Bobfrenchmen

Assassins > generals??????

Assassins > generals??????

I am hearing that assassins are like these army killers and generals just help there armys get stronger. That dosent make much sence to me because the assassin sounds so strong that it culd just kill the general easly then the army men lose there buffs and then the assassin just gose and *eats* everyone. How are you guys gana balence out assassins vs. generals?



Also off topic I have only recently found out about the game, and I like the idea! I have played DOTA from warcraft 3 and a polished game made just for its type of game play sounds like a great idea. I also like the minotaur race they my fave at moment ^^ . But if i pre order the game soon... can i participate in the upcomeing beta?


PLZ PLZ PLZ :SNIFF!:
25,421 views 63 replies
Reply #51 Top

Yes from what I remember demigods have separate item pools, it was never confirmed but a lot of posts by developers kinda hint at it.

Reply #52 Top

What's the point of an assasin that only supports allies?  Isn't that demigod better off being designed as a general? 

How is an assasin going to be good at killing buildings and not 1v1 (Said demigod would do added damage to buildings, but somehow do less damage to the rook, who is roughly made out of the same material)?  With that said, this idea is actually pretty plausable.  The "support only assasin" is not.  Each demigod needs to be viable in a 1v1 game (not necessarilly demigod vs demigod).

Reply #53 Top

Why is a support General feasible but a General that is good at fighting 1vs1(with his minions.. duh.  Apparently i have to mention this.) not?...

 

I don't understand you people. :/

 

Need to remove the healers out of Dota, eh?  They don't use minions!

I think this comes down to people going to much into the name "Assassin" and "General" *sighs*

They are just names Demigod choose to differentiate one using Minions and another being your only character you can control.  Assassin doesn't mean they have to be assassinaters. :/

Reply #54 Top

For once I have to agree with innociv here, an assassin who would buff and heal his allies (Demigods! Not always creeps) and him self could be powerful, a rook with +15% attack speed! sign me up!

If you want some examples of good support assassins look at some of the dota heroes (as they're all essentially assassins) like Omninight! (Slow aura, anti spell shield, heal that damage nearby enemies, invulnerability for 7 seconds to all near by units) or Dazzle! (Slow poison, faster respawn w/ less penalties, lower armour/damage, chain heal that hearts enemies(less than ommi)) or ... I could go on and on.

Point is there are lots of ways to be a one man support platform who is just as powerful as some one who leads and supports armies.

Reply #55 Top

And in the same sense, there should be Generals that instead of using Aura's to buff their troops, they make it so their troops leach life to the General that controls them so the General is very hard to kill until you kill it's minions first, and the General itself has decent attacks to do damage and just uses his Minions as a buffer instead of for his actual killing.

And/or like when that specific general dies all his minions explode damaging enemies near them, so if you're surrounded by those Minions as an Assassin and kill the General commanding them(instead of killing [most of] the Minions first) you'll likely die with him.

Something like that would make a cool General.. instead of just lots of AoE aura's.

Reply #56 Top

Quoting innociv, reply 3
Why is a support General feasible but a General that is good at fighting 1vs1(with his minions.. duh.  Apparently i have to mention this.) not?... I don't understand you people. :/ Need to remove the healers out of Dota, eh?  They don't use minions!I think this comes down to people going to much into the name "Assassin" and "General" *sighs*They are just names Demigod choose to differentiate one using Minions and another being your only character you can control.  Assassin doesn't mean they have to be assassinaters. :/

 

Nobody's saying that a general with minions shouldn't be able to be good at 1v1.  That's been a point we've all been misunderstanding.  We're all talking and no one's trying to listen.  You seem to think that it's such common sense that you MUST include minions with the general when talking about 1v1.  Well, I guess if you've played dota this may be common sense.  Not entirely true for the rest of us.  The rest of us are looking for a baseline to start at.  Therefore, generals WITHOUT minions must be weaker than an assasin.  Yes, it makes sense, but we obviously need to start somewhere before we can get on the same train of thought.

Anyway, on to the support assasin.  It depends on how many demigods we have at game release. A support demigod just can't stand alone in a 1v1, therefore it's automatically not an option for a 1v1 game.  So, while not a bad idea, I'd rather a have a good variety of multipurpose demigods (ones that work in 1v1 as well as on teams), before we go into purely support type demigods.  I made the suggestion that a support demigod should be a general for the simple fact that it would be able to both support demigods, and still have troops to stand on it's own. 

Reply #57 Top

Quoting mOoEyThEcOw, reply 4
For once I have to agree with innociv here, an assassin who would buff and heal his allies (Demigods! Not always creeps) and him self could be powerful, a rook with +15% attack speed! sign me up!If you want some examples of good support assassins look at some of the dota heroes (as they're all essentially assassins) like Omninight! (Slow aura, anti spell shield, heal that damage nearby enemies, invulnerability for 7 seconds to all near by units) or Dazzle! (Slow poison, faster respawn w/ less penalties, lower armour/damage, chain heal that hearts enemies(less than ommi)) or ... I could go on and on.Point is there are lots of ways to be a one man support platform who is just as powerful as some one who leads and supports armies.

 

I see, I suppose my view of support was just too narrow.  There are already demigods like that.  The Unclean beast already has a slowing aura and a poison aura (I think....it was that one hands on article but I can't remember the name).  No word on whether it's "purely" support though.

Reply #58 Top

Well those are abilities that are also combat helpful for a combat oriented assassin, but an assassin with all support abilities can be effective too. I mean look at the hero ability combos I posted not their individual abilities.

As in if those were the only 8 skills that demigod had:

(heal that does damage and later through a different skill upgraded to a chain heal that does damage, faster respawn with less effects w/ shorter time magic reduction buff (two seperate skills into one cast?), slow aura for demi's (and with an upgrade creeps), 3 second invulnerability ultimate like ability for evreything near by, take more damage debuff, slowing attack passive)

That would be a support assassin in my book. I mean he dosn't even have to hit hard, they'll be so slow, taking extra damage, and have troubles killing anything, let alone if they do they're back faster. Wheather solo or team, he'd do better with a team, but he can do plenty fine in 1v1.

I mean jeeze, high damage assassins? who needs em (  :P )

Reply #59 Top

I suppose it would be considered support.  The thing is that that character could put up a pretty decent fight against a "high damage assasin".  Which is why I didn't think of it as support initially.

Reply #60 Top

Why would anyone talk about a General fighting without his minions?!  I don't seee wh ythere is a discussion on such a thing.  The Minions are part of the General.  If i'm not mistaken(haven't played, but i'm just assuming this to be true) the General will probably start with soem troops at the very begining of the game.  It would only make sense.

 

OF COURSE an Assassin will beat a General that is all alone, with no minions, and no creeps helping.  If they didn't then the General would be overpowered WITH minions!

Why does that even need mentioning, or dicussing over?..  I'm sorry reading all those posts I couldn't of fathomed that's what people meant.  I had to assume that when people said General vs. Assassin they meant General with minions vs. Assassin because it's just so plain obvious an Assassin should win an in equal player skill fighter against a General without minion that it isn't even worth mentioning.  If there really needs to be discussion over that.. I just don't know what to say.

 

:/

Reply #61 Top

Just devils advocate here, I agree with you for the most part on this one but:

the General will probably start with soem troops at the very begining of the game. It would only make sense.

Do assassins start with items then? (as you seem to love TF2 analogies:) Do engineers start with buildings?

Reply #62 Top

Generals can get items too though..

 

We'll see in the beta in a week.

Reply #63 Top

Generals can get items too though..

Did I ever say they couldn't?