In Defense of an Unpopular Truth….

I am a Culturalist

from JoeUser Forums

little whip had a very interesting and provocative article here which I didn’t catch up to until the thread had been Godwin’d several times over. Frankly many of the hysterical screeds that people were passing off as comments to her well written and honest article made me wish I had more trolling ratings to hand out every day.

While I do most often find myself in groups that consists mostly of whites (hmmm out of 9 people in my van 5 are white, 1 is Choctaw, 1 is black, 1 is mixed, and one is Middle Eastern of some nature…still the group is mostly white) I am certainly not uncomfortable around non-white folks. I have lived almost half my adult life in Asia and have dealt with non-whites everyday of my Army career with very little friction despite coming from an area of the country that is damn near exclusively white (they don’t call it the Great White North for nothing).

I remember distinctly having my first real conversation with a black man at Basic Training, it went like this : (honest accounting, but I will put on my flame suit anyways)

PVT McCune “Hey man, can I have that last piece of fried chicken?”

PVT Greywar “Sure, I want the roast beef anyways.”

PVT McCune “Cool, I can’t help myself when it comes to fried chicken.” (looks at me expectantly)

PVT Greywar “Why?” (had never heard the stereotype)

PVT McCune “Because I’m black yo!” (puzzled that I didn’t get it)

I did have several encounters during basic training with something that did make me feel uncomfortable though…. A culture, not a race. The culture of Me-ism. The culture that said that no-one else in the world has any right to any consideration whatsoever. These were the folks who would not shut up at night after a long day of Basic with an early morning the next day unless you got out of your bunk and beat their ass or at least made a convincing threat to do so. This was the culture that said it is ok to talk on your fucking phone during a movie, or to play your stereo at jet engine levels in the barracks at 2 a.m., or to treat local citizens like retards because you would be leaving the country in 12 months or less, or to demand that they be allowed to do less work than other people in the platoon.

Who were the perpetrators of these offenses? That hated group the Inner City-ites. Generally speaking these folks were in fact non-white but only generally. I immediately ran into white folks with the exact same problems from this same origin : the American Inner City.

This exposure was greatly lessened as I left Basic Training to attend language training at the Defense Language Institute. This school was overwhelmingly white in the 1990’s and the non-whites I met were by and large considerate of others.

By the time I was in my second Korea tour however my larger exposure to this culture of Me-ism has once again planted the seeds of doubt in my mind. These doubts were banished by my buddy Roy and airframe mechanic for Avtel (the maintainers for the RC-7 aircraft). Roy and his wife are from the Bahamas (she has the accent he doesn’t) and are both black. He and I were drinking beer and watching the news at his house when some news piece ran with totally ridiculous commentary from a rapper about how he needed his “props” and that the “man” was keeping his “peeps” down. Roy face screwed up like he had just smelled something awful and he said “These goddamn American Blacks give all the rest of the world’s blacks a bad name!” I took he opportunity to tell him that I didn’t think it was the blacks exactly but the inner-city hip-hop culture that was responsible. I pointed out that we both had American black friends who did not act this way and eventually he agreed with me.

Am I more comfortable in the company of whites? No, but I am more comfortable in the company of people who are not self-centered retards. Little whip made no bones about this in her article. She made it clear that it was not that all blacks were bad but that the majority of the one she had met in the inner city were culturally incompatible with her. For stating this honestly her blog was inundated with half-witted replies and accusations of Nazism.

Let me make this clear, anyone who Godwin’s this article will be permanently blacklisted and the offending comment will be deleted after getting a trolling rating. This is my blog and these are my rules. If you feel the need to tell me I am a Nazi or to photoshop me into a Grand Dragon of the KKK outfit do it on your own blog.
politics
14,241 views 32 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
You're absolutely right about it being a cultural thing.

When we lived about 70 miles away from Milwaukee, I observed there was a lot of prejudice in the community. This was not entirely the fault of the people of the community, as what had happened is, many of the black families from the inner city had moved to Oshkosh because the benefits were the same and the crime rate was lower. The blacks from the suburbs didn't move; they were comfortable where they were at.

The problem came in when the blacks from the inner city refused to give up their inner city lifestyle. In many communities in Wisconsin, the police tend to look the other way at pot usage, but when crack and meth come on the scene they come down hard. Many of these families from the inner cities of Milwaukee simply began to see our community as a distribution outlet. We lived upstairs from a family that would commonly bring in about 50 of their friends from Milwaukee; when they did, many of our things would disappear (they even took every single screen off the first floor windows of the senior apartments across the street). Following this, their friends would drive the 70 miles from Milwaukee, stop for about 15 minutes, and drive back. I know for a FACT crack was being distributed during these visits; I saw it with my own eyes.
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
There were plenty of people who understood exactly where i was coming from, even those who didnt get it at first.


Trust me, LW...I understand where you're coming from, it's just not the angle I take. I just try to bring a little balance on the scene (with a little humour), and it's my hope that I usually do it politely.
Galactic Civilizations III
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
I'm glad someone could put a finger on it. I began to wonder about it a small bit, because I don't hate blacks, but some crowds of blacks give me the willies and I'd rather avoid them. Other groups of blacks are loud and obnoxious, as stated, and I'd rather avoid them as well. I wouldn't have pinned it on living in the inner city, but that's exactly correct.

I couldn't live in the inner city, being country grown, just because of Me-ism. I imagine the suburbs would be difficult as well, not quite Me-ism but "BetterThanYou-ism".

I fail to see how this thread could be Godwin'd (which is hilarious I might add), hopefully it won't be. Very insightful article, and will be rated as such.
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
*grin* 'Me-ism'... it reminds me of a concept I was taught as a young fella called 'I-Itis'... It seemed that alot of people came down with a case of this 'I-Itis', where most sentances began with an 'I'...

I am, I have, I want, I need, I think, I wish, I know, I will

It would seem that some people grow out of 'I-Itis' at an early age... learning that in the starkness of reality, there is no room made for those who suffer from this affliction (Unless you really do have a bucketload of money, or the popularity to get it) and understanding they need to learn how to put the 'you' into 'everyone'... for the rest of humanity, I-Itis evolves into a nasty viral infection that is almost impossible to cure and makes you extremely hazardous to be around known as Me-ism.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yet another piece of evidence it isn't the color of your skin but how IGNORANT you act.


Exactly. Now, I'm not saying I'm not a sterling example of worldliness but I don't like ignorant people that refuse to learn or change.
Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top

Yet another piece of evidence it isn't the color of your skin but how IGNORANT you act.


Absolutely.


Greywar scores another insightful......

Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
It's a true and insightful article. Kudos to greywar. Not the skin, it's the culture...stinkin' NPR
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
GW,
I can relate to this story since I went to basic from central Mn too. I guess Me-ism should go into DSM-IV under the category of anti-social behaviors. I have seen this insiduous beast many times and it too can manifest itself as a form of racism. P.S. This is SSG Require Pork
Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
All - Thanks for the comments. I am pleasantly surprised that I was not taken to ask for expressing these sentiments by some of the more fervent PC adherents on the site.
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
Makes sense.

Now hopefully they'll get off the reparations bandwagon.

If people would understand and have pride in themselves, maybe this shit won't happen.

Anyway, gluck.
Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top
fucking double post, lemme make it a triple, rip all 3 off the thread if u can.

damn thing
Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
it gets on my nerves so i avoid areas where they congregate.
  The same could apply to rappers and country music.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
PVT McCune “Cool, I can’t help myself when it comes to fried chicken.” (looks at me expectantly)
PVT Greywar “Why?” (had never heard the stereotype)
Would you have asked why had it been watermelon?
Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
Lily_White did not say she prefers a non inner city culture. She said she prefers whites. She did not talk of inner city.
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top

Lily_White did not say she prefers a non inner city culture. She said she prefers whites. She did not talk of inner city.

At least the read the article before you try and tell people what is or is not in it... a bit of little whip's original article.

I spent almost a decade in the shittiest parts of south st louis, where white faces were rare, so im not some sheltered suburbanite that hasnt ever been exposed to black culture on a daily basis.

I like Allan, (my black friend) because he's into heavy metal rock and roll, and motorcycles, and weed, and the Grateful Dead, and he speaks in a lanuage i can understand, american. Im certain there are zillions of black guys just like him, somewhere, ive just yet to meet them.

To date, most of the blacks ive met have been into rap, cars, cocaine, and Tupac....good lord dont jump my shit saying i claimed ALL of them were, just the majority that ive met. We've had little in common as far as interests go, and were poles apart politically and culturally.

     Emphasis added for the hard of reading. The "lily white" thing earns you a trolling too BTW. It is not terribly amusing when Rush Limbaugh can't find anything else to do than poke fun at a name and it is not amusing when you can't find legitimate gripes and stoop to the same tired crap either. Debate an issue why don't you? Oh thats right, character assassination is easier than finding actual facts.
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top

Would you have asked why had it been watermelon?

No, I would not have asked because who can help themselves when it comes to watermelon? Is there anyone besides folsk with food allergies who won't eat watermelon until they are stuffed? I don't even have a clue how these two stereotypes got started. Like chicken and watermelon a lot? Of course! Just like everyone else!

Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top
pseudosoldier raises hand
 I'm not too big on watermelon, although I like it more now than when I was a kid.

Good article, tho. Very thought provoking.
Reply #18 from JoeUser Forums Top
Greywar said: I am more comfortable in the company of people who are not self-centered retards.

Don’t we all make our own little “ghettos” where we can be comfortable?

Many of us do not like to have our little worlds disturbed by people who think differently than we do. When they dare to point out what they see as glaring errors in our thinking, we are up in arms, ready to defend our position with emotional outbursts of rage, name calling, putdowns, and/or ridicule, just to name a few reactions that I have resorted to when my own “sacred cows” was being butchered by someone I might have labeled a “self-centered retard”.

How much better thinkers we would be if we would just reexamine our thinking to see if perhaps, we have somehow veered off the path in our common pursuit of what is really true and good.
Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
well stated Oleteach.
For this reason I pick and chose when and where I get into conversations concerning religion or politics. Of course the topic in question is not either, but sensetive to say the least. I can recall many discussions when somebody would put a "whole" class of peoples into one little box because of the actions of one or a few. We need to always remember we are all unique even when we are in a group.
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top
I just wandered over here on a link from another site and found this an interesting topic. I have only one problem with some blacks, and it's the same problem I have with cell phone users. I'd like to tell everyone don't invade my hearing space with your loud voice. I rode the train to work everyday with a mix of people. About three to one if a group could be heard at the other end of the car, it would be a black group laughing and gabbing together. When I rode other suburban train lines that were predominently white, the noise level was way down. Many cell phone users show this lack of courtesy. If a cell phone user was around me, I would just start reading my book aloud, and mostly the books I choose to read are boring to others. They soon got the message. I worked in an office where the one black woman couldn't lower her voice when she was on the phone. We had to learn every detail of her extended nice but dysfunctional family. It's a matter of manners rather than skin color.
Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
Many of us do not like to have our little worlds disturbed by people who think differently than we do. When they dare to point out what they see as glaring errors in our thinking, we are up in arms, ready to defend our position with emotional outbursts of rage, name calling, putdowns, and/or ridicule, just to name a few reactions that I have resorted to when my own “sacred cows” was being butchered by someone I might have labeled a “self-centered retard”.


This is exactly why I like to spend the first week or so agreeing with everything that is even half-way reasonable that somebody new says. Then they decide that I am insightful enough to be worth listening to.
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yet another piece of evidence it isn't the color of your skin but how IGNORANT you act.


Outstanding article once again....I love how you find words to express what many people feel but can't quite define....
Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top

I love how you find words to express what many people feel but can't quite define....

thanks but really it was little whips original work that framed it all out.

Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top
Hello boys and girls.

This was an excellent article Greywar - I read through it in it's entirety, and because you are a very skilled writer, with no deliberate intentions of provokation, I thought the article was brilliant, as you were able to articulate your beleifs in the space of an article, instead of making people angry with careless titles, and counting on 50+ comments to try and justify your opinion.

I have no argument with cultural diversity between Austrlia and America, all you need to know is that we have an urban culture here, and I am indifferent to blacks and whites, because you cannot categorise a colour of skin into participation of this urban culture.

There are white thugs, and black thugs, but I am not going to say I prefer the company of whites, because they are less likely to be a thug - every individual person I come across, will be judged on their own merits... not someone else with the same skin colour.

If some people are scared of the PC police, maybe they should take some time to actually think about what they are writing, instead of deliberate attempts to provoke in order to get points... LW - you knew exactly what kind of reaction you would get, and you revel in it...

BAM!!!
Reply #25 from JoeUser Forums Top

Muggaz - Thanks:) I stopped reading the commentary on the other thread when I ran out of trollings for the Godwin-festival so I didn't catch the Aussie bits... nonetheless

There are white thugs, and black thugs, but I am not going to say I prefer the company of whites, because they are less likely to be a thug

This may not be the case in your country, but here in the US we have concentrated our black population into areas where the "thug-life" (hip-hop's term not mine) is promoted heavily. hence the percentage here are quite different.

every individual person I come across, will be judged on their own merits...

A good policy when you can afford it. I count myself lucky to be able to do this most of the time. In other situations liek say... downtown LA this policy would be ill advised at best.