The Obama Doctrine Revisited

The administration's effort to transform American foreign policy has been much more successful abroad than it has been at home.

http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_obama_doctrine_revisited

Several weeks before President Barack Obama announced an escalation of the Afghanistan War at West Point, a group of journalists and think-tankers met for dinner at the Washington, D.C., embassy of a NATO ally to debate war strategy. Chatham House rules apply to the dinner, so I'm not allowed to tell you who said what or even what embassy it was, but for all the disagreement among intelligent people about a sensible way forward in Afghanistan -- or out of it -- one clear, declarative, and unchallenged statement emerged. Whatever troop increase Obama decided was necessary, NATO would make sure the U.S. was not alone.

To say this was hardly a foregone conclusion is an understatement. Since taking office in 2006, Robert Gates, the secretary of defense Obama chose to inherit from George W. Bush, has dutifully trudged to NATO defense ministerials and special summits to implore the Europeans to increase their troop commitments to Afghanistan. Each time, Gates has made an impassioned plea about the future of the alliance and the necessity of the Afghan mission, and each time, he has received a polite reception and a pittance of troops, if any. Asked at the dinner why this time would be different, especially with Afghanistan skepticism rising in Europe, the foreign diplomats first expressed a desire to see Afghanistan become a stable nation and then leveled with us: The allies have an interest in the success of the Obama administration.

In early 2008, I interviewed the foreign-policy and national-security brain trust of the Obama campaign for this magazine to gain a sense of what a world led by President Obama would look like. There were two big takeaways. The first was something I called "dignity promotion," an inchoate idea that the architecture of international alliances and institutions ought to prioritize human dignity, material as well as aspirational, in order to achieve global stability and prosperity. Implicit in the idea was that Obama would return the U.S. to its pre-Bush role as leader and champion of international cooperation to build a world in which American power and global prosperity were seen as mutually supporting objectives. The second was a meta-point about a path to get there: by confronting what Obama's advisers called the "politics of fear" that restricted what was possible for America to achieve on the world stage.

Now that the Obama administration has been in office for nearly a year and a half, it's time to return to those ideas and judge their merits, their impacts, and whether they have guided Obama's presidency at all. It would be unfair to offer firm judgments over such a short period in office. (Rendering a verdict on the Bush administration's foreign policy in April 2002, for instance, would miss an entirely unnecessary war.) But Obama's foreign policy so far contains a magnitude and a direction, and it remains notably similar to what he promised to deliver in his 2008 campaign.

On dignity promotion, the administration has racked up real successes and set the stage for several more. Obama has proved that the world is prepared for positive-sum American leadership -- whether it's by restructuring U.S. global economic partnerships through the G-20 instead of the more restricted G-8 set of powerful nations; whether it's resetting relationships with great and rising powers like Russia and China over contentious issues like Iran and climate change; whether it's explaining to the Muslim world that America's commitment to its well-being reaches far beyond securing its cooperation in the fight against terrorism. Dignity promotion, a new twist on the very old idea of liberal internationalism, is still taking shape. But the early evidence is that it's working -- for America and for the world.

Where Obama hasn't made nearly as much progress, to the disappointment of his supporters, is on confronting the politics of fear. The first days -- literally -- of the administration were defined by sweeping pledges to end torture, close the detention facility at Guantánamo Bay, and revise the U.S. approach to terrorism detentions. But that early promise is over. While the administration has taken political risks, revamping interrogations around humane information-gathering methods and charging top terrorism captives in civilian courts, it has lost battle after battle with Congress over Guantánamo. Instead of ending the Bush administration's military commissions, an ad hoc and unsuccessful forum for trying war criminals that the courts have rejected, the Obama administration has merely revamped them. It has reserved the right to hold people it considers dangerous indefinitely without charge, which violates the fundamental spirit of the Constitution. And its plan for closing Guantánamo involves moving the detainees to an Illinois prison, preserving the two key features that have made Gitmo an international symbol of lawlessness -- military commissions and indefinite detention. The most charitable judgment possible is that the administration picks its battles with the politics of fear very carefully.

It's tempting to conclude that as long as the administration racks up substantive international successes, its handling of domestic politics will appear trivial. After all, the right-wing outcry over Obama's refusal to torture Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, the would-be Christmas bomber, was tempered by the revelation that Pakistan and the CIA have been arresting the Afghan Taliban's top leadership, something absolutely no one in Washington thought likely during the last decade. But to count this as a success is to misunderstand the ambition and promise of the Obama doctrine.

"What we're trying to get to is a sustainable approach," says Ben Rhodes, the influential deputy national security adviser for strategic communications. "Something that won't just be the Obama administration's approach to these issues but will be the next administration's." Unless the administration begins more forcefully confronting the politics of fear, it won't be able to instill public confidence and build political will for durable international institutions and global partnership. Dignity promotion will not outlast Obama unless he more thoroughly confronts the demagoguery it inspires.

 

***

Most U.S. administrations would have sent a military presence to assist in a humanitarian disaster in the Western Hemisphere. When Haiti was hit by a major earthquake in January, the Obama administration sent much more: an entire Army brigade as well as the medical ship the USNS Comfort, the USS Bataan, and the Bataan's detachment of 2,200 Marines -- even with two wars going on. The administration also tapped the civilian elements of government to aid the Haitian rescue and reconstruction mission. Rajiv Shah, administrator of the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID), practically lived in Haiti for a month coordinating development and reconstruction aid from the front. When firefighters from Los Angeles County pulled an elderly woman from the remains of a collapsed building, Haitians actually chanted "USA!" A video of the scene has been viewed more than 70,000 times on YouTube. Dignity: promoted.

Of course, aiding Haiti comes with no political cost. In other nations and other situations, building an architecture of international cooperation that favors human dignity can provoke a backlash, so the first step is securing the cooperation of often-recalcitrant nations. For the Obama administration's gamble to work, the rest of the world first needs to see that the U.S. is once again "willing to commit to a new era of engagement based on mutual interests and mutual respect," as Gen. Jim Jones, Obama's national-security adviser, told the Center for American Progress in January. Jones called that commitment to engagement "the defining feature of our foreign policy."

There is evidence that this feature is paying off. After a series of high-profile embraces of Russia in September, President Dmitry Medvedev for the first time indicated he was open to U.S.–backed sanctions on Iran for its nuclear program and began negotiating a new bilateral treaty to mutually reduce U.S. and Russian stockpiles of nuclear weapons and secure loose nuclear material. Remarkably, Georgia, which went to war with Russia in 2008, also has maintained its relationship with the U.S., as Eka Tkeshelashvili, Georgia's national-security adviser, told me in February. Georgia even sent a battalion of soldiers to Afghanistan's volatile Helmand Province, which it calls the "Holbrooke Brigade" after the Obama administration's special representative to Afghanistan and Pakistan. Obama's visit to China in November earned rave reviews, and Obama gave a speech in Shanghai outlining a future of mutual cooperation, challenging China in a non-confrontational way to ease its restrictions on civil, political, and human rights.

There have been disappointments as well. At the global climate summit in Copenhagen, Obama and other world leaders were unable to yield "anything more than a decision to 'take note' of an intention to act" on climate change, as Al Gore put it, due to the mutually reinforcing downward spiral of Chinese obstructionism and U.S. legislative inaction.

Still, if there is an example of how "engagement based on mutual interests and mutual respect" has succeeded beyond anyone's expectations, it's Pakistan. For years, intelligence professionals and military officers warned that the Afghanistan War could not be successfully concluded while the Pakistani government allowed the Afghan Taliban leadership to operate from its territory, providing resources, guerrillas, and strategic direction for its forces across the border. And for just as long, the Bush administration issued directives to the Pakistani military that the Pakistanis promptly ignored. Once Obama came into office, his national-security team absorbed Pakistani complaints that U.S. policy was limited merely to terrorism. Obama opened the aperture, pushing Congress to pass a $7.5 billion, five-year aid package for Pakistani governance and civil society, along with a new military aid package for counterinsurgency support. The administration stopped publicly criticizing Pakistani lassitude on counterterrorism and gave it two major pieces of additional support: CIA drones began targeting the leaders of Pakistan's own Taliban, who had killed and terrorized hundreds of Pakistanis, and pressed India to return to diplomatic dialogue.

In February, the effort began to pay dividends. Pakistanis aided by the CIA arrested Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar, the deputy commander of the Taliban, by far the highest-ranking Taliban capture in eight years of war. Within days, the Pakistanis began to round up more leaders of the Taliban movement it had sponsored by proxy since the mid-1990s. No one is quite sure what the Pakistanis' gambit is, and the cynical explanation is that they are trying to shape the terms of a peace deal between the Taliban and the Afghan government. If that's true, however, it entails a conclusion to the Afghanistan War around circumstances that favor U.S. interests.

Perhaps the most complex problem from the perspective of dignity promotion is Iran. During 2009, Obama made a visible effort to reach out to Iran on a variety of fronts. He recorded a video for the Persian New Year to offer respect and goodwill to the Iranian public and wrote a personal message to Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, the leader of the clerical regime, earning him the mutual ridicule of the Iranian regime and the American right. But in the middle of the year, the Green Movement -- the massive and sustained popular protests against President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and, within months, the entire regime -- challenged the administration's presumption that Iran at least had stable leadership. Suddenly, repression increased to levels not seen since the short-lived student protests of the 1990s, all as new revelations of hidden Iranian nuclear progress emerged by the fall.

For the first time in the administration, dignity promotion was a poor guide for bilateral relations. Diplomatic outreach appeared to violate its spirit, as the one fairly clear message from the Green Movement to the outside world was to not legitimize the regime through diplomacy. But promoting the stability of the region depended upon forestalling a nuclear Iran, especially as Israel threatened airstrikes against the Iranian nuclear program. As soon as the Green Movement emerged in June, conservatives pressed Obama to adopt a more hostile posture and doubted his commitment to human rights when he didn't.

Instead, Obama sought to remove the U.S. from the equation -- and in doing so, he advanced Iranian dignity and nonproliferation efforts at the same time. Obama did not embrace the Green Movement, speaking instead about the regime's need to live up to its international human-rights obligations, a measure preventing the regime from portraying the Greens as American stooges. "The power of the Green Movement is that it's not an American-sponsored movement; it's an indigenous movement," Rhodes says. All of a sudden, a regime reliant on demagogic hatred of the U.S. was unable to sell its familiar story. "This isn't about the United States and a conflict with the Iranian government anymore," Rhodes continues. "This is about the Iranian government and what it can tell its own people about the future it has for them."

At the same time, Obama's visible and unrequited efforts to respect the regime's legitimate rights to peaceful nuclear energy helped convince once-recalcitrant nations like Russia, formerly Iran's de facto protector at the United Nations Security Council, to consider sanctioning Iran for its illicit enrichment. (That "reset" with Russia paid dividends.) At the Security Council later this spring, Ambassador Susan Rice will push through a sanctions package targeting the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps, a hard-line wing of the Iranian military that both largely controls the nuclear program and is responsible for much internal repression. A Green Movement activist in Tehran told me that Iranians, typically unenthusiastic about economic pressure, would not oppose sanctions aimed at the IRGC.

"The international community is more united than it's ever been on Iran. You see nonaligned countries voting to censure Iran. That hasn't happened before in the kind of margin that we saw in the [International Atomic Energy Agency] Board of Governors' vote," Rhodes contends, referring to a rare diplomatic victory against the regime last year. "Iran, by any measure, is in a weaker position today than it was when we took office, and the international community is in a stronger position today as it relates to Iran than when we took office." So far, dignity promotion passed one of its hardest tests, demonstrating that it can be a creative solution to unlocking the facile and binary choices between promoting human rights and promoting global security.

But at the same time, the Iranian regime's internal repression and self-marginalizing geopolitics deferred what will be among the most domestically controversial principles of the Obama administration: direct negotiation with unsavory and anti-American international actors. Obama has not yet convinced the public that he should put American prestige on the line for such talks. That fits a familiar pattern for Obama throughout 2009 -- one that could upend his administration's international agenda.

 

***

By this summer, the Afghanistan surge should be complete, which will mean Obama will have nearly tripled the number of troops there; placed one of the leading lights of the U.S. Army at the effort's helm; reconfigured war strategy overwhelmingly; and, perhaps most important, demonstrated a willingness to stake his presidency on the successful conclusion of a war his predecessor considered an afterthought. Yet a recurrent feature of GOP criticism is that the president is, as Dick Cheney put it in December, "trying to pretend we are not at war."

The administration rose to the bait. Dan Pfeiffer, the White House communications director, blogged a compendium of practically every utterance of the word "war" by Obama. What he might also have mentioned was Obama's vast expansion of the CIA's drone-strike program in Pakistan; an expanded but still largely unclear role for the Joint Special Operations Command for counterterrorism operations in Afghanistan and Pakistan; and another expansion of military operations against al-Qaeda affiliates in Yemen and Somalia. That's a lot of war.

Notice what the White House didn't say. The administration didn't challenge the presumption, by Cheney and his allies, that the default posture against al-Qaeda ought to be ceaseless war. Intelligence and counterterrorism professionals say fairly frequently that granting al-Qaeda the rhetorical status of "warriors" plays into the extremists' hands. What they can't take is being called criminals and murderers, particularly murderers of innocents. That's why, for instance, Ayman Al-Zawahri, bin Laden's deputy, took the rare step of directly soliciting and answering critics' questions in a 2008 audiotape that centered largely around refuting the charges of murder. A February 2010 video, by contrast, said that Obama's policies "are no less ugly than the crimes of his predecessor."

The politics of fear may have lost some of its potency since Bush left office. But the Obama administration has occasionally governed as if that fear continues unabated, particularly concerning terrorism. In May, Obama announced that some Guantánamo detainees would be tried in military commissions -- the quasi-legal system created after September 11 that has convicted exactly three terrorists, compared to more than 300 sentenced by federal courts -- and which Obama had opposed as a senator. What's more, Obama floated the prospect that some detainees could neither be charged nor released, requiring instead some form of indefinite detention without charge, a decision embraced in early 2010 by a Justice Department task force. Obama did not explain how he knew someone was dangerous but couldn't convince a court of that danger. The substantive effect was to transform Obama's pledge to close Guantánamo into a bargain to transfer detainees to a facility in Illinois where they will face either indefinite detention or military commissions -- in other words, exactly what they face at Guantánamo Bay.

Predictably, the president's conservative critics didn't embrace his rightward move as a well-intentioned compromise. They doubled down on the line that his pledge to close Guantánamo is endangering America, and they concluded from his embrace of indefinite detention that he can be compelled to abandon the pledge entirely. Sen. Mitch McConnell gave a speech in February advancing every argument possible against closing Guantánamo, even the civil-libertarian contention that al-Qaeda will use "a new long-term detention facility inside the United States for the same recruiting and propaganda purposes for which they've used other courts and Guantánamo in the past." In February, Sen. Lindsey Graham conditionalized GOP support for closing Guantánamo -- a position once supported by John McCain -- on the administration abandoning its plan to try 9-11 attacker Khalid Shaikh Mohammed in a civilian court.

In other words, a compromise plan on Guantánamo Bay has disappointed progressive supporters and only intensified right-wing criticism of Obama. It is impossible to say that Obama would be in a better political position had he simply announced he would either try terrorism suspects in civilian courts or release them if there wasn't compelling evidence against them. As the criticism intensifies, though, the Obama team has played to win the news cycle rather than change the debate. After a cable-news-driven outcry against Obama's decision to put the would-be Christmas bomber on trial, the White House's counterterrorism chief, John Brennan, wrote a pugilistic op-ed in USA Today pointing out that "there have been three convictions of terrorists in the military tribunal system since 9/11, and hundreds in the criminal justice system." A compelling point, had Obama not embraced those military tribunals.

It's not as if Obama hasn't confronted the politics of fear at all. Some fever swamps of the right still lambaste Obama for not stressing the Islamic character of al-Qaeda. In fact, Brennan explained in August that the administration deliberately didn't use the word "jihadist" in order to deny al-Qaeda any claim to Muslim heroism. "We don't afford them any religious stature," Rhodes says. "That's more important to them than being called 'warriors.'"

But Obama's inconsistent confrontation of the politics of fear fails to build a constituency for the very large changes that he envisions. And it's coming at a time when his broader agenda is running into a rejectionist and hyper-empowered GOP Senate minority that is very likely to grow after November. The White House's greatest shortcoming is that its efforts at political combat are aimed at staving off defeat rather than sowing the seeds of victory.

Obama, however, has an advantage: The politics of fear appears less potent now. After the failed Christmas bombing, the GOP campaign against Obama was relentless, with politicians and mouthpieces lining up to denounce the president's weakness. While his critics brayed, Obama launched a systemic review, made recommendations, stepped up assistance to the Yemeni government against al-Qaeda, refused to torture Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, charged him in criminal court and ultimately got him to talk to interrogators by shaming him with his disappointed family. A Washington Post poll in early February found that Obama's approval rating on counterterrorism actually increased three points. The public trusted him to handle terrorism by five points more than the GOP, which had enjoyed a polling advantage on national security since at least Vietnam.

By any measure, the attacks on Obama failed. But they haven't stopped, as the GOP considers them an investment in a future public repudiation of Obama. And fending off an anachronistic and failed set of policy alternatives was not the promise of the Obama presidency. The Obama team pledged to be present at the creation of a new American-led internationalism, with the promotion of human dignity at its core and lasting stability and prosperity as its promise. And there the administration's pragmatism is a blessing and a burden. "If we measure our efforts against an ideal, we won't succeed," Rhodes says. "But if you measure them with regard to progress, then we are confident that the legacy of this administration can be an America that has renewed its leadership and its strength and influence in an international system that is functioning better." The past 17 months have proved that the world will largely follow where President Obama will lead -- if he's willing to lead

Edit: By Spencer Ackerman

7,217 views 20 replies
Reply #1 Top

I.. really liked that article. I put a lot of perspective on the past year, and the failings and successes of the Obama administration, and trying to figure a coherent rationale that motivated the different decisions taken.

Obviously, you will probably be dismissing it as a load of crap, since it's not criticising Obama on every topic, eh?

Reply #2 Top

Obviously, you will probably be dismissing it as a load of crap, since it's not criticising Obama on every topic, eh?

I'd call it more a puff piece that attempts, weakly, to appear unbiased. It has the classic liberal buzz words like "politics of fear" and totally excused by omission left based fear mongering, including race baiting. EVERYTHING the president does should be looked at critically. What does it say when the author uses passages like this, "The past 17 months have proved that the world will largely follow where President Obama will lead -- if he's willing to lead? That tells me the rest of the world are a bunch of idiots waiting to follow this guy, into a sewer if need be, IF he decides he wants to lead. Like I said weak attempt to sound objective.

...but I get why you like it! ;)

Reply #3 Top

...but I get why you like it!

I tries to give a comprehensive and.. err.. what's the word..? Unified interpretation of Obama's foreign agenda so far, rather than nitpicking one element after the other.

It has the classic liberal buzz words like "politics of fear" and totally excused by omission left based fear mongering, including race baiting.

You do know that this so-called "Politic of Fear" was definetly in place (or at least, FELT) during Bush administration? I mean, I lived in Canada and Dubai during that time. I had friends from the U.K., Syria, Ireland also. Usually, we agreed that Bush was acting either with a stick or with the threat of a stick (either his or the terrorists').

Ain't saying that he did all bad. Just that he came across as a bully to both his friends and ennemies. An inneffectual bully (to his friends, and most of his ennemies). Many people didn't see the point of trying to compromise with him.. he seemed... ... dogmatic.

So.. maybe on your side of the border, it's a buzz word. For us, it was a very real foreign affair element coming out of America.

Reply #4 Top

I was going to comment, but I think NitroCruiser summed it up well.  But then I read this comment:

I tries to give a comprehensive and.. err.. what's the word..? Unified interpretation of Obama's foreign agenda so far, rather than nitpicking one element after the other.

Unified?  The author of the piece is a paid shill for Obama.  He offers glowing terms and euphemisms, but no nuts and bolts results of his starry-eyed vision.  Clearly at best you can say that it is too soon to judge Obama's foreign policy (and that is the only thing the author gets right).  But if we are to evaluate it at this juncture (and it is not 17 months BTW, it is a mere 15), we would have to say it is an abject failure.  He has repaired no bridges, and burned down many.

I make a challenge.  Instead of me pontificating on his losses, perhaps you can enumerate his victories.  And please let's keep it concrete.  In other words "repairing relations with Russia" does not count when they have done nothing concrete that was not already there with Bush.  Promises made (and most broken) do not mean concrete results.  When the promise is kept, that is concrete.

It should not take you long to list them.

Reply #5 Top

The article up-here cites one good victory on Obama's part. The capture of the taliban leadership in Pakistan, and the start of actual standing up of the Pakistani military against the tribal regions housing the Talibans. These are still good and hard victory, both on the diplomatic and the military side.

He sent one of the most massive relief force to Haiti after the earthquake, doing more direct and immediate aid the U.S. ever did to another nation in a time of crisis.

And as for the rest? It's too early to tell. But pray tell me what were any president's achievement in the first 15 months of office bigger than him. Usually, you can see within that first year the kind of presidency he'll try to achieve, and the tone he sets. Reagan hasn't done much in his 1st year, but that year still set the bases of his future actions.

Bush Jr.'s first year wasn't a shining ray of strong actions either (but I do remember him already putting up argument toward invading Iraq, before even 9/11). He reacted well to 9/11 and invaded Afghanistan, but I think we can agree that the invasion has not turned out well on the mid-term (mid: 5-7 years. Long: 10-15 years). They missed something critical in the post-invasion period.

Clinton's presidency was one of peacetime. There wasn't any big struggle that demanded the U.S.'s attention around the world, save a few wildfire that managed to catch the public's attention between two tabloid headlines on... ..... (who was the focus of Tabloid in the 90's?)

Reply #6 Top

You do know that this so-called "Politic of Fear" was definetly in place (or at least, FELT) during Bush administration?

Sure, the left coined the phase then, and is still trying using it now. It's much harder to sell when your party is in power and the majority of people think you are dragging the country down the toilet. When the administration ignores the will of the people, I'd call that the politics of tyranny. Of course socialist minded people here want that.

Ain't saying that he did all bad. Just that he came across as a bully to both his friends and ennemies.

GWB a bully? Please elaborate, who and how did he bully? Frankly, it sounds exactly like the US left's baseless talking points during the Bush years. Liberals like to pretend US allies were somehow "duped" into going to Iraq, it makes themselves feel better. I'm not not saying he was perfect, far from it, but that was mainly on domestic issues.

As for Obama, he is coming across weak. The START treaty, I'm sure will be triumphed as a wonderful thing (still plenty of nukes to vaporize the planet surface), but in reality probably sealed the fate of at least part of our ally Georgia. Ahmadinejad just publicly insulted Obama, basically calling him wet behind the ears (never thought I'd be in agreement with anything he said until now) and dismissed him entirely. Other countries do take notice. Russia is in talks with Venezuela to sell $4 billion worth of arms to them (hum, wonder what they need all that for?). The US is much weaker, just the way some in the US and many abroad want it.

Also, who benefits if Iran gets bombed or attacked? That Russian oil becomes much more valuable. Now ask yourself what is their motivation to help us? They are playing both sides (like they did to great effect in the cold war) to Russia's advantage, not the US, not the rest of the world. Apparently any fool except the one in the White house understands this.

Reply #7 Top

The START treaty, I'm sure will be triumphed as a wonderful thing (still plenty of nukes to vaporize the planet surface), but in reality probably sealed the fate of at least part of our ally Georgia.

...? Whot? How comes the START treaty sealed the fate of Georgia? The U.S. already proved to be innefectual in defending this ally, way before Obama got voted in.

Ahmadinejad just publicly insulted Obama, basically calling him wet behind the ears (never thought I'd be in agreement with anything he said until now) and dismissed him entirely.

Yhea. You are right. And he also said Israel should be nuked and has no right to be located in Jerusalem. That guy is always right when he speaks about his ennemies or tries to insult them! On the other hand, he had much respect for Bush, RIGHT?

Russia is in talks with Venezuela to sell $4 billion worth of arms to them (hum, wonder what they need all that for?).

Right. These talks are the continuation of the exact same talks that took place in 2008, remember? And Russia sent a few fighter jets and bomber on the place to wave the flag there. And they also struct a deal that year to supply Cuba with more military hardware.

The US is much weaker, just the way some in the US and many abroad want it.

It is weaker in only two metrics: infantry and economy. Your naval and aerial firepowers are intact, you can still rain fire on anyone that is openly hostile to you at your will. You still got ennough nuke to reduce the world to ashes. You haven't lost any allies.

Infantry and Economy aren't really Obama's fault.

Also, who benefits if Iran gets bombed or attacked? That Russian oil becomes much more valuable. Now ask yourself what is their motivation to help us? They are playing both sides (like they did to great effect in the cold war) to Russia's advantage, not the US, not the rest of the world. Apparently any fool except the one in the White house understands this.

Russia has every motivation to not help matters be solved with Iran, as they want to pressure you into getting out of what they see as their turf (East Europe, Caucase and Central Asia). They do this by applying pressure where they thing would distract you (Iran, Venezuela, Cuba, others?). Thu, they will stop any economic sanctions headed against Iran.

Since Iran is not selling any oil to the USA, and their main clients already bypass sanctions by either 100% violation or going through Dubai, I hardly see how unilateral economical sanctions from the US on Iran would do any harm to them. So if you want to hurt them, you NEED to get the major players (specially China and Russia) on your side, or make a deal with Iran (like proposed in another post on this very forum).

Finding a way to hurt the republican guard might be the compromise that Russia and China would be willing to accept, but I can't be sure. The final point is, what could Obama have done about Iran that would, in your opinion, make things better than they are? Unilateral sanctions? Military strike?

Reply #8 Top

Quoting Cikomyr, reply 5
The article up-here cites one good victory on Obama's part. The capture of the taliban leadership in Pakistan, and the start of actual standing up of the Pakistani military against the tribal regions housing the Talibans. These are still good and hard victory, both on the diplomatic and the military side.

And this differs from Bush how?  If anything, I would say that the capture was just luck (more thanks to the military) and Pakistan?  I will give you that although it could equally be argued that was a hold over from the Bush doctrine, not anything Obama did.  But the commonality of the 2 is not the reputation the clown who wrote the article was trying to portray.  Those actions are not a departure from the Bush doctrine, but a continuation of it.

He sent one of the most massive relief force to Haiti after the earthquake, doing more direct and immediate aid the U.S. ever did to another nation in a time of crisis.

That is genuinely false.  He did as much, but not "more" than other presidents, he did the same.

And as for the rest? It's too early to tell. But pray tell me what were any president's achievement in the first 15 months of office bigger than him. Usually, you can see within that first year the kind of presidency he'll try to achieve, and the tone he sets. Reagan hasn't done much in his 1st year, but that year still set the bases of his future actions.

My thoughts exactly.  I am not saying he is a total failure yet, he still has 2+ years to go.  However, I do not think he is worthy of a Nobel Prize (or any accolades) at this time.  You have to break some eggs to make an omelet.  He sure is good at breaking them, now we see if he can cook.

My opinion is he will fail.  But that is based upon his actions to date, not actual performance yet. 

 

Reply #9 Top

Ahmadinejad just publicly insulted Obama, basically calling him wet behind the ears (never thought I'd be in agreement with anything he said until now) and dismissed him entirely.

Yhea. You are right. And he also said Israel should be nuked and has no right to be located in Jerusalem. That guy is always right when he speaks about his ennemies or tries to insult them! On the other hand, he had much respect for Bush, RIGHT?

Let;'s see, Obama reached out to Amadenijad, Chavez and Putin (He may have reached out to Kim jong Il as well).  And what has he gotten?

Wet behind the ears, the smell of Sulfur, we reserve the right to unilaterally absolve the treaty, Hawaiian Forecast - Missiles.

So the difference?  Bush ignored them or stood up to them (not perfectly, but he did not bow to them either).  Obama kissed their arse and got the shaft in his donkey.

Infantry and Economy aren't really Obama's fault.

yes they are.  Infantry - just as the manager of a company sets the tone of the employment place, so Obama has set the tone for the US Military.

And you can blame bush only so long for the economy.  This one is Obama's.  Putting aside who got us in this mess, Obama has made damn sure he kept us in it.

 

Reply #10 Top

yes they are. Infantry - just as the manager of a company sets the tone of the employment place, so Obama has set the tone for the US Military.

And you can blame bush only so long for the economy.  This one is Obama's.  Putting aside who got us in this mess, Obama has made damn sure he kept us in it.

WHAT? Your infantry has been reported overextended ever since 2005, with ceiling-busting time served on the field compared to any other NATO country!

And you blame OBAMA for the economy? It's like saying the 2nd in command of the Titanic is to blame for the sinking because he replaced the captain after that last one hit the iceberg!

Reply #11 Top

WHAT? Your infantry has been reported overextended ever since 2005, with ceiling-busting time served on the field compared to any other NATO country!

My response to the highlighted part is so?  There are armies for show and armies that work.  Not saying which is which, nor am I saying that the US military is on a vacation.  But I think you answered your own question with your original statement.

Marines to Haiti.

And you blame OBAMA for the economy? It's like saying the 2nd in command of the Titanic is to blame for the sinking because he replaced the captain after that last one hit the iceberg!

Please re-read my response:

This one is Obama's. Putting aside who got us in this mess, Obama has made damn sure he kept us in it.

I did not blame him for digging the hole (note I said put that aside), just for keeping us IN IT.  Obama has never played second fiddle to anyone in his life.

Reply #12 Top

How comes the START treaty sealed the fate of Georgia?

They can forget about anyone supporting their claim to return their territory, and they can forget about being admitted into NATO. The US did not have a military alliance with Georgia, nice try though. Do you think Russia would have invaded a NATO country?

Yhea. You are right. And he also said Israel should be nuked and has no right to be located in Jerusalem. That guy is always right when he speaks about his ennemies or tries to insult them! On the other hand, he had much respect for Bush, RIGHT?

So the man got one out of two right (so far). No he didn't like Bush, but he was afraid of him... enough to stop his nuke weapons program in 2003, until the rest of the liberal world and liberal US congress had him pinned down. Remember the lefty wolf dry about the US invading Iran? When the majority Democrats in congress seek US surrender in Iraq and threaten not to financially support the troops on the battlefield, I guess one can stick their tongue out all they want. 

Right. These talks are the continuation of the exact same talks that took place in 2008, remember?

You get a cookie! I thought the great hope for the world Obama was going to spread his happy happy joy joy feelings and everyone would love him? No need for more weapons now, right?

It is weaker in only two metrics: infantry and economy.

War losses for Iraq have already been replaced, in fact troop levels have increased across all branches.

Reply #13 Top

And you blame OBAMA for the economy? It's like saying the 2nd in command of the Titanic is to blame for the sinking because he replaced the captain after that last one hit the iceberg!

LOL you do if "the second in command" launches the lifeboats half empty with only women, children, Unions, SEIU, and leaders hostile to the US in them, hell with the rest.

Reply #14 Top

They can forget about anyone supporting their claim to return their territory, and they can forget about being admitted into NATO. The US did not have a military alliance with Georgia, nice try though

Nice try to you. You completely skipped over the mention that the USA already proved to be innefectual about their defense of Georgia when Russia invaded in 2008.

If the USA really wanted to back up Georgia, they would do so regardless of the new START treaty. The amount of nuclear weapon in your arsenal has NO FUCKING EFFECT on the geopolitical alliances you make, either by quality or quantity. You still have ennough to bomb Russia to smithereen if needs be. You just can dig 3 km less deep.

Do you think Russia would have invaded a NATO country?

No, they wouldn't. But then again, Russia would have never allowed NATO membership to a country as strategically important as Georgia. Nor NATO would have committed themseves to a nation as risky as Georgia.

Nothing of all this is related to the START treaty.

enough to stop his nuke weapons program in 2003, until the rest of the liberal world and liberal US congress had him pinned down

So NOW you change your tune. Convenient, eh? People on this very blog were hardened believer that Iran never ever stopped building up nukes, researching them. Funny how you change your interpretation of what happened if it fits your political ideology.

You get a cookie! I thought the great hope for the world Obama was going to spread his happy happy joy joy feelings and everyone would love him? No need for more weapons now, right?

And you get a turd! Just because you have ennemies who want you to stop playing in your turf doesn't mean these ennemy will accept such situation. And Obama has been even more aggressive against Russia than Bush was. Why do you think this week's ceremony was done in Prague?

War losses for Iraq have already been replaced, in fact troop levels have increased across all branches

Your infantry isn't weak in numeral, it's weak in overextension. You used them a lot in the past years. I remember reading an article in The Economist (2006) about the % of time spent on the field. The U.K.'s average service time ratio was 20%, and the brass commented that it was the maximum that they would allow. The U.S.'s average service time ratio was 55%.

As courageous and trained your infantry is, the U.S. cannot keep mobilising them as such a high ratio for long. If memory serves, that kind of high-exposure to combat is also a receipe for PTSD, which could field a lot of psychological trouble for your servicemen. I really hope your healthcare system can provide psychologically for these soldiers.

Reply #15 Top

 

The article up-here cites one good victory on Obama's part. The capture of the taliban leadership in Pakistan, and the start of actual standing up of the Pakistani military against the tribal regions housing the Talibans. These are still good and hard victory, both on the diplomatic and the military side.

Wait a minute! You seem to have missed the last eight or nine years of history. Pakistan helped create the Taliban after the attacks on 9/11 we asked Pakistan to stand with us against them. A lot of diplomatic effort was used to get them to reverse their national policy to join us. The left made it easier for the people supporting the Taliban to oust the President allowing the Taliban to not just survive but threaten the current political leadership of Pakistan If we lose Pakistan we have a host of problems starting with the Taliban gaining access to Pakistan’s nuclear weapons. Now after the left of the world screwed that alliance to make Mr. Bush look bad, all of a sudden you see a great victory for Mr. Obama. All he did was accomplish what Mr. Bush did a week after 9/11 only it took President Obama over a year to do. This is not a victory it is going back to what President Bush accomplished only it took more time and the deaths of thousands of people to undo the damage of the left.

 According to the Vice-President, the greatest accomplishment of the Obama administration is getting the troops out if Iraq. (following the timetable set by President Bush) I have yet to see an accomplishment of this administration. Either they ride on the coat tails of the Bush Administration or they screw things up. Please name something this administration has accomplished that was good, okay fair, let me make it easier. Not bad.

Reply #16 Top

Wait a minute! You seem to have missed the last eight or nine years of history. Pakistan helped create the Taliban after the attacks on 9/11 we asked Pakistan to stand with us against them. A lot of diplomatic effort was used to get them to reverse their national policy to join us. The left made it easier for the people supporting the Taliban to oust the President allowing the Taliban to not just survive but threaten the current political leadership of Pakistan If we lose Pakistan we have a host of problems starting with the Taliban gaining access to Pakistan’s nuclear weapons. Now after the left of the world screwed that alliance to make Mr. Bush look bad, all of a sudden you see a great victory for Mr. Obama. All he did was accomplish what Mr. Bush did a week after 9/11 only it took President Obama over a year to do. This is not a victory it is going back to what President Bush accomplished only it took more time and the deaths of thousands of people to undo the damage of the left.

Gee, "The Left" sure seems like a big, influencial, united society that is hell-bent on making the world go square, eh?

"The Left" made is easier for the people supporting taliban to oust the president? You talking about the civilian resistance that managed to get him out in 2008?

You are right. "The Left" totally screwed up the war in Afghanistan from Day 1. If Day 1 was in 2008.

Taliban to not just survive but threaten the current political leadership of Pakistan If we lose Pakistan we have a host of problems starting with the Taliban gaining access to Pakistan’s nuclear weapons.

I agree with your assessment of the danger represented by the Talibans in Pakistan. But then again, I don't see how that is "The Left's Fault". Talibans have been a very disruptive force for the Pakistani leadership since 2002 in the northen regions, and have been quite antagonist for years. However, only recently did the U.S. accepted Pakistani's plea to use U.S. air firepower to fight these on Pakistani ground. To give a positive response, the Pakistani cracked down on their intelligence organisation and have been able to use them effectively against the Talibans.

Technically, Pakistan is, right now, in better shape than a year ago, stability and military-wise.

Now after the left of the world screwed that alliance to make Mr. Bush look bad, all of a sudden you see a great victory for Mr. Obama. All he did was accomplish what Mr. Bush did a week after 9/11 only it took President Obama over a year to do.

What Bush did was attacking a target plain in sight, that was openly ruling Afghanistan, and then screwing up the after-war process.

What Obama did was finding a way to dig out Taliban leadership that has been on the run for about 8 years, by having the actual cooperation of the Pakistani intelligence agencies.

Reply #17 Top

Humm, let see I said this:

The US did not have a military alliance with Georgia

Then you said this:

Nice try to you. You completely skipped over the mention that the USA already proved to be innefectual about their defense of Georgia when Russia invaded in 2008.

Does someone have a reading comprehension problem? Let me know if you need help with the statement "did not". ;)

Russia would have never allowed NATO membership to a country as strategically important as Georgia.

My bad, sorry I didn't know Russia was a voting member of NATO.

Nothing of all this is related to the START treaty.

Obama to Russia, "I'm a weakling". Sounds relevant to me.

So NOW you change your tune. Convenient, eh? People on this very blog were hardened believer that Iran never ever stopped building up nukes, researching them. Funny how you change your interpretation of what happened if it fits your political ideology.

So now my words are "People on this very blog"? Stop is a strong word, postpone or move deeper would be better. At any rate, the Iranians were pissing their pants, if just for awhile. Of course feel free to post my quote stating your "fact".

And you get a turd! Just because you have ennemies who want you to stop playing in your turf doesn't mean these ennemy will accept such situation. And Obama has been even more aggressive against Russia than Bush was. Why do you think this week's ceremony was done in Prague?

There's that Canadian liberal charm, that pops up from time to time.

Obama aggressive with Russia? Yeah they are shaking in their boots over helping Obama with meaningful sanctions with Iran. It scared them to death when Obama canceled the missile shield.

Prague...yes let's talk about Prauge. You are correct there was a ceremony. Bravo! You know where else there was a ceremony? Munich 1938. But you're too blinded to take my word, how about the word of the Czechs and Pole's? http://www.pri.org/world/overseas-reaction-us-missile-defense1618.html?print

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2010-04-05-Prague_N.htm

Your infantry isn't weak in numeral, it's weak in overextension.

Spoken exactly like someone that has never served, so not unexpected. FYI even in the combat zones the troops are not exposed to continuous fighting, not even close to Vietnam standards, and even farther from WWII standards. Now you might consider yourself "overextended" if you don't get to see your family for 12-18 months. The rush of people joining the military must not be having a problem with it. I heard that word used before by the people afraid to do anything to stop Iranian ambitions, as an excuse. Your usage conjures up that same connotations.

If memory serves, that kind of high-exposure to combat is also a receipe for PTSD, which could field a lot of psychological trouble for your servicemen. I really hope your healthcare system can provide psychologically for these soldiers.

Wow, a good portion of the country should have been basket cases after WWII, using that logic. Maybe you are speaking from a Canadian prospective since they were in WWII longer, give them my sympathy. Or maybe your generation is weak and can't take anything more stressful than a video game? Not everyone is you.

Reply #18 Top

Shouldn't the title of this article be " Why I love to slobber over the Obama Doctrine"? Because you sure aren't taking a subjective, let alone critical look at his policies. Is it hard to see out your cars rear window through all the Obama stickers?  

Reply #19 Top

Quoting Nitro, reply 18
Shouldn't the title of this article be " Why I love to slobber over the Obama Doctrine"? Because you sure aren't taking a subjective, let alone critical look at his policies. Is it hard to see out your cars rear window through all the Obama stickers?  

Cikomyr was just quoting an article.  I think the author of the article is engaged in wishful thinking and image building.  But I do not think Cikomyr buys the whole pig here.

Reply #20 Top

But I do not think Cikomyr buys the whole pig here.

Sure sounds like it in his defense of everything "Obama". His first comment made it plain there would be no scrutiny and and criticism is anti-Obama rhetoric.