The Mommy Dilemma

To Sleep or Not To Sleep?

So here I am trying to do some catch up work on the computer. I have my household budget on Quick Books and am doing much needed data input. In the background is a screaming 10 month old baby. His mommy, my d-i-l, is not feeling well and my heart goes out to her. I remember those days. She came down with a cold yesterday. I remember taking care of my babies and being so exhausted I couldn't think straight especially when I was ill. So after spending the day chasing the little boy around the house she decided to go to bed early with him. I think maybe that wasn't such a good idea now because it's 10:30 and he's in an on and off crying mode..

She's a great mommy. She's doing a great job with Ethan. She's very attentive and reminds me of me. We both had our first at the same age. We both were very inexperienced with babies. Actually she's a few months younger than I was when I had my first. I was determined to be the best mom the second they put that beautiful newborn into my arms. My son, in contrast to Ethan tho, was a very quiet and submissive baby. He was sleeping well by the end of his first month. I never ever woke up with him in the middle of the night after that.

Ethan's a healthy happy baby until he isn't the center of attention, that is. He's absolutely perfect looking. He's charmed everyone he's come into contact with. One thing I think she's just starting to understand about this beautiful little boy is that he's very strong willed. He's got her wrapped, totally, and I can see she's exhausted. He's a master manipulator and is going to be just like his daddy. I guess the apple doesn't fall far from the tree afterall.

My son and she are are alone in another state with no family, so they have been at this new parenting thing virtually all by themselves. With Brian working so often, much of this child rearing is on her shoulders.

Her first week here she spent alot of time trying to cajole him to sleep sometimes taking two hours or so to do so. One night he just flat out refused to be cajoled still wide awake at 11 pm. He's in the habit of going down to bed asleep in his mommy's arms since birth. He's very big now and this is getting harder and harder to do. Big mistake we told her. It's time he goes down awake. He may cry (and he did) some but it's time for him to go to bed and for mommy to have some down time. She needs a break. She's exhausted.

The first night he cried for about an hour or so and she was a wreck. Her goal I think has been to avoid any confrontation with crying as much as possible. He lived. He actually woke up the next day seemingly in a good mood. None the worse for wear. The next night he cried again and by the third night or so only cried for 10 minutes. Of course her reaction was total and absolute freedom. It was starting to look up.....until tonight.

The bad thing is I have to work all day tomorrow so she's on her own. I hope she eventually gets some sleep tonight. All is quiet now and it's 11 pm. So maybe. But he's yet to sleep thru the night so he'll probably re-awake about 2 or 3 or so. But just maybe this crying jag tonight will have worn him out enough to make it thru. We'll see.

Maybe she'll let me have him one night, so she can get a whole night of uninterrupted sleep. Just Ethan and Nanny. I can always call in the reinforcement. His name is Papa and Ethan is just crazy about him.






10,897 views 91 replies
Reply #1 Top
Haha, I am SOOO glad you are not my MIL and I'll bet your DIL has some interesting things to say about you behind your back!
Reply #2 Top
Nah, it seems right all that she is doing... it's just hard from the parenting aspect to do that.... You hear your kid crying and your first response is to instantly do whatever it takes to stop them from feeling that pain... no matter how old they are.. it's just something built into us... sometimes we just have to let them cry though...
Reply #3 Top
LOL. M-Post, you don't have any kids. How can you know it's the right thing to do to let them "cry it out"? You do realize sobbing and wailing for an hour is HARMFUL for an infant, both physically and psychologically?
Reply #4 Top

The first child is so hard imo.  Let them cry?  Don't?  I went to both my boys immediately when they cried the entire first year.  They slept with me in a few hour jags, or in a bed by my bed until about 6 months.  I didn't want to get up and traverse the entire house every time they needed to nurse.

I hope Amanda's feeling better.  I also hope she realizes this is par for course if Brian plans on staying in the military.  She will be raising the kids on her own for the most part.  Especially since he is such a volunteer.  Heh.  They will have to negotiate how often he volunteers for something away from home or resentment will start to build.  Or at least that is my experience.

 

   

Reply #5 Top

Reply By: M-Post

Good to see you back M-Post! And of course you are right.  Babies cry.  One of the few maxims in the world.  A good parent knows when to coddle and when to let them.  But any cry is hard on the parents.

Reply #6 Top
Haha, I am SOOO glad you are not my MIL and I'll bet your DIL has some interesting things to say about you behind your back


you know TW...you're just not a very nice young woman.

My D-i-l didn't have to stay here with my husband and I. Her dad lives right here in town as does her grandmother. She CHOSE to stay here with us. Even her own mother wanted her to stay with her and Amanda CHOSE to come here instead. And we are having a very nice family time with her and the baby. It's been a very enjoyable few weeks. It's kind of nice to be able to bond with her without my son around. We will be sad to see them BOTH go.

In fact, TW. She's read alot of your comments here on JU and she thinks you're a know it all. Especially when it comes to parenting.

Let them cry? Don't?


We actually had about 12 ladies discuss this in a bible study this past week. All but one said (older experienced moms) you have to let them cry. Now we're not talking ignore them completely. But they have to learn. I really didn't have this problem because somehow I heard when I was going thru this time that I should put them down awake in their early days. I did so and they learned to be content. So it wasn't much of a problem with me. On occasion I did let them cry but that was when they were a bit older. I never really had trouble with bedtimes. Even when they were toddlers. I had three right in a row. I had to have order and time at night was very precious to me.

The young moms in our church are all reading a book called BabyWise and it's telling them also to let them cry for a few minutes, then go in let them see you and comfort them and walk out. One first time mom was amazed at how this worked. Within days she was putting her two month old down and she would go right to sleep. She's a happy healthy well adjusted baby. Even happier than she was before. This was after exhausting nights of not being able to get her down to sleep. She said the first night she and her husband held hands. It almost killed them to let her cry. Right now she's Amanda's greatest supporter.

To do otherwise means Amanda has to stay awake for two-three hours trying to get him down. That is not an option in my book. He's not a month old. He's a very smart cookie at 10 months old. The time has come.

A good parent knows when to coddle and when to let them. But any cry is hard on the parents.


exactly. I told Amanda to use her instincts. It's ok to let him cry. Before she was jumping up at every whimper. He had her trained and he knew it. She did too.

Today he was all smiles and grins. He comes crawling to us just as fast as he can when we walk in the door. Tonight he went to sleep without a problem. This is the first night he went down so well.



Reply #7 Top
I deleted you TW because I thought what you said was mean and hateful. I won't have that kind of talk here. If you want to be mean and spiteful on your own blog...go at it. Not here.

Reply #8 Top
I didn't use any curse words. I was not mean or spiteful. You deleted me because you were ashamed of the truth.

I think that says a lot.

(PS - Interesting that you didn't delete my FIRST reply. That WAS mean.)
Reply #9 Top
didn't use any curse words. I was not mean or spiteful. You deleted me because you were ashamed of the truth.


Well let's say that is a matter of opinion. It's very subjective. And it wasn't the truth. You were actually quite wrong on more than one point. Let's just say, I protected you as well.

(PS - Interesting that you didn't delete my FIRST reply. That WAS mean.)


I agree it was mean. You're right. Why would you relish that? Does it make you feel better to slam others?

But...you went overboard with your latest saying things that were absolutely untrue and hurtful not only to me but also to Amanda. She's a daily reader of this blog, and I thought what you said was very mean and spiteful. You can be mean to a point with me TW, but don't mess with my family.

Reply #10 Top
No worries. I have posted my comment as its own blog.
Reply #11 Top
PS - Be sure to call your son Wally Stevens and sick him on me.
Reply #12 Top
I think the fact she doesn't turn him over to you for the night says something, KFC.

I know it's tough, but I believe the best thing you can do as a mother-in-law and as a grandmother is to let the parents decide what is best.

As for the baby crying, let me relate a story, KFC.

Destiny (our oldest) was about 6 months old when the subject of her sleeping through the night came up. A good friend of ours was discussing it with us, and she gave us well intentioned but lousy advice.

Here is what you do, she said, take the phone off the hook, put her down and let her cry herself to sleep. Go into the other room and just bite the bullet, eventually she'll cry herself to sleep.

We did as suggested, checking in only occasionally to check her diaper and to see if she was hungry. It was hard, but we rode through for one full hour. At the end of that hour, Destiny had not given up trying, and we went into retrieve her. We have never repeated that stunt since. And I would not advise any parent to do it.

The truth is, when you're a new parent, you get twenty different opinions from twenty different people. As a veteran now, there is only ONE piece of advice I give new parents: when your child sleeps, drop everything and sleep. You'll be glad you did at 3 am.
Reply #13 Top
That's why Gid, as Tova said, there are varing opinions out there.

I had three kids as well. I know what worked for us. I also know many families that have 6-7 children. They also let their kids cry on occasion. It does work. When you have 3-4-5 kids you can't rock everyone to sleep everynight. It's just not feasible. God help the ones that have triplets if they are rocking each one to sleep for 10 months (or longer) to get them to go to sleep. The problem is when they wake up, as in the middle of the night, they will cry because they don't know how to fall asleep on their own.

Each child is different and there are varibles involved so none of this is cut in stone here. When they are sick, rock em! When they are not and just are willing themselves to stay up, train them. That's what's going on here. He doesn't want to miss a thing and everytime he wakes up whether it be in the middle of the night or even in the am he cries. He never wakes up talking or being content. Never. Because he doesn't know how to be content by himself.

Now I'm not talking newborn here. That's a whole nuther ball game. But there comes a point when you need to train the child to sleep at night. He's at that stage and then some. That would be my opinion as well as most of the moms I've come in contact with.

In fact, I loved to rock my kids. I told Amanda when she was pregnant the best thing to get was a rocking chair. I had two boys 11 months apart. I'd rock one on each leg every day. But I almost always put them down to bed awake, not fully alseep.

All I can think of right now is Suzannah Wesley. She had 19 children of her own. She, herself, was one of 25. She was a very disciplined and good mom and I'm sure she wasn't jumping at every cry and whimper.

The children will not die or be damaged if they cry. They will learn to be content when they realize the crying isn't going to produce what they are expecting to happen. He's already learning that. They learn quick.

when your child sleeps, drop everything and sleep. You'll be glad you did at 3 am.


I agree with this. She's doing that as well. He's 10 months old and walking now. It's time he goes to sleep at night, but it is her decision. Of course. No one is making her or telling her what to do. She's an avid reader herself and is reading not only BabyWise but also many other books out there on this subject. She just wants him to go right down so she doesn't spend so much time trying to get him into bed.



Reply #14 Top
All I can think of right now is Suzannah Wesley. She had 19 children of her own. She, herself, was one of 25. She was a very disciplined and good mom and I'm sure she wasn't jumping at every cry and whimper.

The children will not die or be damaged if they cry. They will learn to be content when they realize the crying isn't going to produce what they are expecting to happen. He's already learning that. They learn quick.


And my wife is one of the best moms I can think of, yet she doesn't let them cry themselves to sleep.

My children are content, they aren't especially needy, and they know their boundaries. But none of them were put to sleep on their own at the age of your grandson. In fact, Joshua, at 6 months, still shares the bed with us, and probably will until he's about a year (depends on when he's comfortable sleeping next to Quinn).
Reply #15 Top
But none of them were put to sleep on their own at the age of your grandson


Again Gid, there is a whole bunch of stuff out there on this. If it works for you, then fine. That's great. I don't knock it. But to tell me I'm wrong or anybody that brings their kids up this way is wrong is not right. Every family has their own routines and schedules.

My kids were put in a bassinett until they outgrew it right next to my bed. When they graduated from that they went into a crib in the next room usually at about 3 months. That worked for us. Not a problem. While they slept some in bed with me as a newborn since I was nursing, it was rare. Usually they were ok for the most part in their little bed right next to me. They all grew up well adjusted and fine young men.

This is a very debatable subject (as you know).

Reply #16 Top
Every family has their own routines and schedules.


Umm, actually, that's my point, KFC.

Your son and daughter in law are their own family now. You're very right, of course, and I would never for a second argue that you didn't raise your children to the best of your ability. All I am saying is that your son and daughter in law have the right to do the same.

Yes, it is a debatable subject. You might win points if you let them have THEIR side on it
Reply #17 Top
You might win points if you let them have THEIR side on it


and who says I'm not?

To have an opinion and to demand a result are two diff things. When Amanda asks, I answer. She's been asking. I answer.

She's the one that will have to go home with him. We are not going to be there. So obviously they have complete control of their family, not us. In fact this is only the second time we've even seen them since he was born. She's looking for a better way since she's getting tired of the long fussy nighttime routine.





Reply #18 Top
Especially since he is such a volunteer. Heh. They will have to negotiate how often he volunteers for something away from home or resentment will start to build. Or at least that is my experience.


TOVA

Yes, I agree. He's built up quite a bit of leave time but he keeps getting involved in a new project. Amanda said he can only build up so much before he starts to lose it. He wants to get ahead and he seems to love to work. He's been in over two years so far and no vacation yet.

I suggested he should take some of that leave time and be with his family soon. They need him and it would be good for him as well to get some R&R. He downplays it, but I'm hoping he LISTENS TO HIS MOTHER!!! .





Reply #19 Top

As for the baby crying, let me relate a story, KFC.

With each of ours, they chose when to sleep through the night.  OUr oldest started at 6 weeks, and the others from 2 months to 4 months.  That is what I found out with the 3rd baby.  The first was an easy one, the second was a bear. So when the 3rd was born, I was looking to see which one she would take after.  The answer was - neither!  So we were not surprised with the 4th had his own idiocyncracies.

Funny thing about Grandparents.  We may not think they know much when we start out in life (as our parents), but they sure get wise after we have raised our own!

Reply #20 Top
Amanda said he can only build up so much before he starts to lose it.


It's called 'use or lose' status, and it happens if you have 60 days or more of leave at the end of the fiscal year (October). AF Personnel get 30 days of paid leave per year.

I can't say anything nice about your article, so I'm going to shut up now.
Reply #21 Top

Big mistake we told her. It's time he goes down awake. He may cry (and he did) some but it's time for him to go to bed and for mommy to have some down time.

Hmmm...that sounds a lot like "I know best", even though you are trying to say that you are merely giving helpful advise.

Each kid is different, and some are just more insecure and needy.  10 months old is still a baby.  Does she work?  Does she have a reason (other than "me" time) that she can't hold her baby to get to sleep?

My daughter was colicky and would cry until she threw up if I let her.  I rocked her to sleep or held her for the first year of her life.  She needed that, and it would have been selfish of me not to fulfill that need.  I used to go to work in the morning with very little sleep, but that was a sacrifice that I was willing to make so that my baby would get the comfort that she needed.

If the baby isn't content, there is probably another reason other than he hasn't been "trained" right.  Some babies are only a couple months old when they sleep through the night, others are a year+.  If a baby cries, there is a reason, to ignore that just seems like selfishness to me.

Reply #22 Top
I suggested he should take some of that leave time and be with his family soon. They need him and it would be good for him as well to get some R&R. He downplays it, but I'm hoping he LISTENS TO HIS MOTHER!!!


hahaha.

Well if they need money....he can sell 30 days back to the gov. But I wouldn't recommend it as a LT. Better to wait until it is really necessary (and he's a high rank and gets more $ for it, heh.)

I think Amanda is a great mom. I also think its nice she has a family who cares and is willing to help her. Not everyone is so fortunate.

Maybe she needs to sit down with Bri, look him in the eye and tell him, "TAKE TIME OFF! The AF survived 60 years without you, it can certainly make it a month or so more. If you disappeared tomorrow off the face of the earth, the AF wouldn't even notice, they'd fill your slot and move on. But I would notice...Ethan would notice! We need some time with you."

If that doesn't work...she can always call his boss and tell him to order Bri to take some time off...hahahaaha. (Wives actually do that sometimes. My husband gets a few calls a year from wives wanting hubby to take time off, or wanting to know if the AF is MAKING him go TDY or if he volunteered.) If Brian has a good commander, that commander will listen to Amanda........just a thought.

Reply #23 Top
She needed that, and it would have been selfish of me not to fulfill that need. I used to go to work in the morning with very little sleep, but that was a sacrifice that I was willing to make so that my baby would get the comfort that she needed.


Karma, I am not attacking but would like to use this to make a point.

Who was meeting her needs while you were at work? Your husband? What if your husband wasn't available? What if you lived in a new state with no friends or family around to help? Would you leave her with strangers and hope they met her needs? Is that selfish?

Here is my point. (Bet ya didn't think I'd get to it did ya?) I believe most parents do their best for their kids. A new parent can go crazy trying to keep up with rock don't rock, back or stomach or side, black and white mobile or color, nursing or bottle, work or don't work, crib or family bed, solids at 5 months or breast milk until a year....

It goes on and on as I am sure you know.

The two people here that love baby Ethan and want the best for him are KFC and Amanda. Amanda may not make every perfect decision, but she does need some down time to be an effective mother. The only time she can get (with her husbands working schedule) is at night. I can understand wanting the support of the MIL while trying to train a baby to fall asleep. It is hard and heart wrenching...and whether its best or not is debated and probably always will be. But for this mom, for this family, it is what is needed, what is in fact best for the family.

I think we should support new young moms, help them when they ask, and not be offended when they ignore all our wonderful advice!

Reply #24 Top
Life as a mother, as far as I can tell, is a constant struggle between what you want and what your kids want. It's a balancing act. Resenting your baby isn't good for anyone. Ignoring your baby isn't good for anyone, either. If the holding the baby all night path isn't working, why not try the cry it out path? Oh no, the baby may be emotionally scarred forever! Yeah right. Maybe if you hold the baby to put it to sleep it'll have insomnia for its entire adult life. All babies are different, and all parents are different. I really think it's silliness to criticize anyone's parenting decisions unless it's negligent or abusive. The crying it out method worked for my oldest. He did not cry for an extended period of time, but sometimes, as parents, we would get so frustrated with him that it was better off for everyone to take a break from night-night time, and we would put him in his crib... lo and behold, after 15 minutes, he was asleep.

Holding them until they fall asleep isn't abusive, either - bonding with your parent is great. That's how we put my oldest to sleep most of the time - the CIO happened when he would wake back up as we put him in his crib (one of the most frustrating baby maneuvers).

With our youngest, he puts himself to sleep at night, and we put him to sleep for naps. He does not cry though, and if he does we check on him because it means something's wrong. But when he cries just because you put him down, it's frustrating - especially when you've been holding him all day long, too.
Reply #25 Top
I can't say anything nice about your article, so I'm going to shut up now.


Thanks dharma. I think that's the kindest and wisest thing you've ever said to me.

My husband gets a few calls a year from wives wanting hubby to take time off, or wanting to know if the AF is MAKING him go TDY or if he volunteered.) If Brian has a good commander, that commander will listen to Amanda........just a thought.


ha! All I could think of is the husbands getting all embarrased about their wives calling on their behalf. Amanda read all you wrote Tova and she's getting some great ideas!!! Thanks for the info.

But when he cries just because you put him down, it's frustrating - especially when you've been holding him all day long, too.


Yes, this is where Amanda is with Ethan. He's not crying because anything is wrong but because he's willing himself to stay up. He doesn't want to miss a beat but ends up cranky because he's not sleeping.

Good stuff Jythier. Again you're pretty much in line with my way of thinking as well.