Reviving the resource discussion

from Elemental Forums

I'm just going to lay out how I would like resources to work. Actually I would like a lot more complexity than what I am about to post, but this is an attempt at striking a balance with those that fear micro-management.

1st, I don't think a resource need be inside a city's "build area" to be used. I am not sure if that is currently how it works or not. You should be able to build a mine on an iron resource even if it is far from any city of yours.

2nd. I would like resources to be measured in discreet amounts. So your iron mine creates 5 iron/turn. Here comes one of my concessions to simplicity - rather than caravans to distribute stuff around, it just goes into a empire wide stockpile that is available to any building in any city regardless of connection by road. Defending the resource itself is what maintains the steady flow into your stockpile.

3rd. There should be common resources that are sprinkled around the map thickly enough that everyone should have access to these. And these should be the resources needed for making standard units and building standard buildings. There should only be a few of these.

4th. There should be uncommon resources that every player will not get every resource. In fact, it would be unlikely for ANY player to have every one of these, even if he had a huge kingdom. There should be a good number of these, and which ones you get will determine the special abilities of your armies. I would put the honey and the koidal leaves in this category.

5th. There should be rare resources that are also extremely powerful. These will likely only be used to equip heroes or possibly your very elite troops. There should be a lot of different ones of these as well.

6th: Everything you harvest goes into an empire wide stockpile. Everything you make goes into an empire wide stockpile. And when you create a unit it subtracts from what you have in the stockpile. Also anything in your stockpile is available for trade in diplomacy. Anything you purchase through trade negotiations also goes into the stockpile.

7th: You cannot create anything that you do not hold the necessary resource to produce. Period. (I am speaking of items not units.)

8th When creating units you can set the default of what to do if something required is not in inventory. Options might be to hold production until the needed item is there, use a substitute, or make the unit sans the missing item(s)

This I realize would require some decently large changes at this point. And some of these might already be considered non-negotiable. However, I did feel like one of the reasons for the long beta cycle was to address some pretty major changes early on if necessary. This takes caravans out of the game completely. I liked caravans. The trade off is instead of guarding a caravan route you guard a mine or a lumber mill.

I think that this is complex enough and real enough to satisfy those who want something a bit more meaty, but is not overwhelming for someone who does not want to micro manage.

I realize this will make some of the common materials probably over abundant by mid to late game. I think that is a POSITIVE - let the market be awash in the common goods. It just means that early game there will be motivation not only to produce foryourself but also to put stuff on the market while it is still worth something. Later in the game the focus will be on maximizing and or trading for uncommon or rare materials which is, I think, a GREAT thing.

I realize the economy is not a central theme to this game, I just think getting this right is going to make the difference between a good and great game. I also realize that I am making these suggestions with very sketchy information on the overall game.

9,098 views 6 replies
Reply #1 from Elemental Forums Top

Oh and I would like a resource page where I can see every single resource that I own (other than what is equipped on a unit)

So all the ore, lumber and crystals but also all the swords, breastplates, bows and arrows. Even unique items, I would like (for simplicity) to just drag an item from my stockpile and drop it on my hero and wham! bam! thank you ma'am it's done.

Reply #2 from Elemental Forums Top

I very much like this proposed system, with two corollaries.

First, caravans should be an option you can turn on if you prefer lots of micromanagement.

Second, the resource pools discussed should be tradeable with other empires.

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Reply #4 from Elemental Forums Top

Only quoting those fragments that I don't agree with/have some minor comments on.


1st, I don't think a resource need be inside a city's "build area" to be used. I am not sure if that is currently how it works or not. You should be able to build a mine on an iron resource even if it is far from any city of yours.

It could work, but: it had to be in your influence zone AND you would have to provide a caravan to move the materials from the post. This way you have to be somewhat close to the mine, and you would have to provide support for mineral line.


3rd. There should be common resources that are sprinkled around the map thickly enough that everyone should have access to these. And these should be the resources needed for making standard units and building standard buildings. There should only be a few of these.

I think that it should be done a little differently. Let's say that every empire/kingdom has access to some basic materials. The more cities they have, the bigger the inflow should be. Let's say such minerals like copper and iron are so popular that every city has access to them (due to trade with minor merchants, or some inferior mines). Such basic inflow would allow you to build a fixed amount of armed soldiers. However, if you would like to build an army you would have to have access to RESOURCE called iron & copper. On the top of that in case of some higher level troops, let's say that apart from high-end materials like demon's blood (:P), you would have to provide your units still with steel so that they can enchant their weapons with blood.

6th: Everything you harvest goes into an empire wide stockpile. Everything you make goes into an empire wide stockpile. And when you create a unit it subtracts from what you have in the stockpile. Also anything in your stockpile is available for trade in diplomacy. Anything you purchase through trade negotiations also goes into the stockpile.

Here is a big no. I understand that creating such system would make it easy to handle resources, but it would take away an important aspect of the game - resource defending. First, let's say that in one city you mine mithrill, in other - smith, and the last one has a good 'amount' of soldiers. Now, you have to transport the mithrill to the city with a smith, and later (as a weapon) to recruits. This of course adds a lot of micro to the game, but makes the caravans, caravan protection, fight for supplies and specialized cities more relevant. Of course caravan system should be very painless and in such system you should be able to easily select where to send particular resource (let's assume you can't move recruits as you have to provide them the training grounds, but what if another city doesn't have enough recruits, but have barrack? :)) and manage resource chains. This adds so much depth to the typical resource-in-one-city-bonus-for-every-city - raiding caravans, caravans protection, cities specialization. One more note: caravans should be relatively fast, so that you don't have to wait ages. Never the less, it would still take a 2/3 turns for a caravan to travel to another city (rather close by).

Reply #5 from Elemental Forums Top

Agreed. 100% Wholeheartedly Agreed. The more Micromanagement the better IMO. I'm terrified people will bitch and complain about Micro so much that we're gonna end up with a dumbed down version of Risk with Trolls and Spiders and Magic.

Reply #6 from Elemental Forums Top

I'm not going to argue any economy/resource issues back and forth until the beta 1B release. O:)