Does the Metaverse need people who don't care about scores?

I play the Metaverse but I don't think a posters 'street cred' should be determined by there posting games. Its more about what they put in their posts than number of medals and galactic ranking.

My 2 BC anyway.

Ah is that what those medals are for! I have been playing galciv for years now and never realised. Although i only recently started using the forum since galciv 2 is driving me crazy with a few issues that were not a problem in galciv 1

Yea i can never manage to run a full game in galciv 2 because it is now so bulshik handling large numbers of ships and constructors. And the 'sentry' option is useless and drives me crazy. Once i get too many ships, i get sick of the handling of them and start again.

Showing "Bling" doesn't really matter to me. I've only played a few metaverse games myself and that was awhile back. I stopped playing because I felt there was no reason posting to a highscore list if I prefer medium and large maps, since the scoring is so low on them. Also I've been around here long enough to know there is some people on here that don't play metaverse, but have really good knowledge of the game. I've also seen a few call others out on the level they play at, which can also be misleading. I've moved on from challenging, but that's still displayed even months later. It doesn't take long, a few posts at most, to see if a person deserves respect or just wants to be an idiot(whether intentional or not). The metaverse medals have nothing to do with it. That's just me though, as I've seen some that seem to think the "Bling" means your the man. Just my 2 cents  

i would agree, you can be a great gamer and have loads of medals, but then have the insight of a turnip. i used to think medals and rank where important but like age in real life, i think time on a game gives you a more mature outlook like in life.

My 2 BC anyway.

well put  

Absolutely yes. Although I can't imagine not caring about the score at all, I can certainly understand that it might not be someone's prime motivation. In fact it's probably more healthy if it's not your prime motivation.

I'm still fairly new to the game, particularly compared to some of the folks in my empire. They've been playing the game since GCI, through Beta testing of GCII, to today. One of the things they have to keep reminding me is to play the game for fun. They've seen many come and go, there's a bright flash in the pan, then they get burned out and are gone. If it's not fun, the points really don't matter very much, or for very long.

I think membership in an empire is a big part of being in the metaverse. Everyone can contribute. Some contribute more points than others but that's no big deal. There's more to contributing than points. There's a level of camaraderie that you otherwise miss out on. Our empire has folks that have long since given up the game but stick around to chat about whatever.

The street cred stuff is a partial factor. If I see someone's medals and I see they play suicidal or obscene or whatever I know they play the game and I would consider it as a factor in evaluating their opinion, particularly lacking any other information. That's not to say that there aren't players out there that are better than I am that haven't played a single metaverse game. It's just that it would take a long time and many discussions before I would realize that fact. When I see their medals I know without asking.

and just to add if ya play a mod you cannot play meta, which changes the balance yet again 

I have to agree with Fuels Chief. I played for about six months before posting a single game. I don't think that should have been held against me in any way as being less credible. I don't think the score is the point, at least to me that is. Take for example my empire, Arrakis Imperium. I'm a big fan of Dune. I've read all 7 novels and several story stories. I want folks to join who share that love for Frank Herbert's creation and think the Dune universe is a really cool piece of sci fi. Now having that restriction may mean that the Imperium will never see #1 but that wasn't my point in creating this empire.

A few folks in my Imperium haven't posted anything in months and I can live with that. I'm just pleased that they joined their characters from the Dune universe to my humble little empire.

I've seem some nasty posts on the discussion board lately, just plain rude stuff. You'd think folks get enough of that in real life. From what I can tell, some good gamers have been flamed off the forum and haven't returned, that's unfortunate. I still tip my hat to some of the scores I've watch you guys (and gals) out there post. As an old timer, who remembers, MOO II, Civilization I, and a host of other turn-based strategy games, I think the metaverse is a really cool opportunity. I would hate to see and limitations of participation placed within it in any way.

Play nice folks
Matching Fuel Chief's 2 BC with 2 of my own

must...fight...urge...to...rant-question...why Kevin Anderson has been hired to hack out formula prose to help undermine Frank Herbert's profound contribution to SF

But I'll happily say that this Metaverse empire/imperium talk is Greek to me and at once fascinating and horrifying. Is some form of popularity contest actually built into the Metaverse?

I've moderated at other forums that use a tally of posts to designate 'forum ranks'. There are a lot of people who seem concerned with just getting their post count high so they can think they're L337 or whatever, with no regard for whether their posts add anything relevant to a discussion. It's sort of the same with the medal displays for some people I think.

There are a lot of people who seem concerned with just getting their post count high so they can think they're L337

I admit (declare? yes, delcare, at least parenthetically) that I was one of those kids who got picked last during gym class. That's part of my excuse/reason for disinterest in both multiplayer-with-strangers (MMO) and score posting.

But I really should be PiledHigherandDeeper with a social scientist title, and my training in the ivory towers was mostly driven by an interest in information technology, so I'm wondering if more people like me should be talked into posting on the Metaverse so the Stardock devs have a richer dataset.

Beg pardon for getting pseudo-technical there...

Oh god, you have been locked in the tower too long

Rich data sets !!! You're causing flashback to my doctoral stats courses. A curse upon you If their data aint no good, then let the Drengin feast on them!

OK, I'm a documented Stardock fan, but I just took a moment to try setting up a Metaverse character and ran into an immediate intellectual property-based roadblock.

I have a serial number that worked enough somewhere in my past Stardock interactions that I recorded it in a "safe" place. When I finally tried using that serial number at the web site linked to the GCII Metaverse button, I got bounced, with and without hyphens.

For the record, I'm at the end of an off-duty day and was intending to join Wheeloffire's Empire of Standards thingy as Bugmonkey with a Wrench. I've no idea whether I'd've eventually posted a game, but the bounce w/o recognition of an SN that was at least once valid was offputting.

This is from the tail end of the sticky thread.

Can't find account info HELP IN HERE!

You best course of action is to email [email protected] with this problem. Be sure to include your email address and your serial number and they will be able to assist you further.

Good advice from Mumble.
I have three serial numbers, two sent by Stardock.
None of them work.
Support registered me and everything is fine now.

Is some form of popularity contest actually built into the Metaverse?

In my opinion, this question and the question posed by the original poster are looking at the issue from the wrong angle.

The Metaverse is. Period.

What people make of it is the real issue here. The players who are innately competetive in the rest of their lives (including those who wish they were competetive in life) are naturally drawn to the Metaverse because it fosters competition. There is a small but highly vocal minority of Metaverse players who make the Metaverse into a popularity contest, and who make it all about the scores.

This minority does not speak for everyone, but they speak loudly and often. And, I feel, they generate a very large portion of the negativity to be found in these forums. I mean, when was the last time you saw the dark side of Frogboy or CariElf outside of a Metaverse-related rant thread?

There have been two times since the game's release that I have been almost ashamed to be a Metaverse player. One was when the Metaverse scores were being recalculated, the other was when the preliminary announcement of the changes in v1.4 were announced. Both times, a small group of Metaverse diehards went apeshit all over the forums because their perfect strategies were threatened. Did they leave in protest? We should be so lucky; most of them are still around, adjusting their strategies and playing like everyone else.

I'd love to go on, but I do try not to rant. There is no time to explain; let me sum up. What I think the Metaverse needs is an infusion of players who take a more levelheaded approach to the game and to the Metaverse. I'm not suggesting literary vigilantism; we have competent and diligent moderators. What the rest of us need to do is be wary of the rants and not get caught up in them. Just ignore them and let them wither. One case in point, then I'm through.

In this thread: YOR Super Ability has to change Brad hints that in the future, starships may be limited to something under 20 movement points. If there is a big stink about this, where will it come from? Don't feed the trolls by arguing with them; if you have a well-reasoned argument, please just start your own thread.

Do people who don't care about scores need the Metaverse?   

Personally, I find it boring to take the time to milk a game for points. If the Metaverse awarded points for exciting games, amazing comebacks, fast victories etc. it might be fun to participate in. Until then, bleh, what is it good for?

The Metaverse is. Period.

I want to preface this with the statement that I've always found your posts to be reasoned and reasonable, usually with a fair amount of subtle humor. This post is consistent with your usual standards. But I do want to make a comment about the following statement.

There have been two times since the game's release that I have been almost ashamed to be a Metaverse player. One was when the Metaverse scores were being recalculated, the other was when the preliminary announcement of the changes in v1.4 were announced.

I wasn't here when the metaverse scores were recalculated so I can't comment on that. But besides the time the changes for v1.4 were announced, it was the same with the v1.3 changes as well as the DA changes, if not more so. I’m not quite sure why you picked the Yor Super Ability thread as an example, there have been at least three other threads on the same topic and most of these had more grief in them than that one.

Anyway, my concern is that you point a very broad accusatory finger that could, based on someone's subjective opinion, include pretty much anyone. You had a post in that thread, I had a number of posts in that thread, at 108 replies, a whole lot of folks had replies in that thread. Based on my subjective opinion, I could point to a few that I thought got a bit strident, but then your subjective opinion could be far different. So which of us are the trolls. Is anyone that disagrees with a purposed change and voices their opinion, a troll? I wouldn't think so, but that's just my subjective opinion.

At the risk of rambling, I'll end with an analogy (maybe it's an allegory, not quite sure). A few years ago Monster had a super bowl ad that shows a guy working with a bunch of monkeys (actually chimps) that sit around and do pretty stupid monkey type things. The next day everyone was talking about that ad convinced that they were that guy that worked with a bunch of monkeys. The question is that if *everyone* was convinced that they were the guy working with the monkeys, who were the monkeys? The answer is that *everyone* is at one time or other someone else's monkey. So if you point the troll finger at someone because they complain or object to a change, you need to realize that someone else's subjective opinion could possibly point the troll finger at you.

"I mean, when was the last time you saw the dark side of Frogboy or CariElf outside of a Metaverse-related rant thread?"


In a multiplayer one...?

I like playing the Metaverse a lot. It gives me something to shoot for, individual game score, rank. It gives me a reason to improve my game.

I have a game I finished a week or so ago that was one of the best games I've played. Unfortunately, the Metaverse will not let me post it. For some strange reason, I started getting an error stating my application serial doesn't match the serial on the server. However, I can still log-in and use my characters to start a Metaverse game. I would expect to get an error at that point if something was wrong with my authorization. I put in a support request, but I haven't heard back and it's been a couple weeks. I'm still playing Metaverse, but I'm going to have to hang-on to the end game saves in hopes they fix it for me. I'll be pretty discouraged if I can't post my games anymore.

Another two cents here. One of the reasons I post to the Metaverse is that there is no other in-game method of recording the results of a game. Also, it was obvious to me even before I started posting that I would never be in the top 25. It's never bothered me. I have been working to accumulate the medals, with a brief switch to another character when things got a bit repetitive. As for the 'street cred' bit, I have played a lot of games at a reasonable difficulty, yet I would never claim to be an expert, or even really close to it. I judge whether a person's advice is worth taking on, a) their forum standing, which is what it is there for, and on whether it sounds like it would work.

Honestly, I think many in this community view don't have a particularly high version of the Metaverse- especially those who wish MP was in the game. I've never felt scoring a game is a good way to determine a win or a loss.

The Metaverse has a few thousand people and maybe 50 care about their score.

I am interested in knowing if a player is capable of playing one game without cheating. That makes me less likely to flame a complaint.

Next, I want to know what level. This game is a different animal at different difficulty levels. Playing below normal and posting to the Metaverse is worse than not posting at all.

Finally, back to the cheating question: do you have a cheat flag next to your score?

The actual score is irrelevant. People do sit on their games and milk them.

I'm interested in simply winning. So back to your original question: Yes. The Metaverse needs people that don't care about the score. As there's no way to actually compete on scores without starting setup data, the score should be abolished for put in tiny print.

When I see their medals I know without asking.

Regardless, you are still judging the book by the cover, internet excuse or not.
As far as the Metaverse, I just don't care one way or the other. To call into question my playing ability also just doesn't really matter, and the Metaverse certainly doesn't convey whether someone knows how to play this game or not. To do all of this in fun is what it was meant to be, but unfortunately, there are some who make it their lives, or at least their "alter ego" lives.

I’m not quite sure why you picked the Yor Super Ability thread as an example

Actually, I did not intend to hold the Yor Super Ability thread up as an example of trolling. If I came across that way, I apologize - I was up past my bedtime and probably not at my most coherent. The only reason I brought up that thread was to point out the fact that ship speeds may be seriously reduced in future updates and that I expect that reduction to be the source of future controversy.

I don't think that everyone who complains is a troll; complaints are an entirely valid use of a discussion forum. I complain sometimes, as do many of us. The real target of my post above was the people who take it to extremes.

Here's a sample of what I was trying to write about. It's from comments on a journal entry: Galactic Civilizations II v1.4 Change Log. This is the v1.4 change log that I singled out above. The comments were about the fact that a 10% morale bonus was being removed from stock markets.

Thats BS. I can't take these constant radical changes to the game anymore. It's just too irritating. Sorry, but you lost me on that one.

I agree, it is really beginning to annoy me. Lately it has driven me to play GalCiv less and to start playing some of my other games more, I am tired of having to relearn the same game over and over, and each change making it less enjoyable of an experience.

Since 1.3 onwards u have adopted a policy of removing the fun, enjoyable elements of the game. Stock exchanges is just the latest one.

I won't quote any of Brad's responses here, because they should be taken entirely in context. My overall impression is that Metaverse whiners have royally pissed off the developers to the point where future games probably won't have a Meteverse component.

These are the sorts of things I hate to see, and why I makes long posts about them. Sorry for being unclear the first time.

I don't mind any of the changes the developers want. If people leave because of game mechanic changes, I hope the door doesn't hit them in the ass on the way out.

Brad has a game he's been working on for over 15 years. If he wants to reduce speeds, he can reduce speed. He knows a certain segment will always get upset. I think the speed controversy has generated some terrific ideas. I'd like to see power units in the ships place diminishing returns on engine speed. Add multiple power units, that costs space.

Looking at some Metaverse scores shows people set in their ways at a particular version. They are free to stay. Changes--even radical ones--can be fun to deal with. There's no life or limb at stake so instead of getting upset about the developer conspiracy revealed by "open admission", just put your two cents on how any given change will work for you and hope for the best.