We are learning more about Gaza from non-Hamas sources now...

from JoeUser Forums

What really is behind the numbers reported on the number of civilian casualties in the Gaza Strip? Italian newspaper Corriere Della Sera reported Thursday that a doctor working in Gaza's Shifa Hospital claimed that Hamas  has intentionally inflated the number of casualties resulting from Israel's Operation Cast Lead.

"The number of deceased stands at no more than 500 to 600. Most of them are youths between the ages of 17 to 23 who were recruited to the ranks of Hamas, who sent them to the slaughter," according to the newspaper article.

[...]

A Tal al-Hawa resident told the newspaper's reporter, "Armed Hamas men sought out a good position for provoking the Israelis. There were mostly teenagers, aged 16 or 17, and armed. They couldn't do a thing against a tank or a jet. They knew they are much weaker, but they fired at our houses so that they could blame Israel for war crimes."

The reporter for the Italian newspaper also quoted reporters in the Strip who told of Hamas' exaggerated figures, "We have already said to Hamas commanders – why do you insist on inflating the number of victims?"

These same reporters mentioned that the truth that will come out is likely to be similar to what occurred in Operation Defensive Shield in Jenin. "Then, there was first talk of 1,500 deaths. But then it turned out that there were only 54, 45 of which were armed men," the Palestinian reporters told the Italian newspaper.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3660423,00.html

 

I don't know how many people died in Gaza, or how many of them were civilians. I did know that all the news from Gaza came from Hamas via the mainstream media and very quickly found many Israeli and Arab (Fatah/PLO) sources that contradicted what Hamas told everyone.

The 1200 deaths reported could well be true, as could the 600 deaths reported by others.

Personally, I wish to thank those who didn't believe what they were told from the beginning and those who believed it and have come to doubt it after being presented with reports from other sources. It is you both who give hope for peace.

To those among the mainstream media who reported lies for profit or ideology, there is nothing I can say that you haven't already heard and ignored. A journalist's point of view is also his point of sale. I know that.

And to those who believed the numbers and not only believed that it was obviously Israel who was to blame AND that defending Israel against such accusations constitutes calling every criticism of Israel "anti-Semitism", to those I can only say, Go To Hell!

And don't come back.

 

2,617 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from Stardock Forums Top

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Reply #2 from Stardock Forums Top

There is one thing I will never understand about peoples complains about the Media. On the one hand those who believed what the Media said about the thousands of deaths will claim "that's what the Media said, must be true" are the same people who will later say "it's the Media, they will say what they want to make money, can't trust them" when the same story contradicts what they believe.

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Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top

There is one thing I will never understand about peoples complains about the Media. On the one hand those who believed what the Media said about the thousands of deaths will claim "that's what the Media said, must be true" are the same people who will later say "it's the Media, they will say what they want to make money, can't trust them" when the same story contradicts what they believe.

End of quote

They are the same people? Really?

There are ways to judge the validity of stories based on one's own experiences and what the story says.

Incidentally, my point here is that different sources give different numbers and that one of the sources was accepted as factual by the majority of journalists who reported that one view as fact while it reported other views as mere statements or claims (or failed to mention them at all).

 

Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top

And to those who believed the numbers and not only believed that it was obviously Israel who was to blame AND that defending Israel against such accusations constitutes calling every criticism of Israel "anti-Semitism", to those I can only say, Go To Hell!

And don't come back.
End of quote

Oh Leauki,

At it again I see!

Don't worry, one day you will see the error of your ways and when you do, I will be there to accept your apology!

:)

Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top

Don't worry, one day you will see the error of your ways and when you do, I will be there to accept your apology!

End of quote

My apology for what?

I realise that there is a world out there who expect me to blame Israel and the Jews for every ill in the world, and to believe whatever lie is told about them. And I am sure many regard it as an "error" for me not to join the "Death to the Jews" crowd.

But I'd rather be wrong than be one of that crowd.

 

Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top

Being an American, I sometimes fail to see through the eyes of others.  I look at what is being reported in America, and assume that is what is going on all over the world.  Happily, I see that there are some out there that are not so prejudicial and ignorant, and do want to look behind the propaganda that is spewed by the hate mongers of the world and look for truth.  I know that will not happen with the MSM here in the states, but the internet has afforded us a rare opportunity to find other sources of news that bypasses what essentially is the propaganda wing of the DNC here in the states.

Thanks for sharing.  But understand.  Those that do not want to believe the truth, will continue to use the propaganda rags to verify their own hate and bigotry.

Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top

Thanks for sharing.  But understand.  Those that do not want to believe the truth, will continue to use the propaganda rags to verify their own hate and bigotry.

End of quote

It's the patronising attutide that gets me.

The less someone knows about the subject, the more they are interested in teaching me the "truth". The "truth" seems to be a platonic ideal hovering over and outside the real world.

 

Happily, I see that there are some out there that are not so prejudicial and ignorant, and do want to look behind the propaganda that is spewed by the hate mongers of the world and look for truth.

End of quote

The big moment for me was when I decided to ignore what the mass media told me about Iraq and go and see for myself.

 

Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top

It's the patronising attutide that gets me.
End of quote

It goes to what I have noticed of late (it could have been going on longer, just not noticed).  If you spout the liberal line,you are somehow a genius.  No other qualifications are necessary.  If you disagree with it, then you are a moron or bumbling fool.

I heard it here at JU.  Talking about Bush's misstatements and how Obama never makes them. Obama does not - when reading from a teleprompter, but sure does if he does not have a prepared text.  And we heard the same about Clinton as well.

None of them were any smarter than bush, it was just the people pushing this myth that wanted to think it, so that is all they heard and stated as fact.