USSENTERNCC1701E -

I'm glad that despite the initial frustrations and profanity you found some use in Impulse.  It seems like folks get so hung up on the concept that they never give it a real, honest try.  If you're willing to stick around on these forums, I encourage you to make suggestions for improvements.  We read these forums every day and take feedback very seriously.

On the issue of piracy being theft vs not... You're moving into a gray area to try and justify obtaining something for which you did not pay and have no right to.  Put the theft argument aside entirely, it's one that never works because those who are going to pirate will find a way to justify it to themselves no matter what.  Fact is, if you pirate, you're committing a crime.  You have no reasonable right to software/games you do not pay for.  You especially have no right to access patches, multiplayer functionality, or technical support.

I think there's another way to update your game! It cost's $36,99 and is availabal by Amazon.com

 

how would i obtain this alternative way? i am legit and being that im on dial-up im hualing at 5kb down and 3k up. ( mock speed for me) i've given up on impulse for the simple reason. everytime i try and DL it i only get like 10 or 20 megs. then i get download error from impulse and get to waste another 1-3 hours of downloading for another error. i could get it all within 16 hours if Impulse would behave like a real download manger like leechget or reget.

I had the same error when downloading 1.1, "File size smaller than expected" something like that anyway, I just ran to the laundramat, had it in about 15 minutes.  The owner was ticked when he found me in the building at 1:30 though

Mabye I should put my point of view into this discussion. It is not the usual part...

I am not a Windows or MacOS user, I am a Linux and Wine user. That means I play all my games for windows using wine. Well, even the bootcamp people do use wine, even if they do not directly see it. It is in the DirectX part.

Anyway,  I did buy Sins, because it was advertised with having no copy protection. Note I siad "copy protection", not DRM. So I am one of these crank users who use strange arguments.. but in my case as a reason to actually buy the game. So when I did buy the game I expected a game you can most play on wine, because it does not use the most advanced DirectX features and has no protection system, that makes problems. What I did get was a game, that has even after 1.05 a memory whole, forcing me to restart the game all 5 minutes and a non working multiplayer option. A half finnished product. And not having copy protection was simply not true. Of course the stardock themself did not say that. I did buy the game right after the release here and that is something I will never do again. If I had waited a bit more, I would have seen the impulse program comming up, the multiplayer problems and other things.... because there was already a thread like that when the buisiness people here decided that 1.05 will be the last patch you can download without their program. What really annoyed me was to get a program that was months from being finnished.

So why not using Impuls? First simply because it does not work for me (problem with .Net). Frankly I don't care much about a 700mb download, I have this downloaded in less than 2h. And if that where an normal patch I could download it from multiple servers using the full bandwidth of my connection. And I would have to download the patch only once, because I archieve these things. The other reason I am not using Impulse is that it is a copy protection system of a bad kind. 15 yearsago we mostly had protection systems that required you to look something up in a book. Then there where systems, that required you to use a cd key to play online. Well, Impulse is of that kind, but worse. In that days you could still sell the game when you where bored, because it was only the key, not the combination of key and private data.

So for me sins might not have the cd based copy protection, but it is far from not having a copy protection. What it makes a digital right management system to me, is that you have to connect the key with private data, making it impossible for you to sell the game again.

But then again I said already I cannot use it  anyway...

I am thinking strongly about putting my game on ebay, because I don't see that in the future the game will be more playable than it is already for me (thanks to impulse) and because the original reason I buyed the game for was just an illusion. But I won't stop here. I will tell people about how stardock interprets its bill of rights for gamers. And even though Sins is exactly the genre I like to play I will most probably never buy any stardock product again. I may download the software, if it was at last two years on the market and may buy it, if it works. If it is again a half finnished product without public updates I will delete it and not buy it. Done.

I am really also playing games that are over 15 years old and I very much know, that no game is supported for that long. So there will be a day in less than 10 years, where Impuls 23 won't provide the patches anymore. Ah yes.. there was also this nice move to sale a game that tells you it works on win2k and then the requiered update program will not work there. Would have annoyed me too, because my last windows box was a win2k box. So all of a sudden I would not even have the chance to play the game anymore, even if I would still use my windows box... and I made the switch from linux complete only early this year.

This is usually caused by antivirus/antispyware software scanning the file as it's downloaded from our servers.  These programs can lock the download file, causing this error.  Whenever you hit this problem, go through turning off your av/security software for the duration of the download (turn it back on when you're done!), it should clear things up.

Thanks Zoomba, I run AVG, I'm fine with turning that off for the download, but I run Spybot's Teatimer as a contingency, I believe that all it does is monitor the registry for attempted alterations, have you seen any errors specifically related to TeaTimer?

Nothing specific to TeaTimer that I've heard of.  If you hit the error again with AVG off, just go through your security apps one by one to find the offender.

I'd like to comment on a few topics brought up in this thread;

I couldn't agree more with the post about how Windows is a horrible operating system.  I've spent way too much time over the years dealing with mysterious problems and doing reloads when all else fails.  As long as software developers insist on releasing products exclusively for Windows, we're stuck with the POS.  I hope to see a day when something comes along to break the stranglehold.  

You have to optimize Windows to some extent.  It runs like crap out of the box because it trys to automate and do everything for everybody.  I'm not some guy who disables Windows services because I read it somewhere on the internet.  I set my unneeded services to manual so programs can start them when needed.  I'm using XP and "update root certs" is an installable/uninstallable component.  I ran into the root certs problem with Impulse because I never needed it before so it wasn't there. 

The only thing I really don't like about Impulse is the .NET requirement.  Otherwise, I think it's a nifty little program.  I understand Impulse developers have their reasons for using .NET (probably because the M$ tools they're using force them to), but from my end, it looks like baggage.  So far, Impulse is the only program I run that requires it.  However, I'm sure that won't be the case forever.

I was a bit concerned about the automatic startup behavior of Impulse, but the option to disable it was obvious.  Personally, I think it should be disabled by default.  I absolutely hate it when programs wedge themselves into my system startup.  Too many products do that and their evil little startup entry is not always easy to find and kill.  It seems the Windows development philosopy is to just pile in your crap as if your product owns the system.  When it comes to installing Windows software, it's definitely a case of buyer beware.

Startup entries should only be in a couple places in your registery.  You've had some hiding elsewhere?

@CraigHB you hate it when programs put themself in the startup? Well, now think what .Net does to shorten the application startup time. And of course there is no easy way to turn that of, because at last in Vista that is part of the general windows startup process nad/or login process. So if Windows itself does it, how can you tell application developers they should not do that? I am not citicizing you with that question, instead it was a rethoric one. I am afraid putting things into the startup, hidden or not, will become even more common that it already is.

So how do I go about signing up to be one to get this "alternative way"?

It's going to happen in the future. You could email [email protected] for when it's available.  Reference brad's reply here in your email

Im sorry but this whole topic screams of the warz kiddies crying because they can't play online with their hacked copy. Impulse is not DRM you want to see what real DRM is go check out any EA game thats been realeased in the last year or so. Impulse is a downloader  you boot it up to get your patch and then its done. You can install your game over and over again as much as you want without fear of being locked out of your game. Unlike when with a true DRM game you only get like 5 install and after that your S.O.L.

Thank you for your contribution Einstein. Impulse manages the rights of the _digital_ patches, please do explain how that's not Digital Rights Mangagement.
Yes, there are different types of DRM, EAs version of SecureRom seems to be one of the worst togheter with the infamous StarForce, but that doesn't clear impulse from being DRM, it just clears it from being one of the worst.

 

Hell, it clears it from even being bad!  If all vendors went with the 'Impulse based' DRM approach, I'd have no complaints!  Maybe it's technicly DRM, but only technicly -- it isn't DRM in the sense of being a stupid, pain in a legit customers ass, ruin your computer if something goes wrong 'copyright protection' system.

You have done a security analysis of the Impulse sourcecode have you? Or maybe just some old fashioned reverse engineering? You can guarantee that it is secure, please do tell how. They can't get it to work with AV/firewalls, but you better believe it is rock solid when it comes to all the rest, the stuff that is important and hard to verify. It is a potential security hazard that they force on their customers (yeah yeah, if the customers want updates yada yada.)

There are people over at EAs forums that have no problems with EAs approach...

I think it's stupid. For me it was a pain in the ass to get the update and if something really goes wrong and Impulse is compromised, you are going to have more than a nonbooting operating system to worry about. Not to mention that it auto-updates, considering Valve got parts of the sourcecode to HL2 stolen (from over the internet), do you think that the Impulse update server is more secure than Valves internal development machines? It might be...

You're quite right, I can't 'guarantee' it's security or functionality, anymore than I could guarantee that the busses will be on schedule tomorrow (well, if tomorrow weren't thanksgiving).

But I'd be willing to bet quite a bit they will (would) be!

Fact is, I trust SD -- and they have never done me wrong by it, even in circumstances where they could have gotten away 'scott free' for having done so, or simply by not bothering to spend time fixing one individual person's problem.  I personally chat with several SD employees anytime I feel like it, and can get help from them at the proverbial pin drop.

As far as 'security' goes, I'll admit to being far from an expert, but the important aspect is that Impulse is far less likely to screw up the game or your computer than SecuRom or Starforce, while still providing a reasonable measure of control over the dev's product.  It is impossible to stop pirates from hacking the base product (or, rather, hackers from pirating the product) -- I think we can all agree that's a proven fact in this day in age, and your point about the Valve sourcecode only enhances it! -- but you can make it more difficult on the casual pirate to use the product.  And that is the point of Impulse:  since so much of SD's quality is in the patches, deny the patches to the pirates as best you can, but don't obsess about it when you can't.  It's as simple as registering your game to your impulse account, and from there most people get along fine -- not all, but most.  And SD is constantly working to further reduce that number.

 

Is impulse perfect?  No, I'll be the first to admit that.  But it's so much better than the alternative (secuRom that halts the game half the time even though I don't have any kind of emulation software running, Starforce which destroys my computer, etc etc) that it's not even close to being funny!

Fair enough.

And I agree that if the alternative is SF or SecR it's better. What I don't agree with is that it's a good thing nor that it "isn't DRM".

True, copy protection don't stop pirates and Impulse wont stop anyone who really wants to distribute the patches either, but yeah, for the casual pirate it becomes more of a hassle, if they feel that they need the patches that is.

Wow what a whine from just patches...

Did you guys ever consider that one source for patches may not be so bad thing after all if you take in consideration it is more safer than scouring the net for your beloved patch that may have been tampered with to ruin your computer and you'd come back to whine in official forums how they are evil company for making that patch.

how about we have a look in likely pirate guy's post asking for patch... since he openly admits can't get it since not have valid serial!

http://www.megauploadforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=12249&start=0&st=0&sk=t&sd=a

so in effect, you'd want Stardock to give patches openly(?) so guys like that guy can patch his illegal version with ease as side effect of your desire...

Now Impulse may not be liked or perfect (nothing is) so idea of Stardock giving patch via other means that would demand enter serial/username/password like details sounds also reasonable demand to consider/implement.

Still this paranoia around Impulse spying you among other things you guys make up is laughable!

You can't seriously suggest small developer like Stardock would pull that shit as that would be certain doom once word got out and everyone would desert them. If any developer has paranoia of its games thats EA and you don't see them answering in their own forums to their customers do you??? except for some lackey hired as PR guy.

Infact Stardock has a lot of BALLS to deliver no copy protection games and thats plenty of good faith already which you don't see so much these days... I sure wonder why?

I have heard whine of impulse but have yet to hear complete details why it was such a horrible experience...

gee installing Impulse is such a drag and entering few details is major headache and I assume Stardock has no backup servers or anything so its gonna crash 'n' burn instantly i trust that garbage!    (hows that for funny...)

So how about giving constructive feedback with details as Stardock IS LISTENING instead of just remarks how Impulse is epic phail and Stardock are evil for requiring you to use it.

You shouldn't assume that a software you are buying is not faulty/has ramification beyond its actual intent. Its a legitimate concern and it should not be ridiculed. However, Impulse has not had any problems for me security wise and is pretty good about addressing specific issues on Edit: installation and software.

Innocent until proven guilty. Its one thing to doubt, but another thing to decide on the veridict.

Also, people should stop trying to speak for Stardock. I see people propogating the wrong idea and others ranting in response to it. Frogboy has made his stance perfectly clear.

It isn't DRM in the common, rather than literal, sense of the word.

 

Insofar as I "speak" for them, I'm just repeating what they've said   I then expound my own opinion on the meaning of that statement and its origins and ramifications.

I thought it said "Games for Windows" on the box...

*ding**ding**ding**ding**ding**ding**ding**ding*

Give the man a prize!

 

 

./snicker

 

Gee Zoomba, it almost sounds like you don't think people who aren't running the OS the game requires deserve to have the entire program re-written just to run for their OS!