Wagnard Wagnard

My personal think about the Rook. (gameplay hint !! to beat Wagnard )

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My personal think about the Rook. (gameplay hint !! to beat Wagnard )

from Demigod Forums

Ok.

1- Many people think rook is O.P

I d'ont think this is true. Is a little bit too powerful now with a 2100 Hammer damage. (should be 1800 imo).

Also there is a radius bug with the hammer. at this distance normally (lets say "I" is a player ) I  :banhammer: the player should not receive the full domage. PLayer should only receive the 800DMG instead of the 2100.

Another way to evade the hammer and I dont see people doing it while its the best way to avoid damage is to run straight at the rook. There is no radius bug with this so when running at the rook or a little higher than the hammer or lower (just don't be under it) you wont receive full damage. Escaping is the easiest way for a rook to have a successful 100% damage hit with the hammer (unless you have been stun by the boulder far far away but since there is a radius bug its better to avoid running away in straight line.

2- PLEASE PLEASE don't get yourself voluntary directly under my hammer PLEASE!!! I'm laughing at this every time and then the player say OMG so O.P

Come-on !! manage your character movement correctly.

3- Calculate my cold-down. once you can do that, you can predict when I'm gonna launch a boulder. when you think its about time I lunch one, walk over me. Since the boulder work on a direction, it will be hard for me to lunch and I will have high chances to fail.

If you can successfully follow this, youll see rook is not that much O.P anymore.

4- Laggy player have high chance for killing me. I can't tolerate lag  I play all bad when it's laggy

so for GpG, they just need to correct hammer radius and lower a bit the hammer damage and all will be perfect imo.

Feel free to comment friendly (I may be wrong about Rook not being O.P) so feel free to tell me in a polite way.

Have fun killing me :)

 

demigod
143,562 views 80 replies
Reply #26 from Demigod Forums Top

Rook is OP

get some boots of speed + wand of speed and you'll catch up to practically any1. (Also there's a favor item that i use that increases speed if you want to count that)

 

Just because its theoretically possible to dodge the boulder doesn't mean you will. Most of the time someone is playing offensive, I TP in, stun them, Drop the hammer and then (if they're not dead) hit wand of speed and chase them down.

 

I also straight up lol at unclean beasts who try to take me. Haven't seen one yet that can even legitamately match up against me.

 

Random guy hit it right on the head (If you're willing to read his text block).

Rook is OP

Reply #27 from Demigod Forums Top

Accidently posted again =O

Sins of a Solar Empire: Rebellion
Reply #28 from Demigod Forums Top

DO you guys know what O.P mean?  Its meean it is Highly / stupidly unbalanced. Rook is not at this point. Is a bit more powerfull than other demigods and have a bug that is helping him. So is not that O.P

O.p for me mean is unkillable enven when controlled by a noob. And thats is not the case! I can take UB and kill other people using rooks online so thats why I laught at people saying Rook is O.P

Hes just the more powerfull demigod for now with a little bug thats help him.

ANd Im sure a verry good regulus player (who know a little bit how to dodge and not getting himseft voluntary under the hammer) can kill him easy because he's ranged.

Reply #29 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Wagnard, reply 3
DO you guys know what O.P mean?  Its meean it is Highly / stupidly unbalanced. Rook is not at this point. Is a bit more powerfull than other demigods and have a bug that is helping him. So is not that O.P

O.p for me mean is unkillable enven when controlled by a noob. And thats is not the case! I can take UB and kill other people using rooks online so thats why I laught at people saying Rook is O.P

Hes just the more powerfull demigod for now with a little bug thats help him.

ANd Im sure a verry good regulus player (who know a little bit how to dodge and not getting himseft voluntary under the hammer) can kill him easy because he's ranged.

I disagree. OP just means overpowered; I think the word that fits your definition is broken, but you're right; I don't think that Rook is broken at all.

But Rook is overpowered, in his way; he DOES deal too much damage, he IS too fast, and some of his abilities DO need a tweak or two.

Reply #30 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Ultimeh, reply 25

Quoting Wagnard, reply 8


Quoting HorseRadish,
reply 6
We just need some items to counter it better I think it is fine just make other player buy an item to counter


Thats what I think but someone named UltimeH told me he doesnt want to buy an item to counter another demigod if the other demigod did not needed an item to counter him. Personally this Is stupid imo. But he said Im a noob and have experience in rpg... what a retarded teen lol(hes my brother btw).

 

rook is OP, even if its due to a bug

fixing the hammer issue + less hp and less hammer dmg would do the trick

and dont call other people retarded when you are clueless about basic knowledge

think abotu it : 1v1 player A and B, they fight, but cuz of balance, player A  cant win VS B and is forced to fall back or dying, in the end giving him way less money and EXP, so, player A only choice is to use his inexistent money to buy an expensive item to counter the other player.

even at this point player B  have a massive advantage all the way, because even if player A get the item, player B have more money and more level to counter it in the end. and also, he could easely buy other an item to counter player A after if needed

your logic is flawed , or maybe you are too dense to realize the basics about balance

anyway....

with his current state, any player that can understand the rook mechanic and come out with a decent build will be godly

 

Demigod is not a 1v1 game. Especially when you are playing a general like you are.... I saw you playing like an assasin with it. But I heard you are changing play style soo it may come good in the end.

 

Reply #33 from Demigod Forums Top

Hey everyone Flurus (regulus) was able to kill my rook. How can that be?? Im I not supposed to be O.P ???? so for now Regulus is O.P lol muahahah!

 

Reply #34 from Demigod Forums Top

I think alot of the issue is that people have had these legendary experiences with Rook.  I had one game where a level 15 Rook was able to hold one of our portals against my Reg and my ally's QoT for a ridiculously long time.  Two of us at our crystal couldn't beat off one Rook, and if we weren't careful he'd kill us.  At our crystal.  We ended up winning that game, but it still leaves a lasting impression...

Rook is not broken.  His speed needs a very small nerf.  His health might need a small nerf, and you can bump hammerslam down to 1800 dmg.  Increase viability of towerbuild.  Make trebuchet worth getting.  There, Rook is fine now. 

I'm not surprised that Regulus beat Rook 1 v 1, and I'm guessing there was alot of double-sniping from the crystal ^^

Reply #35 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Ke5trel, reply 9
I'm not surprised that Regulus beat Rook 1 v 1, and I'm guessing there was alot of double-sniping from the crystal ^^

No staff of renewal used, I play minecity..... but he lost by stategie manly

Reply #36 from Demigod Forums Top

Well my lasting impression was when I was sedna, and I couldn't get with 2 feet of my troops without having Rook slap me to death and maybe boulder roll me when I was in mid spell. Than hammer slam and bam I'm dead. 2 fricking hits to kill me. It made me afraid to do a spell around him, and since he'd win in a 1v1. I stayed away from me. When me and two of my allies tried to kill a Rook like 2 levels above us and he killed 2 of us than tele'd out. Never have I ever seen any other Dg come even remotely doing that good. It was a massacer. With like 7000 health we couldn't kill him before he killed all of us.

Reply #37 from Demigod Forums Top

Well several people are saying he's not op then somwhere else in their same post they are giving a list of small nerfs :rolleyes:

I don't think any DG needs a dramatic buff/nerf, apart from generals with their minions.

Reply #38 from Demigod Forums Top

Totally agree with Ke5trel for the rook balance. Thoses number seem quite good.

Lets forget this O.P word and all just say hes a bit too strong.

Problem solved.

 

p.s I also think regulus mines are a little bit too strong too O:)

Reply #39 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Wagnard, reply 13


p.s I also think regulus mines are a little bit too strong too

 

My thoughts on this are simple; if you can see them (and use a ranged attack on them) you should be able to kill them.

Any AoE/ranged attack should be able to do this; boulder roll, Rook's Hammer radius, QoT's thorns...

 

That would help muchly.

Reply #40 from Demigod Forums Top

They were a trick on beta 2 to shoot on regulus mine, didnt try on this beta yet

Reply #41 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting TerroR878, reply 12
Well several people are saying he's not op then somwhere else in their same post they are giving a list of small nerfs

I don't thinks any DG needs a dramatic buff/nerf, apart from generals with their minions.

I disagree that generals are tend to be weak. I think that assassins are more powerfull in the begin of the game, but the generals are more powerfull in the end of the game. Just because a general can't take an assassin in the begin of the game, does not mean he is underpowered. You have to look to the bigger picture. If you have a Sedna with 8 yeti's, 4 minotaurs, 4 siege archers, 4 monks (army of 20!) the whole situation changes. You can even buy much better minions. I think you (can) become stronger than an assassin. Yes even Oak and QOT! You can very easy cap a flag and attack during the same time with a general. That is a BIG advantage.  Generals tend to be a little bit harder to play. But in the hands of a good player, they stand very strong.

To be honest, I think that most demigods are pretty good and pretty balanced. Maybe with some minor tweaks here and there. I agree with Wagner that the Hammer skill should be nerfed a little bit in damage.

Reply #42 from Demigod Forums Top

I just lost a game where I was a Rook with Staff of Renewal and so was my opponent, Wagnard.  Therefore it seems clear to me that neither Rook nor Staff of Renewal are OP :')

Reply #43 from Stardock Forums Top

Quoting Random_Guy, reply 14
I have been aware of running between the Rook's legs ever since the Nightmares did it to me a while ago.  In both the Boulder Roll and the Hammer Slam, technically the best place to be is right on top of the Rook as both attacks are directional.  However, the problem with this is that the Rook generally wins a slap fight.  If he had lower base attack, then running around his legs would be a viable option.  Unfortunately, you're bound to lose a fight at point blank range simply because he hits harder and has more health.  Plus, he's probably going to hit more frequently if you are focusing on trying to run aorund.  (Don't get me wrong.  He's a giant walking castle.  He's supposed to win slap fights.)

How exactly would I "manage the character's movement correctly"?  It would make sense if he was slower, but currently the Rook is just as fast as any other Demigod.  Managing my character correctly would make sense if there was some way to keep my distance from you.  Unfortunately, you can run just as fast as I can.  Most Rooks that I've played put money into speed items so they run faster (or force you to buy speed items).  It is fairly hard to keep your distance from something just as fast if not faster than you are.  And what exactly are you supposed to do if you are a melee Demigod?  You have to approach the Rook.  How do you not end up dead?  Maybe if you could effectively run away it wouldn't be such an issue, but the Rook is good at chasing people in this beta.

I don't think the Hammer is OP thanks to the slow start up time (minus the Radius Bug, which really screws with a guy).  Heck, even I can dodge a Hammer (now that I've discovered to not run directly away).  However, he can charge up to you and slap fight.  Even without the Hammer, he wins.

Just because it is "possible" to dodge the Boulder doesn't mean that it is balanced.  I mean, you could infinately stall a Mavor in Vanilla SupCom by manually switching shields on and off to absorb the hits, but that didn't make it worthless as a game ender.  The Boulder would be perfectly fine if it didn't stun you for long enough to be Hammered.  However, between the Boulder damage and the Hammer damage, you start getting close to 3000 hp being taken away by a long range projectile with a fairly high movement speed and minimal start up time that can be spammed every 10 seconds.  Sure, its possible to dodge, but like the Mavor in Vanilla SupCom, that doesn't make it any less deadly.  The only difference is that the Mavor was a rare game ender, the Boulder is a way of life.

You say the Boulder Slam it isn't a combo, but I can't think of a faster way to dodge something than by activating the Oak's Shield.  I recently played a match as Oak vs. Rook where I was the Oak.  I occasionally managed to Shield at the absolute last second out of low level Boulder Rolls before he brought down the hammer.  Without the Shield, even at moderate range there is no forseeable way you could dodge the second half of the Boulder Slam.  Once the Rook Roll is at max level, then the stun is plenty long enough to hit from max range, stroll in, and slam.  Again, maybe if the Rook was slower then it wouldn't be so much of an issue.  Nothing is preventing you from Wand of Speeding in after Bouldering, which may have been what this guy was doing to me.

I hope you don't take this as a whining post, as I did not intend it to be that way.  I would appreciate it if you came in and addressed the points I have brought up.  I don't play Rook as he is definately OP, although the degree to which he is may be somewhat debatable.  I would like to hear what a Rook player, heck, the best Rook player has to say about them.  I think, at the bare minimum, his speed should be reduced and the cooldown for the Boulder should be increased to 15-20 seconds.  If the speed is reduced enough, then the stun on the Boulder would be OK as he would mostly be closing the distance.

EDIT:  Oh, and the Hammer Radius Bug could definately use fixing.


Nobody has offered any valuable advice against this information and it's pretty much the central factor. I don't care that rook has a lot of health, nor do I care that he's very fast. I care that a good rook player vs any other good melee player, 1v1, can keep the non-rook at distance for as long as he wants. He can cap any flag and make any foward movement he wants because you simply cannot approach him without being nailed by high damage base slap, or getting boulder'd at moderate range.

Reply #44 from Demigod Forums Top

I'm with u Rasgriz. yes u can dodge boulder roll but with no other DG do u have to do that much to survive, and even without roll he wins.

great reply random guy.

Reply #45 from Demigod Forums Top

I think Rook can be a tiny bit OP. I think any Demigod that can kill a Demigod in one hit (Hammer Slam...which can be easily used if a boulder stun hits them...and the boulder is not that easy to dodge at times) is probably too OP. OP = Over Powered, and I think Rooks Power can be over the top compared to other Demigods at tunes,

However, he maybe just needs a small nerf like not being able to get 8k hp in a match and hammer slam doing 1.8k damage or so like kestrel mentioned somewhere. Then its fine :) I dont want rook being too nerfed down, or he will be useless to play with.

As do other skills like snipes cooldown...should be about 15 seconds imo.

Reply #46 from Demigod Forums Top

I agree with some nerfs like less damage for hammer slam, less, health and slower. I say slower because if u go back to the original idea he was supposed to be this slowly walking castle than can put out massive damage and is a great seiger. Right now he's just as fast as everyone which I think is a funny sight watching Rook run. Oh and hammer slam bug fixed.

Reply #47 from Demigod Forums Top

Wagnard thinks rook isn't OP because hes having to much fun raping everyone with hammer slam. Play another demigod besides regulus against a decent rook player and come back with your thoughts Wagnard. I am not trying to be an ass but if you haven't played somebody thats a decent rook player with Unclean beast, oak, sedna, QoT then you don't understand how OP rook is.

Reply #48 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Soccer194, reply 11
Well my lasting impression was when I was sedna, and I couldn't get with 2 feet of my troops without having Rook slap me to death and maybe boulder roll me when I was in mid spell. Than hammer slam and bam I'm dead. 2 fricking hits to kill me. It made me afraid to do a spell around him, and since he'd win in a 1v1. I stayed away from me. When me and two of my allies tried to kill a Rook like 2 levels above us and he killed 2 of us than tele'd out. Never have I ever seen any other Dg come even remotely doing that good. It was a massacer. With like 7000 health we couldn't kill him before he killed all of us.

sedna have HUGE problems to fight rook,

actually, you cant even get close or you die

main problem is... its nearly impossible to dodge the boulder, when you try to evade and move left/right, your body is longer with a long tail, so its come close to the tail and you get stun,

same problem with the hammer, your tail is a problem, even if you run inside the rook, your tail will most likely kill you

your only option is the AoE silence to prolong the inevitable, your death

also, if bounce interupt was working, ist may help, but still , its not possible to damage him alot whiel timing your skills to counter him

also, our hp is so low early, when he can stun with some decent hammer upgrade, he can truly stun/hamme kill 1 shot at some point

and if he have the staff of renewal, well leave the game lol

Reply #49 from Demigod Forums Top

Quoting Cowbuttzex, reply 22
Wagnard thinks rook isn't OP because hes having to much fun raping everyone with hammer slam. Play another demigod besides regulus against a decent rook player and come back with your thoughts Wagnard. I am not trying to be an ass but if you haven't played somebody thats a decent rook player with Unclean beast, oak, sedna, QoT then you don't understand how OP rook is.

well wagnard first was mainly usign rook in the first beta,

then, a some beta update rook got way weaker, so he took the beast in the previous beta because its was easy to 1 shot peopel with the dmg buff and artifact

now, beast seem to be lower again, and rook OP, so taken rook again

go figures :P 

of course hes a good rook, no doubt, since he play it alot. when a player is good as his class and understand how its work, and its tend to be more powerfull than others, now its becoming OP

thats all

and wagnard, we dont care about what you think OP mean for you.

OP mean 1 thign only, Overpower, thta mean sighlty stronger to unkillable, its dont only mean stronger to the max

learn the terms plz

and remember the fire mage last update? i was raping face with you and you called it OP when i was playing it, while alot of other people would be "ordinary" at it

but ,even is my fire mage was a bit OP, flurus regulus would kill me 1v1

the same thing apply to your match with flurus here, reg vs rook

OP aint only in 1v1, its OVERALL we are talkign about

Reply #50 from Demigod Forums Top

I dont play with the O.P character. Rook was totally useless in the end of beta1 NO ONE was playing with him.

I play with he character gaming style I prefert the most.

 

BTW almost all people play ordinary (like you said with the mage) with the rook.