Liberal until it's inconvenient or costs the liberal money

Is that how things work in liberal land?

I recently offered a flip, smart-alecked, response to a very minor point that a regular here at JoeUser.com (and the affiliated Stardock.com sites) had made.  The original article is here: Putting myself on a spending freeze, with the following snippet and discussion broken out below for clarity:


original snippet:

The shock of $4.15 per gallon of milk is added incentive. Holy crapstains, Batman! $4.15 FOR A GALLON OF MILK!!!?!?? I'm all for saving the planet but ethanol people I blame this on you. Do I think that it's all good until it affect my pocketbook? Yep, so whatcha gonna do about it?

Call you the hypocritical liberal that you are.

That inspired the following reply:

blah  

My point is that I have no problem making the sacrifices that will make a difference. Ethanol appears to be at best a feel good measure that really is not going to make a big difference to the environment. It does raise the price of corn which raises the price of dairy, beef and pork. It's one thing to know this intellectually. It's another thing to see the results at the grocery store every week.


Having had the thoughts in my head, rumbling around a bit over the last few days, I still want to revisit this discussion, and apparently my reply caused the original poster to revisit this sub-set of their original article as well, as the bulk of the text above was added a little later to the originally simplistic 'blah' reply.

I guess the original response I made was taken a bit harshly, and perhaps it should be, as one of the points of making that reply -- besides scoring some quick and easy smart-aleck points -- was to get the person that made the original comments to think about what they had just said, and how hypocritical their comments come across when they make them there.

I don't want to generalize here, but I guess I'm going to, as this just seems to be one example that proves the point that most liberals are fine and dandy in living with their liberalism UNTIL THE POINT THAT DOING SO IMPACTS THEIR OWN BOTTOM LINE.  Once that happens, once the liberal sees an impact upon themselves, then whoa!  Slow down!  Wrong target!  Wrong target.

This is something that just kills me to see, as liberals supposedly want the world to be a better place, especially for future generations and such, but only up to the point of it starting to inconvenience themselves.  Once it starts hitting home for them, rather than the rich fat cats, or whatever the target group is that they were originally going after, then the support for their goals, and any effort required at achieving those goals stops.

Clean air is a good thing -- unless it costs more money to buy goods at the grocery store.  Saving oil is a good thing -- unless it costs more money to buy food because we are using more ethanol.  You get the picture.  There is always an unless and until.

Why is it ok for liberals to save these conjunctions (back at good old Conjunction Junction, what's your function?) to pull out at just the right time?  In my mind, it's not ok.  I suspect in the minds of most reasonable individuals, it's not ok, but at the same time, liberals give other liberals passes on these sorts of issues all the time.

As Gideon noted in a couple of recent articles, taking swings at Michael Moore will get you tons of scorn and hatred back from the liberals as they protect one of their own.  The same holds if you take swings at Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Nancy Pelosi, Cindy Sheehan, etc.  God forbid the non-liberal that takes swings at these figures as they'll surely be villified for doing so.  But have one of these folks say something stupid, or trip themselves up on their own issues, and it will be ignored.

Heck, a recent example is Barrack Obama's threats against Pakistan.  (See Obama threatens Pakistan - is he right?)  As I pointed out in that article, if a conservative had made those statements they would definitely have been called threats, and all sorts of alarm bells would have gone off in the 'main stream media' (read: liberal media) over the same.  Because the comments were made by a liberal though, well, there can be no hypocrisy, right?

3,857 views 14 replies
Reply #1 Top

Daddy, daddy, can I live in liberal land?

No child.  The price (your safety and future well being) is just too high.

Reply #2 Top
Sadly, I know many conservatives who are the same way. I had a friend who was a dyed in the wool small government conservative who raised holy hell over the issues of charter schools in Wisconsin. Because basically he wanted THEM to foot the bill for him to educate his children at home.
Reply #3 Top
Take it however you want. I and others have written before about the fact that ethanol is not actually making the world a better place. It takes more fossil fuels to turn corn into ethanol than to burn oil in the first place. The unintended side effect is that we will see the results in our grocery bill. I was being flip when I made that final comment. I really do want to save the planet but I am trying to make small changes and also make changes that really accomplish something.

Like everyone I do have to look at how things affect me personally, especially when it comes to finances. I do homedaycare and probably buy at least five gallons of milk a week. It is a substantial part of my grocery budget and I do notice the price increases here more than other items. That doesn't mean that I don't care about the environment. If we made gas $10 a gallon, it would be great for the environment because at that price people would start conserving more, buying vehicles that get better gas mileage etc. but would I complain if gas went that high, yes, I would. Does that make me a hypocrite?
Reply #4 Top
Gee could this be compared to Hanoijohn and Drunken Ted wanting wind power, but not wanting the windmills in their backyard cause it would ruin the view? {Chesapeake Bay}
Reply #5 Top

If we made gas $10 a gallon, it would be great for the environment because at that price people would start conserving more, buying vehicles that get better gas mileage etc. but would I complain if gas went that high, yes, I would. Does that make me a hypocrite?

I would say the answer to your last question comes down to the reasons why you are complaining and/or just how much you are pushing for the changes that would affect you to begin with.

Take, as an example, the Clueless Old Liberal and his rants and raving for more taxes on the rich.  He screams blue bloody murder to get tax increases so that the budget can be balanced, the deficits can be wiped out, etc., and yet.... if he were to get his way and taxes did go up on the 'wealthy' and no noticable revenues were to come in to the government coffers, he'd be screaming ten times as hard as things started to hit his own personal bank account.

The people that wanted, and passed, the Alternative Minimum Tax were the protectors of the middle- and lower-classes in this country.  They passed the AMT because they deemed it necessary to tax away revenue from people that would otherwise benefit from cuts that were supposed to apply only to the lower- and middle-class.  Look who the AMT is hitting now though?  Since it hasn't been adjusted properly, and indexed for inflation, the AMT is putting a hurting on the middle-class and they aren't happy about it all.

Doing away with the AMT entirely would let 'the wealthy' off the hook.  Do you want that?  If not, who becomes the arbiter of who the wealthy really is, and how badly they should get smacked by the AMT and other taxes?

Hypocrisy comes in when you are preaching one thing, and supporting a certain position only to quickly abandon it when it impacts you.

I honestly don't know how much and/or how hard you've preaching for protection of the environment.  By memory, I would say you've spoken little on the topic of the environment and fuel conservation, but that's just what I've noticed.  I could be wrong and you could have written thousands of words on the subject that I've just ignored.  But, it is still a cause that someone that would call themselves a liberal would normally be pandering to the tree-huggers and global warming worry-warts for.

Both parties have their fringe elements, with the liberal side including people that seem to believe they are the ultimate protectors of the environment in much greater numbers than the conservative side does.  This could be an issue that you don't have a care in the world about, but if you do care, then I would say that yes, you are being hypocritical if you aren't willing to suffer the same pain and endure the same consequences that everyone else should be facing.

Reply #6 Top
Gee could this be compared to Hanoijohn and Drunken Ted wanting wind power, but not wanting the windmills in their backyard cause it would ruin the view? {Chesapeake Bay}


That's the famous NIMBY clause. It's great but Not In My BackYard.
Reply #7 Top
I don't want to generalize here, but I guess I'm going to, as this just seems to be one example that proves the point that most liberals are fine and dandy in living with their liberalism UNTIL THE POINT THAT DOING SO IMPACTS THEIR OWN BOTTOM LINE. Once that happens, once the liberal sees an impact upon themselves, then whoa! Slow down! Wrong target! Wrong target.


I keep saying and keep noticing that people continue to come up with ideas that seem to have good intentions behind them but fail to see the idea thru to the cons of it if applied in real life. They think we can just change one thing without affecting another.
Reply #8 Top
As Gideon noted in a couple of recent articles, taking swings at Michael Moore will get you tons of scorn and hatred back from the liberals as they protect one of their own. The same holds if you take swings at Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, Nancy Pelosi, Cindy Sheehan, etc. God forbid the non-liberal that takes swings at these figures as they'll surely be villified for doing so. But have one of these folks say something stupid, or trip themselves up on their own issues, and it will be ignored.


What I like most about this is how they try to protect the person who's view is inline with theirs while at the same time trying not to associate themselves with him.
Reply #9 Top

They passed the AMT because they deemed it necessary to tax away revenue from people that would otherwise benefit from cuts that were supposed to apply only to the lower- and middle-class. Look who the AMT is hitting now though?

That is the story of ALL tax increases.  They yell that today it is for the wealthy - yet over time, it hits the middle class and they dont want to cut taxes for any reason.  The only reason some are for cutting the AMT is that it is going to hit the high tax states the hardest - and almost without exception - they vote liberal.

Reply #10 Top
If we made gas $10 a gallon, it would be great for the environment because at that price people would start conserving more, buying vehicles that get better gas mileage etc. but would I complain if gas went that high, yes, I would. Does that make me a hypocrite?


It probably does make you a hypocrite but more importantly it makes you very short-sighted. Do you have any idea what the impact of fuel prices that high would have on the prices of everything else? Everything from raw materials gathering, transportation, production, to retail is directly affected by fuel prices. Suddenly raising fuel prices that high would almost certainly trigger inflation the likes of which this country has never seen.

You think ethanol is responsible for your higher milk prices? More likely it's the hikes in the prices of the diesel fuel burned in the trucks that haul the milk. There is a direct link between fuel prices and retail prices. If trucking companies have to pay more for their fuel that increase gets passed directly to the consumer.
Reply #11 Top
As I've tried to tell her elsewhere. (on the article that inspired this one.)


It is also because of fuel prices but the fact that corn prices have doubled is a big part of it too. The reason is that we are feeding corn to our cars instead of ourselves or our cattle. We should at least be using the non-edible parts of the corn to make cellulose ethanol.

Do you have any idea what the impact of fuel prices that high would have on the prices of everything else?


I don't think we SHOULD raise the price of gasoline. I'm just saying that to decrease our dependence on foreign oil a huge price increase would force us to change our usage patterns.
Reply #12 Top
I don't think we SHOULD raise the price of gasoline. I'm just saying that to decrease our dependence on foreign oil a huge price increase would force us to change our usage patterns.


Change just quite doesn't describe it completely. I would stop driving all together and get a bike. I would sell my car for $500 if I have to (keep in mind it's not worth more than $1200 right now.
Reply #13 Top
I'm just saying that to decrease our dependence on foreign oil a huge price increase would force us to change our usage patterns.


Which is not hard to accept when you live in an area where walking is an option. When you live 15 miles outside of town, it gets hairier.

I was starting a decent side business doing PC repair. The cost of gas has already pretty much forced me to give that up.I can't afford to drive 50 miles for a side job anymore. I'm thanking heaven I don't still work in the mines (60 miles one way commute) or the group homes (45 mile one way commute).
Reply #14 Top
I was starting a decent side business doing PC repair.


Not PC repair, but rather PC troubleshooting for me. And gotomypc is getting rich off me these days!