All things considered, I think it's reasonable to limit access to content for your game to people who purchased it straight from you.

The boxed version of the game is still the game you can play on your own. The patches and online component of the game is content that I think is a good reward for buying the game from the company.

I like Stardocks solution to all this. I enjoy playing games online and I love developers continuing to improve their games after release. In order for this thing to happen someone needs to pay the bills, they need to encourage people to buy new copies of their games.

I agree with you on this point, well I pretty much said why already. My friend having bought the game cannot update her game simply because she has no net access, having an unrestricted patch will solve this, or at least have a separate download linked to your account, that way she can go into the downloads section and download it at work.

You know a simpler way of saying this is "the patch will be released anyway to support consumers so it should be freely open".

True to an extent but it depends what it is. I think that movies and games a different due to the sheer expenses that are involved in both of them, movies don't have it so bad however due to cinema releases. If games had a "cinema" moment before release then second hand releases wouldn't be much of a problem. I do admit that I myself buy second hand games, but not so much nowadays as I'm no longer a pimply faced youth.

I feel that they should not have to even label it that way. For any corporation, when you buy anything it's to that consumer only, they have no warrant to think about the second hand market. If people sell them second hand then you should complain to them.

Other than the updates, I think it's perfectly acceptable that those that did not buy the game first hand should have teh ability to play the game online unless the serial is transferred by the previous owner after paying a small nominal fee. When I bought X2 for second hand I was not able to download a "no CD" crack from their website as my serial was obviously taken. After emailing their support they moved the serial to my account so that I could, however they mentioned that they normally do not do this, but in my circuimstance they gave me the benefit of a doubt.

I do like to ask you one thing though, do you have any other vocabulary than the word "fuck" in it? Swearing so much isn't going to help your cause and only makes you come across arrogantly.

 For example a few years back buying some used PS2 games seems to save me a few dollars even though some had a few stratches. (I try to take very good care of my disc) Now that my PS2 has a lot of age I often have trouble loading some of those disc.

 Since a lot of online PC games use keys it's wise not to buy used PC games especially when it comes to multiplayer games like Sins.

Wow, I know there's a fetish for everything, but you sir are quite the unqiue little snowflake!

*

I go to a book store to buy a used book.  I get home, start reading through it, only to my dismay I find that the last 10 pages of the book have been ripped out by the previous owner.  Should I:

1. Write the author a very angry letter, yelling profanity at him because it's all his fault the last 10 pages are gone.

2. Go to the Publisher of the book, and yell and scream and even thump my heels on the ground just to show how enraged I am that the publisher is at fault for not giving me the last 10 pages.

3. Go to the used book store and say "Hey, man, I bought this book only to find out it's missing the last 10 pages."

It's like a choose your own adventure!  We all know what route you took, though.

I hate you are disappointed but next time if you can, try buying the game straight from Stardock who goes clearly the extra mile when it comes to game support. Obviously you see this free updates as of great value which as do I.

First, apologies for cross-posting, but no one has answered my simple question from a different thread:

I must say, I don't resell games myself, so I'm curious what it means/signifies when someone decides to resell a game.

Does it mean that he or she was disappointed in the game (it did not meet their expectations), or that he or she has gotten bored with it and does not want to play it - ever again? Or something else?

Getting a patch IS support. When you go to Microsoft to download a patch, you go to support.microsoft.com don't you?

Furthermore, if you had a way to give up the serial no from your Impulse account, then and only then would it be selling your game away second hand.. The CD and Manual is not really the thing you should be buying/selling second hand - it's the Serial!

"It's the Serial, Stupid!"

It means exactly what a sale would mean in any other setting - the seller values X amount of money more than they value the product in their hand.

In the case of games, yes.  It could be any of the above.  Or perhaps the person in question is simply strapped for cash.  There's nothing particularly enigmatic about it.

In the case of PC games, I'm not going to approach this powder keg but in general... well, buyer beware.  There are risks that come with buying anything second-hand and in many cases, developers and manufacturers have very little real incentive to support the practice (where software is concerned, the incentive is almost entirely against). 

So does everyone else in the software industry.

*shrug* Consumers who purchased a software license from Ironclad haven't been damned at all. 

Wait a minute. Now I remember. Epiclulz... This is the same person that complained some time ago about there not being stand alone patches for the game up to v1.1. Many of the arguments are the same. The language and tone is still the same. That would mean that you did in fact not BUY the game recently. You sir are a pirate, a thief and a liar.

You are mistaken if you think people are that stupid. You could have changed your nic, that would have at least helped. Im sure one of the stardock guys can check back in the forum history and find those rants. 

You are the kind of person that makes this world just a little less wonderfull. What goes around, comes around. You will still get what you deserve one day and on that day you will probably still think "how come this is happening to me".... only in the back of your mind you will have this small spark of a memory and you will wake up. 2 L8 4 u 2 repent u will lie in the bed u have made.

epiclulz is full of epic failure. You sir are stupid... very very stupid. Any relatively computer savy person knows to buy the license, not the data when purchasing software. data is easily replicated, its the license that makes your copy legitimate. When you bought the game second hand, you were conned by the store. They did not sell you access to the license, they just gave you data that can be replicated infinitely.

to bad you feel that way, but as you can see the ggeneral concensus is that IC/SD are doing a pretty good job and i doubt this post will have much(read none what so ever) impact on the way they do this.

If you truly feel that strongly about it i sugest you exersize your right to not buy their products from now on.

btw in 5 years (or whatever) this will size to be an issue as the hard copy's are phazed out, and we only buy online and download.

Who cares what you think, you dont care what anyone else thinks. You quote and answer badly. your post only makes sense to you. People have pretty much stopped replying to you because you have defeated most of your own points(by yourself I might add) You dont actually want or exspect any kind of response from either ironclad/stardock or the people on the forums.

This is your way of making entertainment by using the anonimety of the internet to see if you can get other people angry so that you can have a quick chuckle at their frustration. The really sad thing is that you dont know when to stop. You have lost. Nothing you could ever say (after the idiotic things you have said already) would make anybody think you have any decency. Most of these people would probably enjoy hearing about the terrible accident in wich 9 of your fingers were lost due to stupidity.

Have fun, say stupid things. Its your right as an internet user. Blog about it. nobody can stop you. Just remember that all of these things will never change the fact that you are a pathetic waste of human flesh and that you feed on the misery of others. oh yes..... and have a nice day

Insecure troller + insecure posters = flame war

All of you, grow up.  His name is 'epiclulz' for a reason, I'm sure he's gotten quite a bit of entertainment out of all your anger.  Just ignore him (yet someone will think they have a witty thing to say to him that he can't create a comeback on, than others join in) and  he'll go away.

No stress Windexglow

I actually find epic very entertaining. Not only is almost every counter"argument" made by epic badly thought out, but many of them dont even counter the point that is quoted. Its like watching a child having a temper tantrum

Whaa, I am right. Whaa, whaa whaa. everyone that doesnt agree with me is stupid. Bla Bla Bla.

All thats still left is for epic to drop to the floor and start spinning in circles while pounding fists on the floor.

Na na nana na. You cant catch me!! he he

While I completely understand and agree with Stardock's policy of providing patches for people with a serial, I do see the rather hairy problem that sometimes they're loathe to admit.

Pawning off that when buying a boxed copy all you should expect to get is a disc and cardboard seems rather silly.  Think back to every boxed copy of a PC game you've ever bought.  Did you ever legitimately believe when you brought it home from the store that you would not have access to patches that the developer produced?

Yes, the savvy will understand to never buy used PC software to avoid this issue.  What about the ignorant like parents and grandparents who see a cheaper price, or the same price with less reputable stores selling a used game as new, giving it to their family only to find out it can't be updated unlike almost any other game out there?  Sure, they're wrong and we've listed the good reasons why.  Stardock should be paid for their work and people turning around and selling their copies doesn't do that.

But when you have boxes on shelves that make no clear mention that you won't be able to patch without a unique and original serial code, isn't that just hurting your own image when people buy the game naively and encounter such frustration?  I realize this will only be among those who don't understand why buying used PC software is such a bad idea, and those that have been deceived, but I think they count for something.  Wouldn't you think there are more of them however, than those of us who have read the EULA or understand SD's dilemma in providing patches to anyone?

I've rambled too much as it is, but honestly I think this serial code issue would be handled a lot better if the game was only being sold digitally.  I believe I've read here and there that SD sells discounted serials to folks with used copies that got scammed, but I'd hope more could be done.

In summation, I don't see anything 'wrong' that Stardock is doing here, just the frustration that such a policy causes a minority of consumers and probably more than a few headaches via email and the forum here for Stardock themselves.

Epiclulz - the situation you find yourself in with a second hand game is no different to buying an OEM copy of Windows. You have no rights to support/patches and as such are required to provide your own "support" (which includes patching/upgrading).

Distriubtion method (Impulse) is in the EULA, as is the statement explaining the licence is non-transferable....

Can you stop this fcking rant? Just buy the game if you want the updates or get lost and play whatever version is on that CD; after all, we who bought the game from Stardock use a lot of bandwidth to download the updates, and bandwidth is not free... Seriously man.

From this I understand you don't know what the hell a projection is.