You Need to Re-Think Your Decision on Race Customization (Here's Why)
You don't want Static Factions
Elemental Forums
I really think there's a Big Aspect of this the Player Base hasn't thought of. First though, a quote from Frogboy...
Quoting Raven X,
reply 17
Hmm, should have seen where this post would head when you made it, Frogboy. You scared everyone. Now they think if you add more Race Customization all the storyline and everything you have NOW is just going to disappear..
I'm seeing that as well. People tend to quickly go into black or white.
There's no scenario where we're going to drop our factions and our lore.
The question is what level of complexity should be introduced. Do we have Factions AND Races that are distinct or do we simplify and simply talk about factions.
The lore is going to be there regardless.
But from these two threads I've seen people jump in and say "Oh, so it's just going to be generic factions." We'd have to rip stuff out to do that and we're not about to do that.
Frogboy, admittedly, said he was biased on his idea but he still wanted to breach the subject. Without meaning too though, he scared a lot of people and a Lot more people got the wrong idea because they aren't seeing the big picture when it comes to the Races and Factions. We all want fleshed out, in depth, story driven factions. All Of Us want that, me included. What is really going to flesh out those factions Will Not Be The Backstory. That's just fluff no matter what way you look at it. It has No Baring On Gameplay. It's only there to give you background information and to help suspend belief and add immersion.
What Will Affect Gameplay is the bonuses and negatives these "factions" receive. None us want just plain old bonuses and minuses, that's not In Depth factions. That's the same old, same old, that All These Games have. The idea Frogboy has about tying these races to other bonuses based on the land will help flesh this out more. Example: The race/faction that likes the desert will get a bonus for building there while the race/faction that likes the ocean will get bonuses for building near water. Both of those will get minuses for building on land that they don't know much about or is too opposite compared to what they normally build on. That is tied to the backstory for each faction.
These are STATIC FACTIONS. You can't change them without knowing how to Mod the AI or the Code that tells them how to react. Also once you tie in modifiers that make races/factions instinctively like or dislike each other you make it even MORE STATIC. This might be fun and "fleshed out" at first, but it won't stay that way for long. Once the player knows how Tarth plays and how they interact with the other factions they play someone else. Now Tarth is completely predictable. Every time they play they'll build in the same places, they'll always dislike certain other factions/races, ALWAYS, and that won't be changeable without knowing how to Mod Code and that's normally a Lot Harder then modding how something looks or what bonuses or minuses they have. Once you learn how all the factions/races interact with each other EVERY GAME BECOMES THE SAME. Sure the map might be different, but once you put opponents on it you'll know how they'll get along, who will ally with who, who will go to war with who....Every Game because they are STATIC because of Fluff Story Reasons.
Does that Really Sound Fun? REALLY? Not to me it doesn't. It will be awesome at first of course, but once you learn the system it becomes the same old game on a different map every time you play...
Now lets throw in the Race Customizations that Frogboy discussed. Because you can make your own Sovereign's and Factions this means you can make your Own Opponents to fight against. With Race Customization you can make Races as well, as many as you want. These Races can have a whole bunch of different bonuses and penalties that you can change every time you make a race. Because these races are self made you decide how they react to other races. You decide what kind of AI will govern their diplomacy. You decide what kinds of lands they like and dislike. Now, every time you want the game to different you make a new race or delete a old one. Now there's a Unknown Element on the field. A New Race/Faction that you don't know if they'll hate you or if they'll like you. You may not how they'll react when they meet another race you made. These are NOT STATIC because you can create or destroy them at will, all WITHOUT KNOWING HOW TO MOD OR EDIT SCRIPTS!!!!
The most fun I've ever had with strategy games were the ones with lots of variables. The ones that played differently every time I played them because I never knew how my opponents would react. The very best challenges I ever had came from enemies I created. My own personal Mod for Gal Civ 2 has a whole slew of alien races I fight against. I even custom made their ships. I fight the Borg and the Federation and the Klingons and the Asgard and the Wraith. Some times the Wraith hate the Borg, other times they get along and team up and own everyone.
I want Elemental to be like that. I want it to be a little random when I play and Not The Same. I don't want to be able to predict how a game will play out before I play it because I already know how all the factions will interact with each other. No matter who I play as I'll always have the same evil allies or the same good allies and they'll in turn hate or like the same people they always hate or like.
Please, Everyone, put a little more thought into this and maybe re-think your choice. Let's make Elemental Special. A game where we can change what we want If We Chose To, or not if we don't. A Game where we can have the heavy rich story elements and fleshed out factions/races AND be able to custom make new ones and make them look and feel the way We Want...WIHOUT HAVING TO LEARN A MODDING LANGUAGE.
Let's face it, as soon as you get tired of playing the game and you know how all the factions play out you're going to put away the game and move on. You aren't going to learn how to write computer code just so you can make a new enemy or two. If it's built into the game already it's a Lot Easier to do.
Please.....just think.
and in the end the AI was awful. playing against the Yor was much harder then playing against a custom made Borg enemy.
...even tho I am not sure that the Havok engine is capable for something like this or not.