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Why should anyone support Obama?

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Why should anyone support Obama?

from JoeUser Forums

It is amazing to me the way some people think.  They cry that racism is being thrown about by some people (especially blacks), when they themselves are doing the very same thing.  They cry that the only reason why blacks do support Obama, is because he is in fact, black! 

 


Is there any truth to the fact that blacks do support Obama, yes, there is.  If he is the candidate that they want to support, why shouldn't they support him?  If he is the candidate in the political party they support, is it so wrong to be behind the candidate they believe in?

 

I guess they should switch party affiliations just because so many don't believe in anything this candidate, Obama, stands for, and what they the people who support the Republican candidate do, and are crying foul, believe in!

 

Sure, Obama being black is a trump card, he is different, never has this happened before in our country, so why not?!  This would be the reasons why so many of Obama's supporters, support him right?  To coin a phrase, we are like sheep!

 

Bring me arguments about the state of our country and what is going on in our country, and why there should be changes made so that WE ALL can live a better life and whether are not we have to worry about ALL THAT WE HAVE ALL WORKED SO HARD FOR OVER THE YEARS is all going down the toilet!    

 

Don't bring me crap shoot arguments whining about the fact that a candidate is Black, and that he loves to bring this information up himself,  and that all he seems to do is say that he is black, when this fact is quite obvious to EVERYONE!  What the freck is the really issue here?  The fact that so many can't get over the fact that he is the one chosen as the candidate to represent the Democratic party, and he happens to be black?

 

Or, the fact that the American people are tired of the ruling government and all the crap that they have done over the years that has begun to affect our country?  So they want change, and they will have it!  Are you going to be effective in your citizenship and go out there and also let yourself be heard, or are you going to stay out of it just because "Obama will get everyone's vote because HE IS BLACK and White America wants to prove that they are not racist and will also vote for him and that is the only reason why they will vote for him"? 

 

You who believe such crap are doing a disservice to yourself and to your fellow Americans!  It is bullshit crap like this that makes us all look bad and it is time to get up off of the toilet or take a shit and do or say something more constructive!  Not come at me with crappy arguments that is riddled with holes!

 

For God's sake wake up people!  Of course we all will notice that Obama is Black, just the same that we all notice that McCain is so much older and looks like a hard wind would blow him over!  Now was that not me being discriminative about McSame...I mean, McCain's age?! [and wans't that me being rude and disrespectful in calling him McSame?!]  We all can do it, we just chose to take the higher road and be respectful!

 

I am worried about the economy, the fact that gas prices are so high, that the boomerang effects from that has cost jobs, higher prices in the supermarkets, housing slumps all over!  People are out there hanging on to their life and livihood for dear life, and some of you only have stupid arguments to insult our intelligence! 

 

Oh GROW UP!

economy politics
176,636 views 78 replies
Reply #51 from JoeUser Forums Top
Inventive economy is an approach to a better world of goods and services for those denied material gain.


So if I'm understanding you correctly "Inventive Economy" is essentially socialism


I was going to reply until I saw that El-Duderino had scooped me again. ;)
Reply #52 from JoeUser Forums Top
And I thank you for sharing your views! Most of the men who have been President, were Governors, I guess this disqualifies Obama, anyone else but Obama, this is a one-dimentional way of thinking.


On the contrary! With regard to being a governor I'm concerned about McCain on the same level. No experience.

Other than having the qualities to be a great leader, sound judgement, being able to make decisions, the right ones, (and as we all know, half of the time, most of the Presidents in power, do not make the right decisions - thus this is not necessarily a requirement I guess!).


This is highly a subjective statement and would constitute as opinion. I'm looking for examples or objective items that support the notion he has qualities to be a 'great leader' shows 'sound judgment' when making decisions.

As for "related" experience, it is not a requirement that political experience makes you a good President, it does help, and in that case, Senator Obama may just be a Junior Senator in the US Senate, however, prior to that he was a Senator for the State of Illinois for about 8 years, he was a lawyer.


Did anything significant come from his 8 years being an Illinois senator and 3 years in the US Senate?

You know what else, Obama exudes the confidence & eloquence that we need in our leadership, not fumbling and bumbling. He also seems to have a vision of where our country could be, that others don't seem to see. But so many of his naysayers consider this to be a bad trait, too cocky and definitely talks too much....more good qualities for a great leader!lol!


yes, no fumbling and bumbling?

There is a long list that goes against this FS.
Give a child an Breathalyzer or inhalator for a treatable illness like asthma.
Israel is a strong friend to Israel. (just for short starters)

Go back and look at all the speeches you are holding in your mind. Which one's did he have a teleprompter or read a prepared speech compared to the times things were 'off the cuff' so to speak? During the times of 'off the cuff' there are many flubs and stutters (during his recent international trip I think it was in Jordan where he stuttered for a remarkable period of time)!

Two things regarding the vision:
First of all I will agree he does seem to have a vision. A Marxist one and if you support Marxism/Socialism then this is the vision for you and the country.
Second, he is lying when saying that his Marxist views are the 'great traditional values' of the country.

Technically, if experience is really what the people are looking for, then either Guiliani, Romney or Huckabee should have been the frontrunner!


Very TRUE. I often wonder why states that allow independents to vote in primaries are allowed to play such an influential role in choosing a candidate in the early primaries. IMO, McCain wouldn't have had a chance and would have been dealt a devastating blow in the beginning. Again JMO.

I'm having trouble pasting th elink AD, sorry about that!


just type the address out and I'll be happy to just copy and paste it.


-------

FS, thank you for this non-abrasive discussion.

Sins of a Solar Empire II
Reply #53 from JoeUser Forums Top
Inventive economy is one that is not content with relying on lockstep reactions, such as YES, YES, by all means DRILL, drill for more oil! B&S and ilk bailouts, the free market as though it were really free despite its risks. Inventive economy is an approach to a better world of goods and services for those denied material gain.


What exactly does B&S stand for?

Regarding ilk bailouts:
This in and of itself maybe a contradiction? If you are against ilk bailouts then you cannot be for a socialist approach! Let's take a look at some recent events. Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae, and Country Homes lending. All THREE of these companies had pressure applied to them by the government to give out the Subprime loans.

These subprime loans in and of them self were very high risk. When they finally came back and bit the CRAPOLA out of Freddie and Fannie the government had reverse pressure to bail them out since they were responsible from the pressure to give such loans.

The two work together (socialism/"inventive economy and ilk bailouts).
Reply #54 from PolMach Forums Top
This in and of itself maybe a contradiction? If you are against ilk bailouts then you cannot be for a socialist approach!


This is an excellent point. The way to think of bailouts is a very large welfare program for businesses instead of people. If you are against bailouts then you are against welfare, which is very anti-socialism.
Reply #55 from Stardock Forums Top

 

I'm looking for examples or objective items that support the notion he has qualities to be a 'great leader' shows 'sound judgment' when making decisions.

Can you tell me where Obama has shown to have the qualities to be a great leader? Can you give me example is his sound judgement? And, finally, can you point me to one of Obama's decisions?

AD, I wished I had written that site down, but it was late in the evening, almost midnight and Mozilla, that I use at home, has not been customized yet so I cannot copy and paste as I do at work (now) and at the moment, searching for it is going to be too much time and I have to run out of here in five mins.   However,  you and Leauki are asking for examples, that page had them, things he achieved during his time in Illinois and his involvement with the diffent organizations.  Google it, I am not ashamed to say that is what I did because I don't keep information like that memorize! [I'm talking my 43 year old brain that is already crap filled with kids, work, family and other stuff that are more pressing!;P ]

I also have a feeling that no matter what my answers are, no matter if I write something that would present my point, it wouldn't be enough (Leuki) so I won't bother to go down that road.  However, you can be a doll and find the infor and let us see, or you can be less of a doll and continue to rub your points home of not being able to find anything to substantiate what I am saying.:P

Either way, we will continue on! :CONGRAT:

 

FS, thank you for this non-abrasive discussion.

Hey Dude, anytime! You are among the few around here I enjoy a good debate with!:)

 

I was going to reply until I saw that El-Duderino had scooped me again.
 

Newsflash!  The Doc has been scooped!:SURPRISED: lol

Reply #56 from JoeUser Forums Top
I also have a feeling that no matter what my answers are, no matter if I write something that would present my point, it wouldn't be enough (Leuki) so I won't bother to go down that road. However, you can be a doll and find the infor and let us see, or you can be less of a doll and continue to rub your points home of not being able to find anything to substantiate what I am saying.


FS, I have looked and researched Obama. There are a few things that appear to be beneficial to the points that you are making about him.

I'm not trying to "rub my points home" to you but rather progress logically through your understanding of why you support a candidate (same applies to McCain). This has more to do with your reasoning for supporting Obama (or for any candidate) and objective evidence for that support. I have been duped by too many people for following them 'blindly.'

One of which I am currently LIVID WITH (yeah that's you Ken Salazar D-CO:Political whore!). But I digress....

I don't want you to experience the same anguish as I do with Salazar. I now realize how important it is to do our research on candidates.

I hope you understand.
[I'm talking my 43 year old brain that is already crap filled with kids, work, family and other stuff that are more pressing! ]


But you love EVERY bit of it! :CONGRAT:

Hey Dude, anytime! You are among the few around here I enjoy a good debate with!


Likewise ;)
Reply #57 from Stardock Forums Top

Can you tell me where Obama has shown to have the qualities to be a great leader?

Can you give me example is his sound judgement?

And, finally, can you point me to one of Obama's decisions?

Anybody? 

Reply #58 from Stardock Forums Top

I'm not trying to "rub my points home"

Actually this was aimed at someone else!:d

 

Can you tell me where Obama has shown to have the qualities to be a great leader? Can you give me example is his sound judgement? And, finally, can you point me to one of Obama's decisions? Anybody?

ID I'm sure someone will bite if they so incline!  Didn't we discuss that already though?

Reply #59 from JoeUser Forums Top
Actually this was aimed at someone else!


Ok, well, have a wonderful weekend!

I'm going CAMPING! Wo0T!
Reply #61 from JoeUser Forums Top
This is an excellent point. The way to think of bailouts is a very large welfare program for businesses instead of people. If you are against bailouts then you are against welfare, which is very anti-socialism.


Sophistry! Define terms. It's true "homeownership frenzy begun by Clinton and perfected by Bush was the underlying catalyst. However, it was undermined by the overly ambitious to preempt moderate interest rates with usury.
Reply #62 from JoeUser Forums Top
However, it was undermined by the overly ambitious to preempt moderate interest rates with usury.


No, it is yet again the law of supply and demand. No one was charged anything approaching usury. But bad borrowers were charged more, that in that point in time, they thought (or at least the honest ones did) they could pay.

And the reason that bad borrowers are charged more? 2 fold. One is that they have fewer options. Safe lenders would not deal with them. The other is for the very reason we have a housing "crises" (misnomer as it is). They cost the lender a lot more.

The lending "crises" as it is, is actually a great example of putting the costs on the people that incur it, instead of sharing it around to those that have nothing to do with jacking up the prices. It is very anti-socialism, and thus an anathema to many liberals.
Reply #63 from JoeUser Forums Top
Sophistry! Define terms. It's true "homeownership frenzy begun by Clinton and perfected by Bush was the underlying catalyst. However, it was undermined by the overly ambitious to preempt moderate interest rates with usury.


Do you or do you not support 'ilk bailouts' that you mentioned?
Reply #64 from JoeUser Forums Top

I also have a feeling that no matter what my answers are, no matter if I write something that would present my point, it wouldn't be enough (Leauki) so I won't bother to go down that road.


Actually, I'd be happy with any answer.
Reply #65 from Stardock Forums Top

The good news - almost anyone Obama chooses as VP will have more experience than himself - now that's a plus....right?

Reply #66 from JoeUser Forums Top
The good news - almost anyone Obama chooses as VP will have more experience than himself - now that's a plus....right?


Not necessarily:think Cheney.
Do you or do you not support 'ilk bailouts' that you mentioned?


Only if they prevent more homeless. It's one of those necessary evils that must be done to protect the value of homes of those who do make payments on time.
Reply #67 from JoeUser Forums Top
Not necessarily:think Cheney.


Cheney had a lot of experience. Both in congress and the Executive Branch.
Reply #68 from Stardock Forums Top

Actually, I'd be happy with any answer.

Me too, but it is a long and lonely and winding road out there!

 

The good news - almost anyone Obama chooses as VP will have more experience than himself - now that's a plus....right?

Isn't this what a great leader does? :CONGRAT:

Reply #69 from JoeUser Forums Top
Only if they prevent more homeless. It's one of those necessary evils that must be done to protect the value of homes of those who do make payments on time.


Should the gov't provide cars to the unemployed so that they can find a job? What about if the person just over extended themselves like they did with a house? Should the gov't provide a car too?

The argument that these 'bailouts' are preventing more homeless is bogus IMO. I am married and have a decent job. Technically I qualify enough through banks to purchase a home. The reason I haven't? I can't budget for what my payments will be and still survive with bills paid. Instead we are renting and saving up for the time so we can AFFORD a house. The problem with these bailouts are preventing us from being able to purchase a home. This has caused over inflation on the housing market especially in my area. Just last year you could not find an average house for under 250K in my area. This included houses that needed some work to be done on them. Now that these sub-primes are coming mature and banks are foreclosing on houses people had NO business buying in the first place, I am now FINALLY beginning to see price come back within reach.

I'm just an honest man trying to make a living and be SMART with my money by not over extending but you seem to want to bail out those who apply unwisely for risky loans.

JMO
Reply #70 from JoeUser Forums Top
I'm just an honest man trying to make a living and be SMART with my money by not over extending but you seem to want to bail out those who apply unwisely for risky loans.


Good to hear you are thrifty. But how can you justify bailing out lenders but not borrowers? Not all first time borrowers are as wise as you--they easily get duped.
Reply #71 from PolMach Forums Top

Good to hear you are thrifty. But how can you justify bailing out lenders but not borrowers? Not all first time borrowers are as wise as you--they easily get duped.

I don't think he was justifying the bail out of the lenders.  Bail-outs are bad, plain and simple.  The market needs to correct itself and its needs to do so without the government sticking its nose in.  Will a market correction be painful?  Yes, but it will be faster like pulling off a bandaid really quick, when the government sticks its nose into it it's like pulling that bandaid off one hair at a time by extending the painful period.

The main point to remember when making any major purchase is buyer beware.  Why should I be penalized because someone else made a bad decision?  People being "easily duped" is a cop-out.  I read a story of a woman who was getting a loan to buy a $300K home, she made around $40K/year and when she was in the loan officers office the guy said "Congratulations you now work for me."  He listed her as an employee of his so that he could get her salary up to qualify for the loan.  This should have sent red flags off in anyones head but she let it happen because she wanted the house.  As of the time the article was written (a few months ago) her rates had reset and she couldn't make the payments anymore (the mortgage had jumped up to like 5 grand a month) and she was going to lose the house.  Why should I be penalized because someone made such an obvious mistake like this one?

I don't mind there being a little safety net for people who fall on hard times, like getting laid off and not being able to find work, but to bail people out because they made poor choices just doesn't make sense.

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Reply #72 from JoeUser Forums Top
Good to hear you are thrifty. But how can you justify bailing out lenders but not borrowers? Not all first time borrowers are as wise as you--they easily get duped.


I don't justify either. I believe it is you that supports 'ilk bailouts as a necessary evil?'

The lenders had their hand forced by the gov't so I don't hold them overly responsible as they had a heavy hand pushing them to offer sub-prime lending. The borrowers sought out to make money in flipping the property,expectations of having more income in the near future, plans of re-financing after a few years (due to credit rating), while the remaining must of been blindly ignorant.

Reply #73 from JoeUser Forums Top
I don't mind there being a little safety net for people who fall on hard times, like getting laid off and not being able to find work, but to bail people out because they made poor choices just doesn't make sense.


I'm in agreement. There is a fine line with helping someone who stumbled vs. helping someone who doesn't want to get off the couch.
Reply #74 from JoeUser Forums Top

the oil tycoons have made even more profits

Some of us average joes work for those oil tycoons and it's kinda nice to be doing alright for a change. I didn't here you libs crying when oil was $13 a barrel and we were standing in the unemployment line. What goes around comes around.

hussein is going down, mark my words.

Reply #75 from Stardock Forums Top

hussein is going down, mark my words.
 

Shouldn't that be Bin Laden is going down.....it is about dang time he did!  AT the rate that some of you find time to hate, turn the hate on the right people!

 

Some of us average joes work for those oil tycoons and it's kinda nice to be doing alright for a change. I didn't here you libs crying when oil was $13 a barrel and we were standing in the unemployment line. What goes around comes around.

Good for you that things have turned around!  Perhaps some of those leftys were right behind you hiding in line uh?! :-"