Deceiver_0 Deceiver_0

Patch Stat Changes Forum [NEW TOPIC: Adjudicators 8/25/09]!!

Patch Stat Changes Forum [NEW TOPIC: Adjudicators 8/25/09]!!

For Sins 1.18 and Entrenchment 1.04

This is a post that I will update regularly to give the DEVS a better idea of what people think should be done to stats in the next patch. This is ONLY for patches, no new ships or elaborate concepts for the next expansion. This is for dealing with peoples’ concerns about balance. If there’s a balance idea you have that’s not on here, post it and I’ll put it up for voting if it seems valid. I love the fact that ICO pays attention to the forums and what people suggest, I’d like to make it easier for them. The idea is to have all ideas posted straight forward and ranked so the DEVS don’t have to sift through pages and pages to find popular ideas. SP and MP players are both welcome to comment. Post yay or nay for any idea you like or dislike (be specific please) or say no fix needed. If you’d like I’ll also insert specific values you may come up with. Some votes will be taken from other threads.

* Topics shoud be considered independent of eachother, vote for each topic as if the Devs were to choose only 1. Yay for fixes that you think would work, nay for fixes that you think won't*

** Now there's an easier way to cast your vote, download the easy entry form, fill it out and then copy and paste your results!**

>> Download The Easy Entry Form <<

REFERENCES
Several members of the community have taken it upon themselves to run tests to prove imbalances and recommend possible fixes. I would Encourage everyone commenting here to read these and become more informed.
Raging Amish's Lums vs Enforcers                           JJs HC Tests                      JJs Illum Tests

Deceivers Subjugator thread                        Deceivers Cap Carrier thread         

RAGING AMISH's Balance MOD

Game Bugs

These need to be addressed before anything else. The following is a compiled list of all known game bugs. Thanks to Pawelo for helping me compile and test these. If you can think of any others that aren't on here leave a comment to let me know.

-Embargo Level 2 and 3 do not stop cargo ships.

-Phasic Trap Research level 2 does not do anything.

-Magnetize does not interrupt channeled abilities

-Disruptive Strikes does not work on pulse beams

-Allegiance through wormholes is flawed.

-Wrong Sound effects on: Anima Tempest, repair cloud, nanite armor, EMP blast

-Infocard errors: Dunov shield restore does not increase mitigation, labs do not speed up build time

-Akkan Colonize ability does not always spawn extractors at lvl2 and lvl3.

-Subverters Disrupt Shields can not target structures with shields

-Some musics and Orange Skybox are not used.

 

SOLANUS ADJUDICATORS

The adjudicator, while it can target multiple structures, just doesnt have the punch its TEC cousin the Ogrovs has and has difficulty handling tight clusters of structures supported by repair bays. Also, without a well functioning healing unit, the poor adjudicator simply cant live long enough in the throws of battle to make a huge difference. We've discussed the changes, now its time to get official votes on them.

     Buff the Adjudicator-
                         Change armor type?:

                              Yay-           JuleTron              Kitkun                           N3rull
                                               eoncommander

                              Nay-           Dargoon999         Warlord Mike

                         Reduce supply cost?:

                              Yay-           JuleTron              Kitkun                            Dargoon999
                                               Warlord Mike        Darvin3                         SivCorp
                                              
eoncommander

                              Nay-           

                         Reduce number of firing banks to increase damage per target?:

                              Yay-            Warlord Mike        eoncommander

                              Nay-            Kitkun                  N3rull                            Dargoon999

                         Increase damage?:

                              Yay-            Warlord Mike         eoncommander

                              Nay-            Kitkun                  Dargoon999

                         Increase shields?:

                             Yay-            JuleTron                Kitkun                           eoncommander

                             Nay-            Dargoon999           Warlord Mike

      No Fix Needed-                    Ryat                      Extremor

MINES

These little critters were introduced in Entrenchment and have been seldom used. They are purely defensive, extremely expensive, and a huge gamble to put your money in. There's been much discussion on possible fixes, but now its time for an official vote, so here you go.

      Buff Mines
                        Increase damage?

                            Yay-              Juletron                Whiskey144                 SivCorp
                                                Extremor

             
               Nay-              EadTaes               Raging Amish               Ovi_187
                                                Kitkun                  eoncommander

                        Increase damage radius?

                            Yay-             Top Vasari             Whiskey144                  EadTaes
                                               Warlord Mike          Ovi_187                        SivCorp
                                               Extremor                eoncommander

                            Nay-             Juletron                 N3rull                           Raging Amish
                                               Kitkun

                        Increase activation radius?

                            Yay-             Warlord Mike         eoncommander

                            Nay-             EadTaes                JuleTron                       N3rull
                                              
Raging Amish         Ovi_187                       Kitkun
                                               Extremor

                        Increase mines per deployment?

                            Yay-             eoncommander

                            Nay-             EadTaes                N3rull                         Raging Amish
                                              
Warlord Mike          Ovi_187                     Kitkun
                                              
Extremor

                        Increase deployment spread?

                            Yay-           Warlord Mike            Extremor                    eoncommander

                            Nay-           Juletron                   EadTaes                     N3rull
                                             Raging Amish           Ovi_187                     Kitkun

                        Decrease cost?

                            Yay-           Juletron                   Mindseye(25%)           EadTaes(25%)
                                             Dargoon999             Whiskey144
                N3rull(20%)
                                            
Warlord Mike            Ovi_187                     Kitkun
                                             Extremor

                            Nay-           Raging Amish            eoncommander

                        Reduce build time for Proximity Mines(TEC)?

                            Yay-           Juletron                   Whiskey144                EadTaes
                                             Raging Amish           Warlord Mike               Ovi_187
                                             Kitkun                      Extremor

                            Nay-

                        Increase duration of Gravity Mines(Vasari)?
 
                            Yay-           Juletron                   N3rull                  Mindseye
                                            
Ovi_187                   Kitkun                 Extremor

                            Nay-           EadTaes                  Raging Amish

                        Fix homming mines AI to return to original deployment location(Advent)?
 
                            Yay-           JuleTron                  EadTaes              N3rull
                                             Mindseye                 Warlord Mike       Ovi_187
                                            
SivCorp                    Kitkun                Extremor
                                            
eoncommander

                            Nay-           Raging Amish

                        Make Gravity Mines an upgrade to existing mines?

                            Yay-           N3rull                      Juletron               Dargoon999
                                             Ue-Carbon               Deceiver_0           Mindseye
                                            
Kitkun                     Extremor
                                          

                            Nay-           EadTaes                  Raging Amish

      No fix needed-

SIEGE FRIGATES

Costing more than most Heavy Cruisers, one would expect siege frigates to be able to handle a simple task like bombing a planet to oblivion, but with their super thin and weak hulls they certainly aren't worth the cost, and with Entrenchments bombardment protection on starbases, siege frigates find themselves in the obsolete unit pile. Personally I think they should be tough as nails since all they do is bomb planets and cost loads of resources and precious supply. With a decent buff these units could be the terror they once were and possibly bring back some of the planetary defense tech that fell from use after their nerf. (planetary shielding anyone?)

      Buff Siege Frigates

                        Increase Hp/shields/armor?:
 
                              Yay-             Deceiver_0(Hp)     Volt_Cruelerz   Darvin3
                                                  Ryat
                   EadTaes         Dargoon999(10%)
                                                  N3rull(+nerf)        
Kitkun            eoncommander   


                              Nay-             Soasertsus         Cykur                Mindseye
                                                 Raging Amish      Ascension          Howdidudothat
                                                 Ovi_187              Sobric               Warlord Mike
                                                 Extremor

                        Change armor type (currently light)?:

                              Yay-             Deceiver_0(v. heavy)  Soasertsus(v. heavy)  Volt_Cruelerz(heavy/v.heavy)
                                                
EadTaes (heavy)        Dargoon999(heavy)    N3rull(heavy)
                                                
SivCorp                     Extremor(heavy)         eoncommander


                              Nay-             Darvin3              Cykur                Ryat
                                                
Mindseye            Raging Amish     Ascension
                                                
Howdidudothat     Ovi_187             Sobric
                                                
Warlord Mike       Kitkun
 
                        Decrease Resource cost?:

                              Yay-             Soasertsus        Darvin3               EadTaes
                                                  Howdidudothat
  Sobric                 Extremor              


                              Nay-             Volt_Cruelerz      Cykur                 Ryat 
                                                 Dargoon999        Mindseye           Raging Amish
                                                 Ascension           Ovi_187             Warlord Mike
                                                 Kitkun

                        Decrease Supply Cost?:

                              Yay-            Soasertsus(6)     Darvin3               Cykur
                                                 Ryat(10)           EadTaes(10)        Dargoon999(10)
                                                 Mindseye          Howdidudothat      Raging Amish(12)
                                                 Ascension(12)   Ovi_187                mbaron888(8)
                                                 Sobric              Warlord Mike         SivCorp
                                                 Kitkun              eoncommander

                             
                              Nay-            Volt_Cruelerz     Extremor  

                        Increase Bombardment damage?:

                              Yay-            Volt_Cruelerz     Dargoon999(20%) Warlord Mike
                                                 Extremor

             
                              Nay-            Soasertsus         Darvin3               Cykur
                                               
Ryat                  EadTaes              Mindseye
                                               
Raging Amish     Ascension            Howdidudothat
                                               
Ovi_187             Sobric                 SivCorp
                                               
Kitkun                eoncommander


                        Make TEC Heavy Fallout Active (currently passive)?:

                              Yay-             Deceiver_0        Soasertsus            Volt_Cruelerz
                                                 Darvin3            Cykur                   Ryat
                                                
Dargoon999      N3rull                   Mindseye
                                                 Raging Amish    Ovi_187               Sobric
                                                 Warlord Mike     Kitkun


                              Nay-             EadTaes           Ascension             Howdidudothat

                        Reduce Heavy Fallout effect time (currently 6 minutes)?:

                              Yay-             Darvin3          Sobric                     Warlord Mike

                             
                              Nay-             Soasertsus       Volt_Cruelerz          Cykur
                                                 Ryat                EadTaes                 Dargoon999
                                                
Mindseye         Raging Amish          Ascension
                                                
Howdidudothat  Ovi_187                 Kitkun

                        Reduce Xp value (currently 65xp)?:

                              Yay-             Soasertsus       Darvin3(40)            Cykur
                                                 EadTaes(15)     Dargoon999(30)     Ovi_187
                                                 Kitkun


                              Nay-             Volt_Cruelerz    Ryat                     Mindseye
                                                
Raging Amish   Ascension              Howdidudothat
                                                 Sobric              Warlord Mike
                       
                        Apply fixes to siege militia?:

                              Yay-             Deceiver_0         Soasertsus              Volt_Cruelerz
                                                
Darvin3              EadTaes                 Dargoon999
                                                 Raging Amish     Ovi_187                  Sobric
                                                 Warlord Mike      Kitkun                    Extremor

                            
                              Nay-             Ryat                  Ascension              Howdidudothat             

                        Apply fixes to siege pirates?:

                              Yay-             Darvin3              EadTaes                 Dargoon999
                                                 Raging Amish      Ovi_187                 Warlord Mike
                                                 Kitkun                Extremor


                              Nay-             Soasertsus         Volt_Cruelerz           Ryat
                                                 
Ascension          Howdidudothat         Sobric


      No Fix Needed-

 

SEREVUN OVERSEER

The overseer is a powerful, but seldom used ship due to it's current lack of usability. I'd recommend anyone planning on voting on this topic read a few of the replies on page 5, where Ascension and I debated some changes. I've also thrown in a few ideas to make overseers 'Jump Degradation' ability a little more potent for the 100AM and channeling it costs.

      Buff Serevun Overseers-
                       
                         Increase firing arc of abilities?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0           JuleTron                Volt_Cruelerz
                                                  Ascension            Soasertsus             milo896

                                                  Howdidudothat     lifekatana               N3rull
                                                  Mindseye            Cykur                     EadTaes
                                                 
Raging Amish      Ovi_187                 Warlord Mike  
                                                  Kitkun                 Extremor                eoncommander

                              Nay-             Pbhead                Sobric
                      
                         Increase turn rate?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0           JuleTron                Volt_Cruelerz
                                                  Ascension           
Soasertsus             milo896
                                                  Howdidudothat     lifekatana              N3rull
                                                 
Mindseye            Pbhead                  Raging Amish 
                                                  Ovi_187              Warlord Mike          Kitkun
                                                  Extremor             eoncommander

                              Nay-             EadTaes              Sobric                    SivCorp

                         Make 'Reactive nanite armor' omnidirectional (360 degrees)?:

                              Yay-              Ascension           Raging Amish          Sobric
                                                 
Warlord Mike       SivCorp                   Extremor

                              Nay-              Deceiver_0          Soasertsus              Darvin3                                              
                                                  milo896
              Howdidudothat         lifekatana
                                                  N3rull                 Mindseye                 Pbhead
                                                  EadTaes             Ovi_187                   Kitkun
                                                  eoncommander

                      
   Increase reduction of jump speed for 'Jump Degradation'?:

                              Yay-              milo896              Howdidudothat         Mindseye
                                                 
EadTaes              Ovi_187                  Sobric
                                                  Kitkun                 Extremor                 eoncommander

                              Nay-              Soasertsus          lifekatana               Pbhead
                                                  Raging Amish
 
                         Allow 'Jump Degradation' to do a damage % to incoming enemy vessels' hulls?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0 (5-10%)  Soasertsus(20%AM)  Darvin3
                                                  milo896              N3rull(speed reduction)  Kitkun
                                                  eoncommander

                              Nay-              Howdidudothat     lifekatana              Mindseye
                                                  Pbhead               EadTaes                 Raging Amish
                                                 
Ovi_187              Sobric                     Extremor

                        Allow 'Jump Degradation' to disable passive regeneration?

                              Yay-              Raging Amish       Deceiver_0              Diplominator
                                                  Juletron               
Sobric                    Extremor                 

                              Nay-              Ovi_187               Howdidudothat         Cykur
                                                  Kitkun

         No Fix Needed-


SKAROVAS ENFORCER

The relative weakness of the Enforcer has recently been brought to the forums attention (thanks JohnJames). With their higher resource cost, higher supply cost and more expensive upgrades, enforcers are unfortunately left in the dust by their counterparts. Many speculate that their extra ability (reintegration) is the cause for such a skewed balance, while others agree that reintegration lacks the power enforcers deserve. The following are some fixes that have been proposed. Personally, I think the Vasari should get a little more for what they pay for.

           Buff Skarovas Enforcers-

                         Decrease Resource Cost?:

                              Yay-              Ascension              EadTaes                  Sobric          

                              Nay-              Deceiver_0             Soasertsus               Volt_Cruelerz
                                                  lifekatana     
         Howdidudothat          Darvin3
                                                  Mindseye               Raging Amish            Ovi_187
                                                 
Warlord Mike          Kitkun                      Extremor  
                                                 
eoncommander      
               
                         Decrease Supply Cost?:

                              Yay-              Soasertsus             Sobric                       Extremor

                              Nay-              Deceiver_0             Volt_Cruelerz             lifekatana
                                           
       Howdidudothat        Darvin3                     Mindseye
                                                  EadTaes                 Raging Amish            Ovi_187
                                                 
Kitkun                    eoncommander

                     
    Increase hp/shields/armor?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0               Darvin3                   EadTaes(armor+1)
                                                  Raging Amish           SivCorp                   Kitkun
                                                  eoncommander
                           
                              Nay-              Volt_Cruelerz           Soasertsus               lifekatana
                                                 
Howdidudothat         Mindseye                 Ovi_187
                                                 
Sobric                     Extremor

                    
     Increase Damage?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0              Soasertsus                Ascension
                                                  JuleTron                 
Darvin3                    Howdidudothat
                                                  Mindseye                
Cykur                      EadTaes(22)
                                                  Raging Amish(21.6)  Ovi_187                   Sobric
                                                  Warlord Mike           SivCorp                    Kitkun
                                                  eoncommander

                              Nay-              Volt_Cruelerz           lifekatana                Extremor         

            
             Cheaper damage upgrades?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0              Volt_cruelerz              Top Vasari
                                                   Ascension               DesConnor                Raging Amish
                                                   N3rull                     lifekatana                 JuleTron 

                                                  
Darvin3                  Howdidudothat           Mindseye
                                                  
EadTaes                 Sobric                       Warlord Mike
                                                  
SivCorp                  Extremor                   eoncommander     

                              Nay-              Soasertsus              Ovi_187                    Kitkun

                    
     Higher reintegration rate?:

                              Yay-              Deceiver_0              Volt_cruelerz              Top Vasari
                                                  Soasertsus              N3rull                        lifekatana
                                                  JuleTron                
Darvin3                      Howdidudothat
                                                 
Ovi_187                  Sobric                        Kitkun

                              Nay-             Mindseye                 EadTaes                    Raging Amish 
                                                 Extremor

           No Fix Needed-                 Pbhead

DOMINA SUBJUGATORS

The domina has been an a lot of peoples (f spending money on that) list for sometime. I tested and observed the subjugator while I was examining carrier caps and wrote a report on them as well. Here's some fixes that have been proposed for the Domina as well as the Stilakus Subverter (whose destiny is quite intertwined with the domina). I'll be putting the Subverter question under the REPULSE section as it has to do more as a counter to it.

          Buff Domina Subjugators-

                         Increase firing arc of abilities?:

                                Yay-            Deceiver_0             Mindseye              Darvin3
                                                  Gugabalog            
Cykur(heal only)    Raging Amish
                                                 
Ovi_187                 Sobric                   Warlord Mike
                                                 
SivCorp                  Kitkun                   eoncommander       

                                Nay-            EadTaes                lifekatana             Pbhead

              
           Increase turn rate?:

                                Yay-            Deceiver_0             Darvin3                Gugabalog
                                                  Mindseye               Pbhead               
Raging Amish
                                                  Ovi_187                 Sobric                  Warlord Mike
                                                  Kitkun                    eoncommander

                                Nay-            EadTaes                lifekatana

                  
       Make abilities AOE?:

                                Yay-            Warlord Mike          SivCorp                eoncommander

                                Nay-            Deceiver_0             EadTaes               Gugabalog    
                                                  Darvin3                  lifekatana             Mindseye
                                                 
Pbhead                  Raging Amish        Ovi_187
                                                 
Sobric                    Kitkun

            
             Remove channeling from abilities?:

                               Yay-             EadTaes                Gugabalog             lifekatana
                                                 
Raging Amish         Sobric                   Warlord Mike
                                                  Kitkun

              
                 Nay-             Deceiver_0             Darvin3                 Mindseye
                                                 
Pbhead                  Ovi_187                SivCorp
                                                  eoncommander

                
         Fix Targeting AI (on all abilities for all races) to prevent wasteful use?:

                               Yay-             Deceiver_0             Darvin3                  EadTaes
                                                  Gugabalog             Soasertsus             lifekatana
                                                  Mindseye               Pbhead                 
Cykur
                                                 
Raging Amish         Ovi_187                 Sobric
                                                 
Warlord Mike          SivCorp                  Kitkun
                                                 
eoncommander


                               Nay-             Pbhead

           No Fix Needed-

CARRIER CLASS CAPITAL SHIPS

I've noticed people use Carrier Caps generally for 1 ability, and not for the strikecraft and SC bonuses they offer. Weaker than most other classes, they are sparse and somewhat unthreatening on the battle field. Personally I think they should offer more benefit in the strike craft department than they do now. I've written a detailed report on them, and taken some of the proposed changes from it for this thread.

             Buff Carrier Caps-

                        Increase Initial Armor?

                                Yay-          Deceiver_0              Soasertsus            Ryat
                                                Howdidudothat         Gugabalog          
Warlord Mike
                                                SivCorp                   Kitkun

                                Nay-          Darvin3                  -Ue_Carbon          mbaron888
                                                Pirate-Jack             EadTaes              DesConnor
                                                Swordsalmon          lifekatana           
Pbhead
                                                Raging Amish         Ovi_187               Sobric
                                                Extremor                eoncommander

            
            Increase Squadron Capacity?

                                Yay-          Deceiver_0 (see thread)  Soasertsus      Ryat
                                                -Ue_Carbon              ReadyMan           Howdidudothat
                                                mbaron888              Pirate-Jack          EadTaes
                                                DesConnor               Mindseye            Swordsalmon
                                                Gugabalog               N3rull                  lifekatana
                                                -aceca-                   Derek06              
Ovi_187
                                               
Sobric                     Warlord Mike        SivCorp
                                               
Kitkun                     Extremor             eoncommander

                                Nay-          Darvin3                  Raging Amish          

                
        Make SC buffs AOE?

                                Yay-          EadTaes               DesConnor               Swordsalmon
                                                Gugabalog           
Derek06                   Raging Amish
                                               
Sobric                   SivCorp                    Extremor
 
                                Nay-          Deceiver_0             Soasertsus              Ryat
                                                Darvin3                  -Ue_Carbon             Howdidudothat
                                                mbaron888            Pirate-Jack               lifekatana
                                               
Pbhead                  Ovi_187                  Kitkun
                                               
eoncommander


                        Increase additional drones(Adept Drone Anima)?

                                Yay-          Deceiver_0               Darvin3                 Howdidudothat
                                                 Mindseye                 Swordsalmon         Gugabalog
                                                
Derek06                  Raging Amish        Sobric 
                                               
SivCorp                    Kitkun               

               
                 Nay-          Soasertsus               Ryat                     -Ue_Carbon
                                                 mbaron888              Pirate-Jack           EadTaes
                                                DesConnor                lifekatana           
Pbhead
                                                Ovi_187                    Extremor             eoncommander

                        Re-work Scramble Bombers?

                                Yay-          Deceiver_0               Soasertsus            Ryat
                                                Darvin3                    -Ue_Carbon          Howdidudothat
                                                mbaron888              Pirate-Jack            EadTaes
                                                DesConnor               Mindseye              Swordsalmon   
                                                Gugabalog               N3rull                    lifekatana
                                                Pbhead                   
Derek06               Raging Amish
                                               
Ovi_187                   Sobric                   Warlord Mike
                                               
SivCorp                    Kitkun                  Extremor
                                                eoncommander

      
                          Nay-        

           No Fix Needed-

LIGHT FRIGATES

Most agree that Light Frigates don't scale well. Being limited in their usefulness early game, and becoming almsot complete obsolete late game with Heavy Cruiser research. Many ideas have been thrown around to get light frigates back on the battle field.

            Buff Light Frigates-

                        Increase Damage?:

                                  Yay-         TheRezonator       Gugabalog               Darvin3
                                                  -Ue_carbon          Howdidudothat         JuleTron
                                                  Pirate-Jack          N3rull                      Ascension
                                                 
Cykur                  Dargoon999(20%)   Raging Amish(Vasari: 12)
                                                 
Ovi_187              SivCorp(10%)          

             
                     Nay-         Volt_cruelerz         mbaron888              DesConnor
                                                 lifekatana            
Pbhead                   EadTaes
                                                 Sobric                   Kitkun                     Extremor
                                                 eoncommander

                 
       Increase Damage bonus to heavy armor type?:

                                  Yay-         Deceiver_0           TheRezonator           Gugabalog
                                                 -Ue_carbon          JuleTron                  Pirate-Jack
                                                 Howdidudothat     mbaron888              DesConnor(Light)
            
                                     Ascension            lifekatana                EadTaes
                                                 Dargoon999         Raging Amish(175%+)   Ovi_187
                                                 Sobric                  SivCorp(25%)           Kitkun
                                                
Extremor             eoncommander

                                  Nay-         Volt_cruelerz        Pbhead    
                
   
                        Increase Hp/Shields/Armor?:

                                  Yay-          Deceiver_0(armor)      TheRezonator     Gugabalog
                                                  Darvin3                      JuleTron            Ascension
                                                  lifekatana                 
Dargoon999(10%)  Ovi_187
                                                  Warlord Mike              eoncommander

                                  Nay-          Volt_cruelerz       Pirate-Jack               Howdidudothat
                                                   mbaron888        DesConnor              
Pbhead
                                                   EadTaes            Raging Amish           Sobric
                                                   SivCorp             Kitkun                      Extremor
                  
                         Increase ability range?:

                                  Yay-          Deceiver_0          TheRezonator            Gugabalog
                                                  Volt_cruelerz       -Ue_carbon                JuleTron
                                                  Ascension          
Eadtaes                     Dargoon999
                                                  Raging Amish      Ovi_187                    Sobric
                                                  Kitkun                Extremor                   eoncommander
 
                                  Nay-          Howdidudothat    mbaron888               DesConnor
                                                  lifekatana          
Pbhead                   
                                                  
                 
       Increase firing arc?:

                                  Yay-          TheRezonator       Gugabalog              -Ue_carbon
                                                  JuleTron               Pirate-Jack               Howdidudothat
                                                  DesConnor            N3rull                      Ascension
                                                 
Eadtaes                Raging Amish           Sobric
                                                  Warlord Mike        SivCorp                    Extremor

                                  Nay-          Volt_cruelerz         mbaron888               lifekatana
                                                 
Pbhead                Dargoon999              Ovi_187
                                                  Kitkun                  eoncommander

           
             Increase turn speed?:

                                  Yay-          Darvin3                 EadTaes                TheRezonator
                                                  Pirate-Jack             ReadyMan            Howdidudothat
                                                  mbaron888            DesConnor            Mindseye
                                                  N3rull                    Ascension              Pbhead
                                                 
Eadtaes                 Dargoon999          Raging Amish
                                                 
Ovi_187                 Sobric                  Warlord Mike
                                                 
SivCorp                  Extremor              eoncommander

                                  Nay-         lifekatana              Kitkun

             Tweak Targeting AI to favor support cruisers?:

                                  Yay-         Deceiver_0           TheRezonator           Gugabalog
                                                 Darvin3               Volt_cruelerz             JuleTron
                                                 Pirate-Jack           mbaron888               DesConnor
                                                 N3rull                  Ascension                  lifekatana
                                                
Eadtaes               Dargoon999              Raging Amish
                                                
Ovi_187               Sobric                      Warlord Mike
                                                
SivCorp                Kitkun                     Extremor
                                                 eoncommander

                                  Nay-        Howdidudothat      Pbhead

     
        Nerf Counters-

                          Decrease LRF Damage?:
   
                                  Yay-          Proletari                Darvin3               Azrak_Navarion
                                                 ReadyMan             Howdidudothat     Mindseye
                                                 Ascension             
Eadtaes               Dargoon999(10%)

                                  Nay-          Deceiver_0           Volt_cruelerz          Pirate-Jack
                                                  mbaron888          DesConnor             lifekatana
                                                 
Pbhead               Raging Amish         Ovi_187
                                                 
Sobric                 Warlord Mike           Kitkun
                                                 
Extremor             eoncommander

                          Decrease LRF damage bonus to medium armor?

                                  Yay-         Deceiver_0(125%)  Ovi_187              Howdidudothat
                                                
Sobric                   eoncommander

                                  Nay-         N3rull                    Cykur                 Warlord Mike
                                                
Kitkun                   Extremor

                          Increase LRF resource cost?:

                                  Yay-         Extremor

                                  Nay-         Deceiver_0            Pirate-Jack          Howdidudothat
                                                 mbaron888            DesConnor         lifekatana
                                                
Pbhead                 Eadtaes              Dargoon999
                                                 Raging Amish        Ovi_187              Sobric
                                                
Warlord Mike         Kitkun                 eoncommander

         
    No Fix Needed-                Soasertsus              dresda

REPULSE:


Many have said repulse needs a fix. Personally I agree.


            Nerf Guardians-

                        Increase AM cost?:

                                    Yay-     Deceiver_0               Raging Amish         crashmatusow
                                                Ascension                 Pirate - Jack           Volt_cruelerz
                                                Tohron                     Darvin 3                 Top vasari
                                                mbaron888               Proletari                -Ue_carbon
                                                Major  Stress            Mindseye                Azrak_Navarion
                                                lbgsloan                   Gugabalog              Soasertsus
                                                Howdidudothat          JuleTron                 DesConnor
                                                lifekatana                -aceca-                  
Derek06
                                                Cykur                      Ovi_187                  Sobric
                                               
Warlord Mike            SivCorp                  Kitkun
                                               
Extremor                  eoncommander   
                                              
                                    Nay-    dresda

                        Increase cooldown rate?

                                    Yay-      Raging Amish            Deceiver_0             Howdidudothat
                                               
Kitkun                       Extremor               eoncommander

                                    Nay-      Ovi_187                  Juletron                   Sobric
                                                 Cykur

                        Decrease AOE?:

                                    Yay-     Gugabalog                 -Ue_carbon            DesConnor
                                              
eoncommander

                    
                Nay-     Pirate - Jack             Major  Stress         crashmatusow
                                               Mindseye                 Soasertsus              Howdidudothat
                                               dresda                     lifekatana             
Pbhead
                                              
Derek06                  Raging Amish         Ovi_187
                                              
Sobric                     Warlord Mike          Kitkun
                                              
Extremor    

            
            Increase resource cost?:

                                    Yay-      Ascension                Volt_cruelerz           Sobric
                                               
Extremor          

                     
               Nay-      Pirate - Jack            Major  Stress           Soasertsus
                                                 Mindseye                 Gugabalog            Howdidudothat
                                                 dresda                    DesConnor             lifekatana
                                                
Pbhead                   Derek06                 Raging Amish
                                               
Ovi_187                   Warlord Mike           Kitkun 
                                               
eoncommander 

             
            Cause damage to shields?:

                                    Yay-      EadTaes                  Volt_cruelerz        dresda

                        
            Nay-      Major  Stress           Mindseye             Soasertsus
                                                Gugabalog              Howdidudothat      DesConnor
                                                lifekatana              
Pbhead                Derek06
                                                Raging Amish         Ovi_187                Sobric
                                                Warlord Mike         Kitkun                    Extremor
                                               
eoncommander 
 
      
       Buff Counters-

                        Increase LF ability range?:

                                    Yay-     Gugabalog                TheRezonator         Volt_cruelerz
                                               
Derek06                   Raging Amish         Sobric
                                               
SivCorp                    Kitkun                   Extremor
                                               
eoncommander          

                      
              Nay-     Pirate - Jack             Major  Stress          Soasertsus
                                               Mindseye                  DesConnor            lifekatana
                                              
Pbhead                     Ovi_187


          
              No affect to Cap Ships?:

                                    Yay-     Pirate - Jack             Major  Stress         Volt_cruelerz
                                               DesConnor               Cykur                  
Warlord Mike
                                              
SivCorp                    Kitkun                  Extremor
                                               eoncommander

                                    Nay-    Mindseye                  Gugabalog              Soasertsus   
                                              lifekatana                 
Pbhead                  Derek06
                                             
Raging Amish            Ovi_187                  Sobric

        
                 Increase Distortion Field (targeting) range?:

                                    Yay-     Deceiver_0               Soasertsus              Sobric
                                              
Kitkun                      eoncommander

                   
                 Nay-     lifekatana                crashmatusow          Pbhead
                                               Raging Amish           Ovi_187                  Extremor
     


            No Fix Needed-

MISSILE BARRAGE:

This has been a heated issue for several months. In the most recent patch, the devs made the graphic unique (red missile exhaust?) and extended the duration while reducing dps. Was this enough?


            Nerf Missile Barrage-

                        Decrease total damage?:

                                    Yay-      Extremor

                                    Nay-      mbaron888             Gugabalog             TheRezonator
                                                 Volt_cruelerz          -Ue_carbon           Howdidudothat
                                                 DesConnor            
Derek06                Raging Amish
                                                
Ovi_187                 Sobric                   Warlord Mike 

               
         Increase AM cost?

                                    Yay-      Ascension               Ovi_187

                         
           Nay-      mbaron888             Gugabalog            TheRezonator
                                                 Volt_cruelerz           -Ue_carbon           Howdidudothat
                                                 DesConnor             
Derek06              Raging Amish
                                                 Sobric                     Warlord Mike       Extremor
                                      
              
          Decrease AOE?

                                    Yay-      Tohron                     mbaron888           Howdidudothat
                                                 JuleTron                  DesConnor           
Sobric

                    
                Nay-      Gugabalog                TheRezonator       Volt_cruelerz
                                                 -Ue_carbon              
Derek06               Raging Amish 
                                               
Ovi_187                    Warlord Mike         Extremor                          

        
    Buff Counters-

                        Increase range on ability interrupts?:

                                    Yay-     Tohron                   TheRezonator          Raging Amish
                                               Ovi_187                  Sobric                     Extremor

                     
               Nay-     Gugabalog              Volt_cruelerz            -Ue_carbon
                                                Howdidudothat        DesConnor

           
              LF abilities can target caps?:

                                    Yay-      Gugabalog             TheRezonator       Sobric
                                                Warlord Mike

                       
             Nay-      Volt_cruelerz         -Ue_carbon            Howdidudothat
                                                DesConnor             N3rull                  
Derek06
                                               
Raging Amish         Ovi_187               Extremor

               
        Graphic/Audio Improvement?:
 
                                    Yay-     Eadtaes                   Deceiver_0            Volt_cruelerz
                                               Gugabalog               TheRezonator        -Ue_carbon
                                               Howdidudothat          N3rull                   lifekatana
                                              
Derek06                   Cykur                   Raging Amish
                                              
Ovi_187                   Sobric                   Warlord Mike
                                               SivCorp                   Kitkun                   Extremor
                                               eoncommander

                                     Nay-    DesConnor

            No Fix Needed-             Deceiver_0                EadTaes             Azrak_Navarion
                                              Major  Stress             Top vasari          Soasertsus
                                              ReadyMan                 lifekatana
         SivCorp
                                              
Kitkun                      eoncommander       


CARRIERS:

Extensively nerfed in the previous 2 patches, carriers have lost their place as a hard counter to long ranged frigates, as flak frigates can now destroy fighters much faster than they are built, and long ranged frigates can now hunt the carriers themselves down.


            Buff Carriers-

                        Decrease build penalty?:

                                    Yay-     Deceiver_0                Ascension            crashmatusow
                                               Pirate - Jack              mbaron888          Volt_cruelerz
                                               lbgsloan                    Gugabalog           Top vasari
                                               Soasertsus                Howdidudothat      JuleTron
                                               N3rull                        lifekatana           
Derek06
                                              
Cykur                       Ovi_187                Sobric
                                               Warlord Mike             SivCorp                Kitkun
                                              
eoncommander 

                                    Nay-     DesConnor                Raging Amish       Extremor

                       
Increase fighter HP?:

                                    Yay-    Ascension                  Mindseye              Azrak_Navarion
                                              Gugabalog                 Howdidudothat     
Derek06
                                              Extremor

                     
               Nay-    Pirate - Jack             mbaron888             Volt_cruelerz
                                              Soasertsus                DesConnor             lifekatana
                                             
Raging Amish            Ovi_187                 Sobric
                                              Warlord Mike            SivCorp                  Kitkun 

           
             Reduce movement penalty?:

                                    Yay-     Tohron                    Soasertsus              Raging Amish
                                               mbaron888              Gugabalog              Howdidudothat
                                               JuleTron                  ReadyMan               DesConnor
                                              
Derek06                  Sobric                     SivCorp
                                               Extremor            

                                    Nay-     Pirate - Jack            crashmatusow         lifekatana
                                               
Cykur                     Deceiver_0             Ovi_187
                                              
Kitkun 

         
   Nerf Counters-

                        Reduce Flak rate of fire?:

                                   Yay-         EadTaes                Warlord Mike        eoncommander

                  
                 Nay-         Mindseye               Gugabalog           Volt_cruelerz
                                                  Soasertsus             Howdidudothat     DesConnor
                                                  lifekatana              
Raging Amish      Ovi_187
                                                 
Sobric                    Kitkun                  Extremor


            No Fix Needed-                 Major  Stress         -Ue_carbon            Pbhead

SCOUTS:

With the recent nerf to carriers, scouts have come to the forefront as a decent anti-lrf ship, and with their new found popularity some changes have been suggested.


            Nerf Scouts-

                        Reduce damage buff against light armor?:

                                    Yay-      Volt_cruelerz            Ovi_187

                          
          Nay-      Deceiver_0               Ascension             Soasertsus
                                                Gugabalog                Howdidudothat     
Derek06
                                               
Raging Amish           Sobric                   Warlord Mike 
                                               
Kitkun                     Extremor

                        Increase scout supply requirement?:

                                    Yay-

                                    Nay-      Ascension                Pirate - Jack         Volt_cruelerz
                                                Gugabalog               TheRezonator       Soasertsus
                                                 Howdidudothat        
Derek06              Raging Amish
                                                
Ovi_187                  Sobric                  Warlord Mike 
                                               
Kitkun                      Extremor
 

                        Increase resource cost?:

                                    Yay-

                                    Nay-      Ascension               Pirate - Jack           Volt_cruelerz
                                                Gugabalog              TheRezonator         Soasertsus
                                                 Howdidudothat       
Derek06                 Raging Amish 
                                                
Ovi_187                 Sobric                     Warlord Mike 
                                               
Kitkun                     Extremor
                                
      
      Buff Vasari Scouts-

                        Increase Hp/Shields?:

                                    Yay-     Deceiver_0              Raging Amish         Volt_cruelerz
                                                Ascension               Pirate - Jack             Soasertsus
                                                Mindseye                TheRezonator           Howdidudothat
                                               
Derek06                 Sobric                      Warlord Mike
                                               
SivCorp                  Kitkun                      Dargoon999
                                                Extremor

                   
                  Nay-   Gugabalog               Ovi_187

                 
       Increase damage?:

                                    Yay-      Ascension              Raging Amish           Volt_cruelerz
                                                Gugabalog             TheRezonator           Soasertsus
                                                Howdidudothat       
Derek06                  Cykur(+.5dps)
                                                Ovi_187                 Sobric                      Warlord Mike
                                               
SivCorp                  Kitkun                      Dargoon999
                                               
                                    Nay-      Extremor


            No Fix Needed-              EadTaes                 mbaron888            JuleTron
                                               Major  Stress          -Ue_carbon              ReadyMan
                                               DesConnor              lifekatana             
Pbhead
                                              
eoncommander

ILLUMINATORS:

The relative strength of illuminators has been under debate for some time, and many fixes have been proposed, here are a few, let me know if you’ve got others. I've done my own research, and have posted my findings.


            Nerf Illuminators-

                        Increase resource cost?:
 
                                    Yay-      Ascension               Volt_cruelerz           Ovi_187
                                                Pirate - Jack           EadTaes                 Top vasari
                                                lbgsloan                 Gugabalog              Azrak_Navarion
                                                Soasertsus              Howdidudothat       
Derek06
                                                Extremor

                         
            Nay-     Major  Stress          -Ue_carbon              lifekatana
                                               
Raging Amish         Sobric                     Warlord Mike
                                                
Kitkun                  eoncommander
                                               

         
               Adjust damage division between beams?:

                                    Yay-    Deceiver_0(33%)    mbaron888               -Ue_carbon
                                              Gugabalog             DesConnor                N3rull
                                               Ascension            
Derek06                   Raging Amish(33%)
                                               Ovi_187               Sobric                       Warlord Mike
                                              
eoncommander 

                                    Nay-    Pirate - Jack          Major  Stress             Soasertsus
                                              Howdidudothat       lifekatana                 
Kitkun
                                             
Extremor            

                        Decrease/adjust the HP/Shields?:

                                   Yay-      Pirate - Jack (hp only)        EadTaes          TheRezonator
                                               Ascension              Gugabalog                  -Ue_carbon
                                               Soasertsus             Howdidudothat            DesConnor
                                               -aceca-                 
Derek06                      Cykur
                                               Raging Amish(Hp&Armor)  Ovi_187            Sobric 
                                              
Warlord Mike           SivCorp                     Kitkun
                                              
Extremor(450/500)  eoncommander

                        
           Nay-      Major  Stress        Volt_cruelerz                Soasertsus
                                               lifekatana           


                        Increase supply requirement?:

                                  Yay-        DesConnor            Derek06               Kitkun 

                
                  Nay-        Pirate - Jack          Major  Stress         Volt_cruelerz
                                                Gugabalog             Soasertsus            Howdidudothat
                                                lifekatana             
Raging Amish        Ovi_187   
                                               
Sobric                    Warlord Mike         Extremor 
                                               
eoncommander        
 
                        Decrease Damage?:
 
                                  Yay-        EadTaes                Ascension               Soasertsus
                                                Major  Stress        Gugabalog                ReadyMan
                                                DesConnor(Caps only)  N3rull                lifekatana
                                               
Ovi_187                Extremor          

                      
            Nay-        Volt_cruelerz        -Ue_carbon            Howdidudothat
                                               
Derek06              Raging Amish         Sobric
                                               
Warlord Mike        Kitkun                    eoncommander

                             
                  

            No Fix Needed-             mbaron888           Mindseye               dresda
                                             
Pbhead

More to come-

1,283,024 views 566 replies
Reply #501 Top

A simpler solution may be to give the Subverter more hull/shield points.
I'm not sure if this is the right way to go. Even if they had five times the hit points, they would still have minimal chance of surviving once the 30 HCs right in front of them start shooting again. Besides, the support cruisers are meant to be somewhat squishy - they are powerful ships that aid indirectly, not massive combat vessels like HCs. They should be a gamble for the enemy - kill us instead of the heavy hitters or else our abilities will screw you up. We don't fight, but our brethren fight better with us around. Or you fight worse.

I truly believe the only thing wrong about distortion field is that,after using it, the poor subverter is left in a position where a battlecruiser might have trouble surviving.
The distortion field already causes the subverter to "jump" forward as it is used. It might as well cause it to return to the previous position (jump back the same distance) afterwards. Same thing, unless there's some hardcoded script that prevents the game engine from moving the ships backwards. I don't think there is, cause if you order a construction of a SB in the middle of your fleet, the other ships are 'teleported' (pushed immediately) in every direction to make room.

Reply #502 Top

Question - doesn't it piss you off that a colony cap can colonize 10 planets over 15 minutes, each guarded by 10 frigates of all kinds, yet never having to kill anything other than krosovs?? I think it's stupid and makes such retarded colonize rushing the only really efficient and viable tactic if you're not being fed.

It pretty much takes away all thinking out of the first 10 minutes of a Quick Start game.

I believe this too could use addressing while we're at balancing the game.

Reply #503 Top

Im afraid I disagree with you N3rull. The only time subverters get annihilated by enemy fleets when they jump and disable is when theres nothing else for them to shoot at once the distortion field falls. If youve got your fleet right there, then there isnt a problem. Distortion field is really a 1 time use thing any way, and if you really have problems keeping them alive for more than one use, then practice stringing them together, ie use 1, 18 seconds alter use another and move the first to safety, etc etc. There has to be a downside to being able to freeze up an entire fleet with 1 unit, and that downside is putting that unit in harms way. If your smart, its not hard to keep those little suckers alive.

I think the big reason they arent used as much is that disortion field is realy high on the tech tree, so in any game involving people rushing other people, its not likely it will go on long enough for this ability to get a lot of use.

Reply #504 Top

The radius of the Distortion field is not so imba to knock out a whole fleet. There usually is some of the enemy fleet left unaffected, half of it more often than not. I'm ok with the subverter being there, with its ass right between a rock and a hard place, as it channels the field, even though any thinking player will ff the subverter and it's gone. Only that after it's done channeling, it doesn't deserve to be stuck with its retarded turn rate, retarded acceleration and speed and durability, with its nose facing the enemy guns and no reverse gear available.
Even the AI is hardly ever throwing its ships in a ball tight enough to be fully caught by the subverter.

Well, I guess the Distortion Field change is not anywhere near priority one. If the Overseer gets any buff to the nanite armor, I suppose it won't be too hard to save those poor subverters.

SHIELD DISRUPTION not working on starbases while Cielo's designate DOES is much more important IMO.
Please add it to the bugs list.

Reply #505 Top

SHIELD DISRUPTION not working on starbases while Cielo's designate DOES is much more important IMO.
Please add it to the bugs list.

That I am aware of and will go on the list.

Reply #506 Top

For Starfish, I say change armour type, increase shields and reduce fleet supply. Not sure about other changes.

As I said earlier, buffing Overseers will increase the survivability of Subverters. They need no change other then the SB targeting thing.

 

Reply #508 Top

Adju:

Yay

Yay

Nay

Nay

Yay

 

:fox:

Reply #509 Top

My only vote here:

Reduce number of firing banks to increase damage per target?:       Nay

Doing this will defeat th point of adjudicator and turn it into a weaker ogrov.
I say neither yay or nay for other changes - you decide which is better. Just don't clone the Ogrov.

edit. - of course yay to armor change (medium imo, or heavy).

Reply #510 Top

I say yay for a slight damage increase

a compentently built TEC defense zone can easily overcome the damge that 10 to 20 starfish can dole out

nay for all the rest

Reply #511 Top

a compentently built TEC defense zone can easily overcome the damge that 10 to 20 starfish can dole out
You must have been drinking.
2-3 starfish, maybe. 5, hardly. 20 would wipe a fully upgraded starbases in below one minute and any other structure in range in below 10 seconds. The problem is that starfish are too expensive of a gamble to get instead of good ol' bomber spam. Fighters wipe them too easily.

OH and of course - yay to change armor type to medium (preferably, could be heavy). That's a no brainer imo.

Reply #512 Top

Sol. Adju.

No to all,

except YES for a decrease in supply cost from 18 to 12.

Right now its just easier/smarter to go for a carrier (20 supply cost) with 3 bomber squadrons. Dropping the supplies from 18 to 12 would certainly make this ship a LOT more desirable.

Deceiver, I'd like to take this time to add my vote for the Vasari scout. This thing is weak. Buff Damage/Hull/Shields by 25%.

Reply #513 Top

Quoting N3rull, reply 511

a compentently built TEC defense zone can easily overcome the damge that 10 to 20 starfish can dole outYou must have been drinking.
2-3 starfish, maybe. 5, hardly. 20 would wipe a fully upgraded starbases in below one minute and any other structure in range in below 10 seconds. The problem is that starfish are too expensive of a gamble to get instead of good ol' bomber spam. Fighters wipe them too easily.


OH and of course - yay to change armor type to medium (preferably, could be heavy). That's a no brainer imo.

true now that I think about it, I normally now play with mods and this seriously increases the survivalblity of SBs and other defenses

Reply #514 Top

^_^'  yeah, nothing like commenting the balance of one game based on your experience with another.

Interesting how neither of you wanted to change the armor type.
I suggest you read some of the earlier duscussion on that topic and change your vote there, as this change is simply needed - light armor makes there guys as squishy as lrfs against fighters, and with their price and supply cost it just sux. Moreover, bombers too have light armor, which makes fighters the number one omnipotent anti-assault weapon (they kill bombers, lrfs, assault cruisers... nonsense, where's the strategy here?).

Reply #515 Top

I usually can keep them apart

oh well no one is perfect

and I did pay attention to the earlier discussion

decision is now

change nothing

Reply #516 Top

change nothing

Im not quite clear on what youve voted for ryat, care to clarify?

Reply #518 Top

Quoting Deceiver_0, reply 516

change nothing


Im not quite clear on what youve voted for ryat, care to clarify?

after some reconsideration of my mixup I say change nothing

sorry about the misunderstanding

Reply #519 Top

Quoting N3rull, reply 514
 yeah, nothing like commenting the balance of one game based on your experience with another.

Interesting how neither of you wanted to change the armor type.
I suggest you read some of the earlier duscussion on that topic and change your vote there, as this change is simply needed - light armor makes there guys as squishy as lrfs against fighters, and with their price and supply cost it just sux. Moreover, bombers too have light armor, which makes fighters the number one omnipotent anti-assault weapon (they kill bombers, lrfs, assault cruisers... nonsense, where's the strategy here?).

Nerull, I understand completely why the change from light to heavy armor would be good, but I would prefer to see a major drop in fleet supplies before a change in armor type. If no changes or only a small drop is made to the fleet supplies its still gonna be better to just go for a carrier. Thats why I recommend a drop from 18 to 12.

12 supplies for adju.

20 supplies for carrier.

Now you have an interesting strategic choice to make, dont you think?

Edit: Interesting how you didn't vote for a drop in fleet supplies... ;)

Reply #520 Top

personally considering how easy it is to counter fighters as well as how many fighters you can put in a gw without a fleet I dont think that the adju need an armor change

and if you do have a fleet there that increases the fighter count and as ship types beyond carrier then the adju are toast anyway because any intelligent commander would target them first and let the rest die upon the starbase and other defenses

Reply #521 Top

Ah, the Adjudicator is up at last.

Input:

Increase damage? VERY slightly, if at all (5% max).

Reduce Supply Cost?  Yes - down to, say, 12

Reduce number of firing banks to increase damage per target?  I actually made an interesting post about it earlier - it goes something like this:

  • 5 structures in range: all cannons target one structure each
  • 4 structures: 3 have their own targets, 2 focus on the fourth
  • 3 structures: 2 focus on one target, 2 on another, one on the third target.
  • 2 structures: 3 focus on one target, 2 focus on another
  • 1 structure: All 5 target the enemy structure

So, in short, yes, sort of. :P   I'd request you made a note of my suggestion, if it's not too much to ask. :blush:

Change armor type?  Nah.  Though I'm curious what it is currently (as well as the Sivuskras and Ogrov's).

Increase Shields?  Leave 'em as is, I feel.

Reply #522 Top

Assault cruisers (ogrov/adju) have light armor. If I'm not mistaken, Ruiners are support cruisers (heavy armor), please correct me if I'm wrong.

Reply #523 Top

Ah, thanks muchly, Dargoon.  Now I have to update ze wiki.

Reply #524 Top

Change armor type? Nah. Though I'm curious what it is currently (as well as the Sivuskras and Ogrov's).

Ogrovs and Starfish have light armour. This is bad because fighters counter them. They have the same role and the same counter as bombers which makes assualt cruisers obsolete. They are destroyed too easily. Flak may counter SC very well, but with a change to carriers this will also change.

Reply #525 Top
Yay to reduce supply cost of Adjudicator.