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Elemental: Christmas time Status Report

Elemental: Christmas time Status Report

PAXDEMO(8)

Greetings!

As we reach the end of the year, we can take stock of where we are and where we’re going next.

…our story so far…

About 3 months ago, we released the first “beta” of Elemental. Designed to let players help us mold the game mechanics, the beta has been going very well so far.

Through beta feedback, the economic system for the game has been changed a great deal, streamline and generally put into place something that will be fun, deep but should also keep players from getting bogged down.

Also thanks to beta feedback, we came up with a different technology system that is, ironically, quite similar to what was in Master of Orion 1. This is an area that is proving a wealth of future fun for us as we prepare to create different technology pools for the different factions.

In addition, again thanks to the beta players, the diplomacy system has been heavily modified.  We just released a beta update that includes the basic diplomacy skeleton. There’s litlte content but it allows us to greatly expand up on it over the coming months.

…lessons and trends…

If I were pressed to list what the biggest trend in the beta feedback has been so far it is this: Make sure the game has a soul. 

Nearly all of our changes in Elemental thus far have been to increase the opportunity to inject story and life into the game play. 

…The remainder of beta 1…

So Beta 1 will have at least 3 more updates which will take us well into February.  The good news is that people who pre-order the beta and are currently waiting for Beta 2 will likely get one of the updates because the Impulse team wants to test out the “pre-load” features of Impulse and we lobbied for Elemental to be the test case so we could let some of the people who have been waiting in.

Now, as a reminder, Beta 1 isn’t fun “to play”. It’s less a “game” than it is a public game proto-type.

The screenshot you see above of the beta engine isn’t even in the game yet because we don’t want the game to have to rely on being pretty to be fun.

What’s coming up next are the quests, the magic system, and the dynasty system.  We’re talking to players right now about specific quests they’d like to see.  We’ll have lots of journals on that.

The Magic system should be very fun to work through.  Though, the tactical battles are where I imagine magic duels being the funnest.  Still, being able to morph the land and change it Populous-style should add a layer of strategic depth that will be very fun.

The dynasty system is something we’re all very excited to play around with. I suspect it’ll go through a lot of iterations through the beta as we discover ways to make having characters in the game more fun.

Beta 2…

This Winter we’ll have Beta 2 which is the multiplayer beta.  Most people will never play multiplayer but we have ulterior motives for having multiplayer – I want to learn how to get good at the game online so that I can incorporate strategies into the single-player AI.

There will be special modes for multiplayer developed (you’ll be able to play them single player) so that there are ways to play Elemental in 30 minutes all the way to 30 weeks depending on the game mode.  But we’ll talk more about that as we get closer.

During Beta 2, the beta team will decide if the game is “fun enough” to move to Beta 3.

Beta 2 will probably last about 2 months. But it may be less or it may be more depending on whether there’s a consensus on the game’s quality at this point.

..Beta 3…

It’ll be in Beta 3 that players will really start to see what Elemental is about.  The way we think of it is that Elemental is a strategy game that exists within a giant role playing game world. 

Beta 3 will be pretty short (i.e. about 1 month).

…Beta 4…

That’s when we start to get into the tactical battles. This will be a major part of the game (And yet totally skippable with auto-resolve for players who aren’t into it).

This beta will still be fairly short though since it’s really all about the tactical battles.  Probably about 6 weeks.

…Beta 5…

This will be the polish beta and ironically, this will be the first beta that would be considered a “true” beta. The previous betas could have been considered alpha builds because it’s only in Beta 5 that the game is “feature complete”.  Beta 5 will start getting people into modding the game and getitng us to expose more and more of the engine.

I don’t know how long Beta 5 will take. Probably a solid month.

…other notes from the field…

As some of you are aware, we are hoping to do a 64-bit version of Elemental.  The main hold up is Intel’s Havok as we are using it for the animation (we don’t use the physics in it).  Intel has just released a 64-bit version of Havok so we have to see what is involved in getting it. We’ll let you know how that goes.

We will probably make some of the editor features available to beta testers before Beta 1 is over. At least the map maker. If not it’ll be during beta 2.

Like every Stardock developed game, Elemental’s multiplayer will be client/server.  And in fact, our plan is to set up servers across the world that people can join.

However, we also plan to make it so that people can set up their own servers with their own mods, rules, and such for their friends to play or for others to join.  We did this with Stellar Frontier years ago and it worked out fantastically. People would make their own modded star systems with their own races and ships and planets.  Plus, it lets someone set up a LAN game for their friends.

image
Stellar Frontier allowed users to set up their own servers and mods. This screenshot was the Master of Orion 2 mod for Stellar Frontier. A user could create their own star system and others could join in and play with their mods. This is similar with what we’re going with in Elemental except people would set up their own worlds. 

This upcoming year is going to be really exciting!

Merry Christmas and Happy New Years!

89,825 views 37 replies
Reply #26 Top

Quoting Tormy-, reply 22

Quoting Luckmann, reply 9
Quoting Tormy-,
reply 6
Why do you think so? Because multiplayer simply isn't big in this genre.
I don't agree....just take a look at Dominions 3...on the other hand it was designed to be a PBEM MP game mainly...so who knows. Either way I had lot of online matches with AoW 2. - SM as well.

Only multiplayer I will be doing is PBEM (which I hope will be 'in')

 

Reply #27 Top

The Magic system should be very fun to work through. Though, the tactical battles are where I imagine magic duels being the funnest. Still, being able to morph the land and change it Populous-style should add a layer of strategic depth that will be very fun.

I hope we can persuade y'all to try for 'balance' here. Tactical magic is fun and all, but what made MoM so great for me were all the amazing overland spells. You didn't get (need) to cast them nearly as often, but when you did, the results were massive fun for RPG types and could also really make major changes in your strategic situation. Mucking with the land was the least of it for me when compared to things like Wind Mastery, Great Unsummoning, and Charm of Life.

Alright, I did go on the occasional volcano-raising binge...

Reply #28 Top

Great going, Brad and the rest of the development team. I pre-ordered the game and I am not at all unhappy that the game will come out much much later than February. Unfortunately, I have not been able to participate in the beta (it is NOT FUN, no kidding), but I trust the community and Stardock will come out with one of the best games of all time, without requiring a behemoth of a system.

Quoting kyogre12, reply 24

Quoting astrath, reply 23The point is that despite Demigod being a MP-orientated game, less than half (can't remember exactly how many) of players have EVER played online.  For a game like Elemental it wouuld be even lower.

The number is 23%

And that number is just the people who have ever even TRIED to connect, and I daresay the number who have played even one full game cannot be more than 80% of this number.

Reply #29 Top

We will probably make some of the editor features available to beta testers before Beta 1 is over. At least the map maker. If not it’ll be during beta 2.

THIS is pure win. Right from the start we will be able to mod some things, and send feedback to devs (regarding the tools).

(...)This is an area that is proving a wealth of future fun for us as we prepare to create different technology pools for the different factions.

I assume it will be divided among Kingdom & Empire? If I might suggest something, I would like to shamelessly steal an idea from Sword Of The Stars. Let's say we have two independent (or at least decently diversified) tech trees - for Kingdom & Empire factions. In order not to make factions that only differ in some meaningless bonuses (+10% to trade income, +5% to prestige, etc.) we implement randomized techs. I know we already have a random system implemented, but I am thinking of extending it. As it is now, the higher the tech is, the harder is for a player to develop it (i.e., to have it show up in the research window). The problem is, that the 'rarity' of a tech for all factions is the same. Then, let's change it, so - for instance - Kingdom X will have easier access to ballistas, while Kingdom Y will have better chance to obtain particular mining tech faster. This way, without revamping the tree, we can easily make the factions more diversified.

Reply #30 Top

happy christmas  time!

 

Beta 1 until Febuary eh?   More polish is certainly better than less.

Reply #31 Top

Also thanks to beta feedback, we came up with a different technology system that is, ironically, quite similar to what was in Master of Orion 1. This is an area that is proving a wealth of future fun for us as we prepare to create different technology pools for the different factions.

Ok you have me. The quote above is enough for me to pre-order.

MOO1 was truly a wonderful game. You could adjust points spent in research on one or more items. I think a total of 6 (or 8) categories with one or more techs available in each at a time. Allocating research points to different tech categories allowed flexibility to adapt to threats. I recall dumping everything available into a single tech on many occasions to repond to an enemy fleet decimating my planets.

Think of research as technology programs. Funding can go up and down until the research is complete. Funding can be split between several programs one turn only to be put on hold entirely the next turn in favor of a single program, all without losing research from on hold programs.

 

Reply #32 Top

I'm not involved in the beta, though I may break down at some point and pre-purchase.  :)  I just wanted to say I'm really looking forward to the finished product, and I think this is a pretty innovative method, essentially enabling fans to help shape the game and ensure its quality.  After playing Stardock's previous games, I had a lot of faith that this was going to be something special, but seeing how players have added their input, I just don't see how this can fail to be kind of earth-shattering.

I think it'll meet with the same kind of critical approval as GalCiv II (which is saying a lot!).

Reply #33 Top

Quoting Grogtank, reply 31

Also thanks to beta feedback, we came up with a different technology system that is, ironically, quite similar to what was in Master of Orion 1. This is an area that is proving a wealth of future fun for us as we prepare to create different technology pools for the different factions.
Ok you have me. The quote above is enough for me to pre-order.

MOO1 was truly a wonderful game. You could adjust points spent in research on one or more items. I think a total of 6 (or 8) categories with one or more techs available in each at a time. Allocating research points to different tech categories allowed flexibility to adapt to threats. I recall dumping everything available into a single tech on many occasions to repond to an enemy fleet decimating my planets.

Think of research as technology programs. Funding can go up and down until the research is complete. Funding can be split between several programs one turn only to be put on hold entirely the next turn in favor of a single program, all without losing research from on hold programs.

 

Research is not really like that.

You give a path to your researchers : Civilization, Magic, Warfare, Exploration and Diplomacy. When you have enough points, you make a breakthrough and you choose betwween several techs. Some techs are harder to get, and you'll need several breakthrough before they appear on your list.

 

You can't research in several areas at once. You can't earn several techs at once.

Reply #34 Top

I'm pretty excited about this game. Especially the focus on the AI aspect. Also I love the combotnation of the fantasy and strategy genres. I'll definitely pre-order and get into the beta once Brad says the game is actually a bit "fun". ;)

Reply #35 Top

Research is not really like that.

You give a path to your researchers : Civilization, Magic, Warfare, Exploration and Diplomacy. When you have enough points, you make a breakthrough and you choose betwween several techs. Some techs are harder to get, and you'll need several breakthrough before they appear on your list.

You can't research in several areas at once. You can't earn several techs at once.

Research should not be secondary or distant from the strategic and tactical game. Never should it be something that happens in the background simply because you need to keep up on techs. If the time between breakthrough/completion and implementation is too long the two (or more) game elements become disjointed. Simply put, you would not be able to rush a research project to counter a threat. Research needs to be integral at all stages and always a strategic and tactical consideration. It needs to flow with the pace of the Strategic and Tactical layer.

Reply #36 Top

Grogtank .. what is your point ? I don't understand what you would want about the research mechanism. I was just saying that the research system - for now - isn't like MoO1. The only ressemblance is the fact you can choose a "path" and not a tech to research.

Now, I must say that it's fun to play with it (played a dozen games since the 0.262) ... but ... it still lacks something that would make it really different. It's still "techs".

Reply #37 Top

I used to think that no fantasy strategy game had ever been so close to perfection as Master of Magic had (some interesting attempts such as Age of Wonders though), but now, with all that I've read and seen about your game so far, I think it may make me change my mind xD 

Not only does it get inspiration from the best, but also your beta system, to keep close to players expectations, is just an awesome idea. Christmas took all my money, but as soon as I have some again, I'll sure pre-order!

Happy new year, I wish you a lot of success.

 

PS I love that kind of game in LAN multiplayer with friends, I'm looking forward to the multiplayer features :D