Why is Left Unpatriotic?

from JoeUser Forums
As I look around this site more and more it is very apparent who is left and who is right. What I do not understand is why many people to the right believe that having liberal views is unpatriotic. It just makes no sense to me. I love America. I like John Kerry and I believe Clinton was the best president we have had in recent times. I don't agree with President Bush's views, but does that make me hate America. How is it any different for someone who does not agree with a democrats view? That doesn't make them unpatriotic. It just boggles my mind that something as small as politics can divide people so much. That's just something I noticed. 'Nuff said.
politics
16,359 views 35 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
I've always said that the greatest thing about the Republic is that it is larger than either party. The USA is truly a social experiment that is greater than the sum of its parts.

Cheers.
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top

it's a Bogus question; simply your opinion

what if i were to ask "Why is the Right Racist?"
there would be an assumption that the right is racist, which is a generalization, and not true

i probably won't change your mind, but democrats love america as much as you do,
including Michael Moore [believe it or not]

pete
ObjectDock - Access shortcuts and frequently used applications from an animated dock.
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
I didn't mean to say that I think the left is unpatriotic. I meant to ask people on the right why they assume the left is unpatriotic. I am a democrat. I agree with you. I hope that clarifies things.
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
Peter the great made a great point though. It's the same reason people on the left sometimes assume that people on the right are racist, heartless, etc.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
SameOldRat:

Well, I've been accused of being on both sides. The main issue is that people resort to name calling when they run out of arguments about their ideas on an issue. The Left is very patriotic to be so determined to move the country in a different direction than the one we are headed in. the Right is very patriotic to believe that what we are doing now is the path we should be on.

The voters decide which is best for the most people as well as themselves personally.

What occurs afterward is that both sides should move back toward working with one another to make decisions that are best for all. It is what politicians promise, but seldom happens because the views of both sides are so polarized. It has worked in the past and I hope will again once the election is over.
Reply #6 from PolMach Forums Top
What I do not understand is why many people to the right believe that having liberal views is unpatriotic.

The more accurate question is, "Why does the right always paint the left as unpatriotic," but that's so easily answered...
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top

Reply #2 By: Peter the great - 10/16/2004 12:11:45 PM

including Michael Moore [believe it or not]

pete



This *wrong"! People that love America DO NOT call other Americans "stupid" to a European audience.
Reply #8 from PolMach Forums Top
I tend to lean right and in no way believe those on the left are unpatriotic (My sister and Brother in law are exceptionally left). As is usually the case with differing viewpoints, it is all about process. Both sides of the aisle want the same outcomes but disagree on how to get there from here.

Michael Moore is part of the reason the left is being painted as unpatriotic.

Excerpt from an article Moore wrote in a German paper (9-2003 in Die Zeit):

Should such an ignorant people lead the world? How did it come to this in the first place? 82 percent of us don't even have a passport! Just a handful can speak a language other than English (and we don't even speak that very well.) ...

OR

Excerpt from an article in the London Guardian (Samantha Ellis, 6/17/2004 "Fahrenheit 9/11 gets help offer from Hezbollah"):

According to Screen International, the UAE-based distributor Front Row Entertainment has been contacted by organisations related to the Hezbollah in Lebanon with offers of help (regarding distribution of Fahrenheit 9/11)

Is it any wonder the crowd that embraces Moore opens themselves up for "the unpatriotic" painting? I think they ought to distance themselves from him if they don't want to be incorrectly portrayed (JMHO).
Reply #9 from PolMach Forums Top
Michael Moore is part of the reason the left is being painted as unpatriotic

I'd say that's a fair call. I don't know if Moore actually is unpatriotic, but perhaps he can come across that way when pointing out problems within America.
Reply #10 from PolMach Forums Top
Ironically, it works the other way around in Canada. Go figure.
Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top
I think it's a shame that Americans don't believe in self-deprecating humour. The Australian Tourism Board has been using it for years to persuade foreigners that Australia still has an outback complete with crocodile hunters. But as soon as an American does it, it's treachery. It's a strange world you Yanks live in.
Reply #12 from PolMach Forums Top
I didn't make all of this up, but I agree with it very much.

Conservatives, Democrats, Liberals, and Republicans alike all love America.
The difference is Republicans love America the way a 4 year old loves its mommy.
No matter what mommy does mommy is still mommy, no matter how bad mommy
is they still love mommy.
If mommy gets in a fight with someone else for no reason the child still loves her.
If mommy quits her job and puts them on the street the child still loves her.

Democrats love America the way a mother loves a 4 year old child, no matter what
the child does the mother will always love it, but is always looking for the childs
safety and best intrest.
If the child gets in a fight at school the mother will still love the child, but will punish them
to make sure they never try to attack another child again.
If the child buys candy with his lunch money the mother will still love the child, but will
punish him so he never uses reckless spending again.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top

You'd be hard pressed to find articles on this site by "right wingers" that could be described as "racist". But it's pretty easy to find anti-American articles by left wingers here.

I actually don't think many left wingers "love" America.  Or at best, they certainly don't love it in the form it has reached at the start of the 21st century.  They see it as a corrupt, inept thugacracy controlled by rich corporate interests while exploiting the defenseless both here in the US and abroad. They think capitalism is an evil institution and that the world is the principle force of cultural destruction, environment destruction, and global evil.

I consider such views to be inately unpatriotic and unamerican.  I can certainly see problems with the United States. And I can see the root truths in many of the views that left wingers hold.  Where we part company is in extrapolating those root truths into something they're not.  Simply put, I believe the world is infintely better off with the United States, as it exists today than a world without the United States.

By contrast, I think many left wingers believe that the US has great potential for good but that as it stands now, the world is a poorer place because of the US in its current incarnation.

Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
You'd be hard pressed to find articles on this site by "right wingers" that could be described as "racist".


I know he got the boot or ran away, but s1ua4t was very close, with his attempts to get other bloggers to join his anti-Muslim jihad. And on various occasions there have been others, although I can't remember all the names.
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
You'd be hard pressed to find articles on this site by "right wingers" that could be described as "racist". But it's pretty easy to find anti-American articles by left wingers here.
I actually don't think many left wingers "love" America. Or at best, they certainly don't love it in the form it has reached at the start of the 21st century. They see it as a corrupt, inept thugacracy controlled by rich corporate interests while exploiting the defenseless both here in the US and abroad. They think capitalism is an evil institution and that the world is the principle force of cultural destruction, environment destruction, and global evil.
I consider such views to be inately unpatriotic and unamerican. I can certainly see problems with the United States. And I can see the root truths in many of the views that left wingers hold. Where we part company is in extrapolating those root truths into something they're not. Simply put, I believe the world is infintely better off with the United States, as it exists today than a world without the United States.
By contrast, I think many left wingers believe that the US has great potential for good but that as it stands now, the world is a poorer place because of the US in its current incarnation.


Are you retarted? I am sorry but this pissed me off. I have nothing else to say to you right now.
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
One can merely click on the forums and find plenty of anti-American left wingers here.  The blogger you mention I don't even remember. Plus you are assuming racists are right wing rather than identifyign a right winger as a racist.
Reply #17 from PolMach Forums Top
The difference is Republicans love America the way a 4 year old loves its mommy.

Democrats love America the way a mother loves a 4 year old child,


Great the last thing I need is a Paternal Government, take your mommy and daddy government and leave America because that is not the American way of Liberty first and government last that is even outlined that way by the US Constitution.

- Grim X
Reply #18 from PolMach Forums Top
But it's pretty easy to find anti-American articles by left wingers here.

Do you want to give some examples, or would you rather leave it up to reader`s imaginations?
Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
First of all, most lefties here attack the policies of the government, not America in an abstract sense. I think some of the people on the Right have trouble seeing that distinction.

I can't be the only person who remembers just how much right wing hatred of the government there was during the 1990s. Predictably, when the president is a Democrat, conservatives get really pissy about the things the American government is doing -- and when a Republican is president, liberals do the same thing.
Reply #20 from PolMach Forums Top
This *wrong"! People that love America DO NOT call other Americans "stupid" to a European audience.


Oh crap, I called a dumb dude I know "stupid" to some guys from Amsterdam at work yesterday. I didn't know I hated America, I thought I was just giving an honest evaluation of the individuals competency. Is there some codeword that I should use instead of "stupid" to imply a low level of proficiency that doesn't make me hate America?

Oh BTW, I think Bush is "Stupid" too. What is a eurpoean reads this thread. All I want to do is get him out of office to help make the country I love better. Now that I think I might hate the country I might just vote for him again so I can screw this place I hate so much up even worse.
Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top

Reply #20 By: Jockoj - 10/17/2004 6:44:35 PM
This *wrong"! People that love America DO NOT call other Americans "stupid" to a European audience.


Oh crap, I called a dumb dude I know "stupid" to some guys from Amsterdam at work yesterday. I didn't know I hated America, I thought I was just giving an honest evaluation of the individuals competency. Is there some codeword that I should use instead of "stupid" to imply a low level of proficiency that doesn't make me hate America?


How about him calling us "ignorant people that don't deserve to have a place in the world". Now does that still sound like someone who loves America to you? BTW the quote was given to an audience in London,England.
Besides calling 1 person stupid is a far cry from calling an entire nation stupid. Or do you like being called stupid and ignorant? I sure don't!
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
How about him calling us "ignorant people that don't deserve to have a place in the world". Now does that still sound like someone who loves America to you? BTW the quote was given to an audience in London,England.
Besides calling 1 person stupid is a far cry from calling an entire nation stupid. Or do you like being called stupid and ignorant? I sure don't!


I will tell you I don't love all americans. I think there are some stupid ones. Am I an america hater? No. I love america. But fine.. call me an America Hater.
Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top

I will tell you I don't love all americans. I think there are some stupid ones. Am I an america hater? No. I love america. But fine.. call me an America Hater.


So, having a problem with some Americans is the same thing as saying Americans are stupid?

Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top
Reply #22 By: sandy2 - 10/17/2004 6:51:53 PM
How about him calling us "ignorant people that don't deserve to have a place in the world". Now does that still sound like someone who loves America to you? BTW the quote was given to an audience in London,England.
Besides calling 1 person stupid is a far cry from calling an entire nation stupid. Or do you like being called stupid and ignorant? I sure don't!


I will tell you I don't love all americans. I think there are some stupid ones. Am I an america hater? No. I love america. But fine.. call me an America Hater.



You still don't get it do you? I'll try again.:


Besides calling 1 person stupid is a far cry from calling an entire nation stupid. Or do you like being called stupid and ignorant? I sure don't!
Reply #25 from JoeUser Forums Top
Besides calling 1 person stupid is a far cry from calling an entire nation stupid. Or do you like being called stupid and ignorant? I sure don't!


Personally I like the idea that other people think my country is full of cheerful and backward hicks. National stupidity is a great boon in some ways, and I'd prefer my country to be known for its stupidity than its belligerence or its rapacious greed.