Argentina Will Face Brasil in Historic Final

First Time Since 1937

http://copaamericaperu2004.com
from JoeUser Forums


On Sunday Argentina will face Brasil in the final of the Copa America, the oldest international soccer tournament. Argentina and Brasil are widely thought to be the best two teams in South America, and two of the best in the world. Brasil has five World Cup Championships (the most of any country) and Argentina has two. (The only other teams that have more are Germany and Italy.) In the Copa America, however, Argentina has 14 championships, while Brasil has only 6. (Note on Uruguay as third contender.)

The Copa America is the oldest international soccer tournament in the world, having been contested 41 times since 1910, but its format is inconsistent at best. Over the course of its history, it has mostly been held using the "League Format", where each team plays each other once and the winner is determined by points. Sometimes the teams were divided into two groups with the top two teams from each group forming a final round-robin league.

Nine out of the 41 Copa America competitions, including every Copa since 1993, has been a true "Cup Style" tournament, with a group-based first round, then quarter-finals, semi-finals, and a final matchup. (Some of these matchups were home-and-away mini-series, but we will consider each of these faceoffs a single "finals".)

Thus, one might say Sunday's match is the ninth Copa America Final. One should also include, however, the five times out of 28 that the "League Format" Copa ended up in a tie in points for the top two teams, and the winner was determined by a play-off. Thus, really it will be the 14th Copa America FINAL.

Of these 14 finals, the continent's two best teams, Argentina and Brasil, believe-it-or-not have only met once before in a Copa America final...in 1937! This game, held in Buenos Aires in front of 60,000+ fans (one reference says 80,000), apparently was a fierce battle, holding at 0-0 during regulation play. The match was stopped several times due to violent outbreaks, at one point being suspended for 40 minutes. The final result, however, was Argentina 2 - 0 Brasil with Vincente de la Mata scoring both goals in overtime play.

Overall, Brasil and Argentina have met 90 times since 1914 with Brasil having 34 wins to Argentina's 33. The last time they met, which was a World Cup 2006 Qualifier in June, Brasil won 3-1. Argentina will be keen on answering that recent loss with a victory, while Brasil may be seeking revenge from that 1937 loss.

For US viewers:
South American soccer is tough to view in the US, but the Copa America Final will be available in most major US cable markets thanks to Univision. (Most people in the US know this as "the spanish channel").
Coverage starts at 3:30 EST, 12:30 PST, Sunday July 25.
For more coverage info, visit http://zap2it.com. If you don't get cable, call the latin bars/restaurants in your town and see if they're showing the game, or search the internet for streaming video (I haven't been able to find anything consistent myself.)

My Other Copa America Articles:
Copa America!!!
No GREECE in this Tournament
3,786 views 8 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
Nine out of the 41 Copa America competitions, including every Copa since 1993, has been a true "Cup Style" tournament, with a group-based first round, then quarter-finals, semi-finals, and a final match. Thus, one might say Sunday's match is the ninth Copa America Final. One should also include, however, the four times out of 28 that the "League format" Copa ended up in a tie in points for the top two teams, and the winner was determined by a play-off. Thus, really it will be the 13th Copa America FINAL.

In order to help you with this … and add to your work … the four times you mention are what years? I understand these are tie-breakers, prior to 1975?

Technically, a “Cup Style” tournament …can have a couple different formatts, for example:

1) The Champions League and the UEFA Cup where it is played as home and away and only the final is played in one game.
or
2) The Libertadores Cup and The Sudamericana Cup where all matches in the knock-put stages, including the final, are played on a home and away formatt.

Having said this … the tournaments of 1975, 1979 and 1983 used the formatt of Libertadores or Sudamericana as in #2 Hence, these are 3 finals not included in your count of finals. As an extra description to these three finals … the number of points on both games decided the winner. If they tied in points, an extra game was forced to determine the winner. If the 3rd game, played at a neutral site, was tied … only then the goal average of the games was used. In 1979, Paraguay won the title even thou the 3rd game was a 0-0.

Also, I must add that prior to 1993, on 1987, the tournament also had a final, in which Uruguay beat Chile 1-0. Chile had been the surprise of the tourny beating Brazil 4-0 in the first round and hence winning their group. Uruguay, reigning champ, joined the three top qualifiers of the group stage, and became champion playing only 2 games, as the reigning Champ would join the semis automatically.

I hope this helps.
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
In order to help you with this … and add to your work … the four times you mention are what years? I understand these are tie-breakers, prior to 1975?


I'm glad you had me look it up, because I MISSED ONE!

There were five tie-breaker playoffs:

1919, 1922, 1937, 1949, 1953

I'll fix this in the main article.

My main source is:

http://www.rsssf.com/tabless/sachampfull.html
Groupy 2 - Organize multiple applications into grouped tabs on your Windows desktop
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
Technically, a “Cup Style” tournament …can have a couple different formatts, for example:1) The Champions League and the UEFA Cup where it is played as home and away and only the final is played in one game. or2) The Libertadores Cup and The Sudamericana Cup where all matches in the knock-put stages, including the final, are played on a home and away formatt.


I guess there is a third type too, where all games are treated as single knock-out stages, like the Euro Cup. No compensation for home field advantage is given. This is evidenced by the fact that 52.5% (!!!!!) of all tournaments that had a clear home-field advangtage resulted in a host champion (20 out of 38).
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
Having said this … the tournaments of 1975, 1979 and 1983 used the formatt of Libertadores or Sudamericana as in #2 Hence, these are 3 finals not included in your count of finals. As an extra description to these three finals … the number of points on both games decided the winner. If they tied in points, an extra game was forced to determine the winner. If the 3rd game, played at a neutral site, was tied … only then the goal average of the games was used. In 1979, Paraguay won the title even thou the 3rd game was a 0-0.


You're right, that makes it a little more complicated.

1975:

COL - PER 1:0 in Colombia
PER - COL 2:0 in Peru
PER - COL 1:0 in Venezuela

I'm not sure why the third game was played, since the point total was PER 2 : 1 COL after the second game. Any ideas?

1979:

PAR - CHI 3:0 in Paraguay
CHI - PAR 1:0 in Chile
PAR - CHI 0:0 in Argentina

Paraguay is Champion based on goal difference (3:1)

1983:

URU - BRA 2:0 in Uruguay
BRA - URU 1:1 in Brasil

So, it's true then that there have been 19 total final games, but I would probably still say there have been 14 Copa America Finals ...it is in the same sense that the NBA finals are actually as many of 7 individual games, but that particular matchup is called "the finals" ...it is very confusing either way one considers it. I will try to make a footnote which clarifies it as much as possible what I mean by a final.

I don't believe any other Copas were done in this fashion, but I haven't fully checked it. Can anyone else look into it?
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
Also, I must add that prior to 1993, on 1987, the tournament also had a final, in which Uruguay beat Chile 1-0.


I think I included 1987 in my original count of "Cup style" tournaments. I'll recount though to be sure.

I hope this helps.


Your comments help very much! THANKS!
Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top

I didn`t know much about Copa America history, thus this article was highly informative and interesting for me. Very good work!
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
Nice little bit of history Robert. Missed the bit about the tournament being created to celebrate Argentina's First Centenary (100 years of independence) or did you just leave it out as irrelevant? All the best. Pach
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
Nice little bit of history Robert. Missed the bit about the tournament being created to celebrate Argentina's First Centenary (100 years of independence) or did you just leave it out as irrelevant? All the best. Pach


Left it out because I really wasn't writing an article about the history of the tournament itself. Maybe that would be good to add in though.