I told him to take a look at it. That means research should be done before buying. It wasn't as a Doctor, medical advice nor "Hey you better do this...". It was also part of an effort to allay his fears...look at everything I wrote, warreni.

This is really OT...if he weren't so concerned I wouldn't have posted it along with why I didn't think his financial info was "out there" in cyberspace.

At the risk of criticism from some, I would like to see the gallery standards back to where they were a few years ago, I think it directly reflects the quality of the site, SD and it's software and is the area that fuels desire for Stardock's customization tools.

I remember when I first visted, I was blown away by the quality of skins available. WC had the rep of having the best skins, was difficult to even get approved for the galleries.

First impressions are everything and knowing it is the skins that sell the software I would want to deliver a knockout punch in the galleries.

 

The old 'less is more' premise.

 

my 2c

*cliche disclaimer#

Oh, and another thing... regarding that misconception/fallacy... um. ludicrous suggestion....

A major Oz law firm an acquaintance of mine works for just swapped out 2500 + Macs for Pc's loaded with Vista.

Apparently it is NOT an isolated case...

As far as I am concerned, go Stardock!  I would love to see a new site under Stardock control. 

Everyone might want to continue the discussion here:

 

https://forums.wincustomize.com/?postid=335824

Every medical transcription company I have worked for (4 services, and 4 hospitals) has required PC -- the software doesn't run on Mac.  Even if it did...Windowblinds doesn't work on Macs...why would I want to be a slave to that ugliness without the freedom to change it?

to my knowledge and observations the only gallery that has ever been subject to quality standards is the wallpaper gallery. What HAS changed with the skins is the dedication that used to be put in by skinners seems to have not carried on to quite a few of this new wave of skinners. very few go that extra mile anymore like you and Night Train to name a couple.

Should WC turn to a marketing driven, corporate entity then I would think some better standards should be in order.

Don't confuse the Mac OS with the Mac computer. Any Intel Mac will run Windows and therefore any Windows applications including Windowblinds.

Can you qualify what you mean by this (dedication)?  I'm new at skinning, I'm sitting on one WB, tweaking it and working on accessories, because I'd like to put it out as a suite, and in the middle of another that may taking a little longer because I plan on adding substyles, one masculine and one feminine, due to the thread about somebody's desire for more feminine skins.  I'm interested in knowing what your idea of dedication and going the extra mile are.

Thanks for clarification.  I didn't know that.

I certainly try to clarify it in the best way I know how.

It just seems like with many skins the designer does not take the time to look at the small details, serveral times to make sure it is the best that they can do. They seem rushed. One good example (for me at least) is when I see the All Programs mouse over be just a new color instead of a class act image. So many possibilities exist with that section that can really enhance the theme. You might also see blurry edges or parts that just .. feel rushed. I think people get so excited that they are nearing completion of a windowblind that they put it out without going back and really going over it with a fine tooth comb.

Phoon is right in this. I have taken a few apart (no, I won't say which) and I see exactly what he does. There's no argument about this at all.

I was wondering when someone would say it, though. I am not a skinner and something in me says, "You don't have a right to criticise since you haven't skinned yourself. You don't know what pressures the other person is under."

I am also aware that being a 'Purist' doesn't endear one with others....especially when one hasn't skinned.

I don't know how to do that.  I don't know where to LOOK to find out how to do that.  As someone who is trying to create my own Windowblinds, I can tell you, the instructions/skills on how to go about these little details you're talking about are about as easy to acquire as it is for an average person to get into a Masonic lodge! (you have to know somebody whose already in it, they have to invite you, you have to ASK them about it first repetitively....) I've dissected a lot of skins just to get where I'm at right now, and somethings just aren't obvious, even after scouring the entire WBA file!  I've posted in a thread about 4 months ago, that I would pay up to $50 for a Windowblind Skinning Bible...something that would go through the entire program and describe how to do every little thing, with pictures and examples.  It's like asking someone to invent the Holy Grail.

I've posted my Mardi Gras Windowblind a couple of times in the previews thread, asking for the type of details you're describing...someone to point out the bugs, and I've got a little bit of help, but as a new skinner, I can tell you, if you're a beginning skinner, you don't possess the skills to KNOW what the fine tooth comb would pull out.  I've had two people help, one really, the other to just say "you have a problem here" but not how to correct the problem.

It seems to me that what you're asking is that EVERY skin in the gallery be created by a master skinner!  I haven't even made it to apprentice...how am I expected to have master skills, especially since there aren't a lot of masters willing to take the time out to help someone who isn't even an apprentice...is basically just, as the bikers call them, "a prospect."  And why should they...a prospect could just be someone who is trying their hand at skinning and doesn't have the drive to keep it up...putting time into a noob is wasted if they're just going to try it once and bail.

Just because a skin isn't master level, doesn't mean it's worthless.  I've taken a few 2-star Windowblinds and doctored them up for my own personal use (played Dr. Frankenstein and put a few dead parts on other dead parts, added some electricity and IT'S ALIVE!!)

I think you're being harsh on the "new wave of skinners" since what you're really asking is that Prospects and apprentices be masters before they can upload.  That's not fair.

Phoon, I understand what you are saying but the all programs mouseover might be a bad one to use as example. A master skin has to work flawlessly on all systems. There is a language and settings issue with the all progrmas area that sort of pins a master skin into having to be that mouseover instead of an image. Otherwise it will be screwed up on some systems. All I am saying is on this one, it's not really laziness but handcuffed.

 

 

perhaps the all programs mouseover is a bad example indeed.

k10w3, there's no harsh about it if you don't blow it out of proportion of what I said. I never said the skin should be perfect, not once. I said that people need to take the time, look at it, look at it again and again before submitting. Give them the extra mile and not just submit them out of restlessness or glory seeking. The fine detailed second look will always show and will give the creator a true sense of earned accomplishment.

Once again, if the site goes corporate and marketing driven I can see the bar being raised and subject other categories to marketing's approval. It won't be a community driven site but rather a place where the community gives stardock free marketing content.

 

 

If you are saying that skins will be gone over with an electron microscope, then there goes my skinning career...lol. I'll never get approved. I don't really think of myself as a skinner. More of a modder.

Who knows PDJ, who knows. It makes sense if it's marketing/corporate driven. Every marketing department I know wants content that sells the product. If you have less than desirable content then it is counter productive to that purpose.

Only time will tell. I may be wrong but I don't see as strong of a "community" as it has been in the past.

There are other community driven sites out there that would be a great avenue for submission as well.

Skinartistry and Skinning.net are 2 great examples.

Submitting them is the only way to get a lot of advice, and then the advice can be taken and the skin resubmitted as an update.  I don't think anybody submits for glory...time and time again it's been stressed here by those with experience -- SKIN FOR YOUR OWN PERSONAL SATISFACTION...anything else is going to result in disappointment.

Also, the community IS the customer, and therefore if the site goes corporate, it makes good business sense to keep the customer satisfied.  If all one wants are master-level skins, then MyColors would be a good way to go, in which you have the top notch skins and the program that installs the whole works in one easy to use program.  Contrasting would be Windowblinds with the use of Skin Studio, where the customer gets skins, PLUS the program to create skins, PLUS the community site where that customer can get help in creating their own skins (for their own use, and uploaded for advice and sharing in case somebody else wants to do something with that skin).  

I upload for the same reason I'm a member of Freecycle.  I believe in the concept of sharing; its a "I got some use out of this thing...maybe you could, too," sort of mentality.  That, and I value any input I get after my skins are uploaded.  Matter of fact, I think my greatest accomplishment was a wall I did of my dog at Christmas, which never made it to the galleries.  The fact that it got 3 downloads without being made public is personally very rewarding to me.

I have work at both SDN and Deviant Art. And am starting my own site, but it will never be like this, in any stretch of imagination. WC is and will always be the best, IMO. I hope it don't let me down.

The community is existing customers, not NEW customers. The community knows the value of the software and does not need much marketing to re-up. The potential new customers do not.

That all depends on whether your a new skinner or a coorporation wanting to promote a product.

To me it is an incentive for a new skinner to get better, to know that they can't just throw any half finished, lazy looking skin up.

I spent 9 months on my first skin, and even though, looking back, it could have been better, it certainly wasnt from lack of effort or cutting corners. Now those were personal standards that I worked by and still do...but... they have served me well along the way.

I'm not saying everyone should tackle skinning with such intensity but I do believe that higher standards should be met to deserve being posted for public consumption , considering it is the quality of the skins that drive the sales, or lack thereof of the software\ company.

To me, it should be earned, thats all I'm saying. Call me old fashioned. I just know that human nature for the most part says.. if someone can get away with doing less.. they typically will.. Maybe I'm cynical.... there are exceptions to this of course.

 

 

I have to agree. When others who aren't too familiar with Windowblinds, one of the first things they say is "zomg all those skins are hideous!" and that's not exactly untrue. I think the Windowvblinds gallery should be moderated/sorted like the wallpapers gallery is. Especially since the site will be driven from a more marketing standpoint, it should be important to display the quality stuff first, enticing people into trying the product and not giving up and walking away after looking through page after page of blah/rushed skins. It's just like having good curb appeal when trying to sell a house. If it looks like rundown overgrown shit outside, no one will want to go inside and check it out.

I see where k10w3 is coming from; we should be careful not to discourage newbies altogether. It is hard enough for a newbie to learn to use the programs well enough to put out high-quality stuff. There are only 8 basic WB tuts on the wiki (if I used the program I'd help, but I've got my hands full making DX tuts, atm.) I'd have thought, with WB being one of the more popular programs, there would be a flood of tips, tricks, and tuts.

It takes talent to make great stuff. Failing a crapload of that, it takes A LOT of trial and error (more like error and frustration.) I say again, the lack of quality content is a result of The Lack of Learning Resources.

BUT I do see the need to promote and showcase the high-quality stuff (the DX gallery seriously needs this, IMO.) It gives the newbies something to shoot for. Mind you, it isn't enough just to give them something to shoot for; you have to show them how to go about reaching their goals (Learning Resources!)

Maybe someone could clearly define what 'standards' we're talking about. Are we talking about standards to get accepted--period--or standards to be displayed in the public galleries, much like wallpapers? (Might also want to post that clarification/ideas on this thread.)

IMO, it would be sufficient to have the highly rated skins (or moderator picks) 'pinned' to the top of each gallery page. (Kinda like the featured stuff on the Main Page) So when a user goes looking, the first thing they'll see are high-q skins and then the new stuff can be browsed below that.

Agreed.

Perhaps two blinds galleries.....Journeyman and Master.......and Master Apprentice and below...so that people can still get their blinds out there for critiquing...and feedback necessary for improvement....