the Defense # of any given unit. Watching a MISS fest is simply outrageous. What is needed is weapons that can by-pass the defense rating and thus allow players to build better stacks versus other types of Stacks.

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

The point is that CC oriented combat should still be valid.

What fun is a game where only "Shooty" builds are acceptable?

Reply #7 from Elemental Forums Top

They should make battles like total war and if you want to think about what to do hit space bar to pause it. Give your commands and then unpause it.

Reply #8 from Elemental Forums Top

I say no to this idea. It reminds me to much of galactic civilizations 2 combat (After a certain patch). Nothing more enraging then a dead enemy able to lash out at you even though he's already dead.