So I got Chirmaya's overlay...

mard's hammer on AA reg can easily be win.

Also, the point has been made more than once that choosing plenor or vlem is a matter of opinion and both work fine depending on your playstyle.  Since you clearly don't know this and obv favor vlem due to theorycrafting that it's superior in the long run I'll sum up the opinions on why to choose plenor:

• It provides more base mana.  Some people don't spend all day in the field to let vlemish recharge; instead they would rather save their mana and then blow a big load in a fight -- run back to base.
• Assuming you're only getting one crown, which a lot of the people who only get plenor do.. you get the higher base + the increased effect from someone else's vlemish
• it's 250g cheaper.

It is mostly the first bullet that most people choose plenor (assuming they're not noobs.. who knows why they make the choices they do?).  I'd dig up the thread to link... but goood players have sworn by using plenor as a solo helm simply because it fits their playstyle better.  Vlem is superior only if you stay out in the field a long time..

Clearly don't know this? I know my game fine thank you. This is not theorycrafting, this is common sense.

1. its 500 base mana, vlemish gives you around 12 mps more. 500/12 = 41 secs. fourtyone seconds? Are you seriously claiming that someone is gonna take plenor because it gives you more mana the first 41 secs? 41 secs is not a long time, 41 secs is a round trip to base, that 2 waves. Note also that vlemish stack with%mana bonusses of queen and TB.

2. Someone elses? Oh cmon, its fucking 4 mana a sec and its dependent on a teammate. 

3. Fair point, but I would rather save my gold than buying a rather useless item. Look at scaled: 4 mps, 500 mana. Plenor gives something similar and has an extra 1k mana, but costs some 950 gold more.

@lifekatana

1. you are right. Plenor is NOT worth buying instead of Vlemish.

Also, if you look at Vlemish's stats, you will see that it gives 11 mps + 4 mps Aura = 15 mps to the user. So, 500/15 = 33 secs. 33 seconds to restore the missing 500 mana.

2. again you are right, the 4 mps Aura is somewhat deceptive. So what if you receive the benefit of 4 mps from someone else? thats too small of an mps increase.

3. 250 gold is the amount of a tp, thats like nothing.

Well, that's bad calculations too. It's not as if Plenor gives you no mana either. A level 5 TB with
scaled helm will already be generating 10 Mana per second. So Plenor will give 7 mana per second. Now if we imagine someone else on the team already has Vlemish, and is nearby (and if you play as a team, he should be)

In this case, Plenor will give 70% of (10+4) = 10 mana per second.

Vlemish however, will only add 11 mana per second.

Under these conditions, it will take you a full 500 seconds to get the lost mana back.

That's not an impossible situation.

...

But my personal tastes is still Vlemish Then Plenor. Then replace both with Hungarling.

I was with you right until you said, "dodge amulet."  I assume you meant the Pendant of Grace, which is actually a fine favor item if you're playing a dodge build.  There's a solid LE build that relies on that favor item.

Bmans and Chirms mods are great though, couldn't live without em.

To return to the subject at hand, then yes, yes they are. Very awesome.

Yeah...you are talking about a very particular situation. These are a lot of "ifs". IF you have tb, and IF someone has Vlemish, and IF he is near you, and IF you get scaled helm.

In general, Vlemish is better than Plenor, but sometimes Plenor is a little better.

41 seconds is enough time to use most abilities 4-6 times... if i win in the first 41 sec (which i will in 1v1 lane battles cause they don't last that long) then i control the lane and get the creeps maybe even taking down the tower...

Plenor can actually be better if you have a Oculus in your team

Or if you play on a map with default +15mana/seconds from start.

I usualy get both anyway.

where can i get his overlay?

It's also map dependant. Leviathan has flags that give you +15 mana per second. You an idiot if you buy Vlemish on that map instead of Plenor.

In most other cases it's debateable which choice is better. I'd often rather have an extra 500 mana with less regen and save the couple hundred gold. For example any time I take Blade of the Serpent. Or on any demigod where I use up a lot of mana in a short period.

It's actually much easier to make a case for Plenor Battlcrown than it is for Vlemish.

Vlenish gives 22.5 MPS to a TB. >10 MPS

If you have BotS why are you getting a helm?

I agree that even so called good players have no clue on items.

Last game I played a 4v4, none of my teammates took BotF. And I had Oak, Rook and Ereb on my team. The rook took Anklet and Boots of speed in the beginning ^^

Yes I know the dodge amulet can be used in a particular erebus build(I played it enough) but imho especially with the dodge cap its not that usefull. You better get health, since armor evasion and health stack kind of cummutaivly(that hard word=)) and evasion isn't that hard to come by lategame.

For all these Plenor lovers: I'd be happy to show you wrong in Pacov's tournament.

P.S. Yes off course this is cataract. On levthian this would be the correct choice.

where can i DL the ooooooverlay

I never stated I was a Plenor lover.  I will generally either play with 2 helms or none.  However, you clearly DONT know this... regardless of whether you know "your" game or not.

Yes, I am fcking serious.  With the extra mana you can do more attacks.  If you can blow all of your mana in one fight to get a kill that you otherwise couldnt without the extra mana from plenor.. what good would vlemish have been to you?  Oh, you can wait FOR FUCKING EVER for it to regen all the way back up to FULL (not just the extra 500) after a heavy battle, or just go back to base.  Most of the time after a serious battle most people run back to base anyway.. they're oom, super low on health, and need another sigil / tele / caplock / gear / cit upgrade.

Your strategy clearly isn't to save your mana and blow it all in one load to get a kill and expect to run back to base anyway.  You must like to occasionally use your abilities but don't have to use several attacks in one battle.

Yes.. vlemish returns more in the long run.  But plenor provides more in the short run.  You eliminate vlem's effectiveness if you run back to base when you are oom.  Plenor you were already counting on that.  I hope you aren't one of those people who run back to base when you're oom and still claim vlem is better.

You pretend it's some enourmous pool of mana, its not. 500 mana is not even one spit(since I know you'

re quite the UBlover).

I understand your strategy, and coming from an UB player I am not surprised. I've seen this a lot from UB's and its not i But in my humble opinion it is not a very good strat in general (and for all chars save UB) and dare I say a hallmark of bad players. Running back and forth counting on being able to score a kill in one burst will seriously impend your ability to farm and push your lane. Running back every min is just a waste of experience imho and since vlemisch gives all that mana back in 41 secs the guy that stays in his lane will rack up more gold and more experience and in the long run will beat the plenorplayer.

In my opinion, your strategy of a "decisive battle"is foolish and shortsighted. In the time your enemy is running back to base to get more mana you should be downing towers. Indeed running back to base when your oom, is in most cases a bad choice, since you leave your lane undefended.

P.S. It's on the modding forums, username Chirmaya. 

. . .

what part of "I either play with 2 helms or none" do you understand? If he's playing Oak (his actual best character... but hwatever) he gets Vlemish + Plenor at the exact same time.

Now, I do agree that Plenor is inferior to Vlemish is just about every way. The only time it is strictly superior is if you happen to have BotS but if you have BotS you reallyyyy shouldn't be buying a mana helm anyway.

Anyway, it is possible that 500 mana is enough for the kill just uncommon, I guess

Chirmaya's Rollover:

http://forums.demigodthegame.com/369526

Bman's Teampanel:

http://forums.demigodthegame.com/369937

I do too. But he was defending a single plenor as a viable item which it is under normal circumstances certainly not.

P.S. Besides Oak is a tier I char too.  

P.S. Besides Oak is a tier I char too.    

so if 500 mana is nothing.. why even get helms?  If 500 mana is nothing.. then so is 1000 mana.. it's just double nothing.  So is 5000 mana, it's just 10 x nothing.  

It IS enough for one spit.  You clearly don't understand there is a cd on spit.  Since you picked beast as an example.. (which is what people who vouch for plenor usually are.. or else tb's), spit is 7 second cd, and you won't run oom after 2 spits and a 2 grasps with just a plenor.  So... that gives enough time to regen the mana just enough to add 1 more spit and completely oom yourself.  And that 1 spit can make all the difference.

The guy with vlemish can't stay in his lane.  If he fights you, he will lose.  He doesn't have the mana for that last spit.  So, either he sits behind the tower and lets you keep the flag, or he fights you and dies or has to run back to base.  You run back to base after the heavy fight and still have the flag the whole time.  Looks like you're still ahead.

I understand that you DONT play this strat.  I don't play this strat either.  I prefer to stay out as long as possible usually.  Can you at least see that it's viable?  

K.. dug up the post for you.  It IS a beast.. guy who sat #1 on broken ladders for a long time.. but played with some of the best.  Posidenii and Orcun_BL played with him often and his strat worked with them.  Not gonna bother arguing anymore over something pointless... it's clear that you are entirely too stubborn to accept anything other than your own opinions.

http://forums.demigodthegame.com/364290/page/1/#replies

Nothing is a figure of speech, cmon I know you knew it and you knew I knew that too so lets not pretend.  Why would you want to play TB with plenor:o? He has high base mana regen sure, but he also has a %mps from form switchin and I would think vlemisch is even more effiecent. 
A level 2 spit maybe(Or maybe not, I think you only can get a levvel 1 spit off)


Yes wipuliwo, not only does this guy have a speech impediment I also very much question if his build actually took him to the top and not a combination of teammates being premade and playing noobs in the early months of demigod.For instance, he takes foul grassp II and III which most players will assure you are a waste of mana.




P.S. Seriously, why are you making it so hard for us non-native speakers?

you have absolutely no idea how to spell the name of the item your whinging about. how fail.

People with bad english skills should not criticize others about their spelling, especially when it's an made-up word in a video game. Also, it's only the addition of a letter, not a total bastardization of the word.

I don't whine about Vlemisch. I am a non-native speaker. Typing fast also typically results in garbled up words.