Fleet Composition

Finding the right balance between purpose, numbers, ability, and cost.

from GalCiv2 Forums
Playing as the Drath, I'm currently in a long war with the Altarians, where I have equipped my ships with high-level missile weapons and ultimate invulnerability shields.

I generally try to balance out the amount of attack and defense on every ship I build. However, I'm finding this to be an issue.

The Altarians are currently equipping a mix of high-level beam weapons and shields. They are also including a fair amount of point defense.

My fleet mix is generally as follows:

1 Huge
2 Large
3 Medium
4 Small
6 Tiny

My huge and large ships, having been built very recently, equip the best technology available. The medium ships are very capable as well, although they are equipping outdated tech. The small and tiny ships are generally completely outdated, and serve as fodder.

So I'm at a cross roads. Generally speaking, when a fleet of mine enters battle, it leaves completely stripped of its small ships -- the Altarians are targeting my heavy-fighters, weak though they are. I don't think I've lost any mediums or above. While this is nice because it means I'm not forced to replace massively expensive ships, it is a pain because I do tend want to replace my fighters ASAP.

I've upgraded my heavy-fighter design with top-level equipment -- making them expensive. My newest small design includes 32 damage from missiles, and 36 defense against beams. This makes them, relative to their size, extremely expensive and time-consuming to produce.

It generally takes about 4 weeks to produce one -- and with about a dozen planets, refitting a 10 fleets (40 fighters) with an advanced design when my frigates and light-fighters are outdated is very difficult.

So I'm at a crossroads: do I build small and tiny ships with the intention of making them cheap and readily replaceable? Do I build small ships that are extremely capable, with the intention of making my fleets as lethal as powerful, even though they are likely to be more readily destroyed?

OR do I simply reduce the number of ships in a fleet, filling out my fleets with frigates (mediums), which seem to be the best balance?

How do you plan out your fleets?
strategies
14,881 views 21 replies
Reply #1 from Stardock Forums Top
Perhaps you could equip your tiny fighters with just enough power to take less than a week to produce (since they are going to die anyways, do you really need to spend 4 weeks on them?), then set one planet to mass-producing them and use your other planets to build your fleets regularly.
Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I usually go for medium sized ships myself. I also sometimes tech up to huge hulls, and load up mediocre weapons, great shielding and LOTS of engines. Because experience is related to how powerful your ship is in relation to theirs, I don't want insane overkill. Once I've gained a level (or 20), then I turn it into an uber ship
Ashes of the Singularity II
Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Yeah, that's the way I go about upgrading when I don't have enough credits on hand. I simply reserve the honor of better weapons for higher-level vessels.
Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I never take the level of a ship into account, i normally upgrade a class of ship as a whole, money permitting with often mixed results.

Should i be paying attention to the higher level ships, and what type of advantages should one see with the higher level ships?
Reply #5 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I'd generally say that you should try and repair higher level ships. Getting a ship to a high level can increase its HP significantly; I've had large ships grow to be much stronger than huge ships, and I've seen mediums become as robust as large vessels.

So if I have a ship that's high level, but low tech, I upgrade it.
Reply #6 from GalCiv2 Forums Top


Genraly I like to have bigger ships with more deffense, but the size and quality of ships you build depends on your situation.

Perhaps you could equip your tiny fighters with just enough power to take less than a week to produce (since they are going to die anyways, do you really need to spend 4 weeks on them?), then set one planet to mass-producing them and use your other planets to build your fleets regularly.


I could not agree more. If your small and tinys are getting destroyed left and right then why spend the money on them.

As for a good strategy, are you using starbases? If not I would build a few big military starbases in the main combat areas and use them to destroy anyone who comes close.
Reply #7 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
As for a good strategy, are you using starbases? If not I would build a few big military starbases in the main combat areas and use them to destroy anyone who comes close.


Like you I also can't agree more. I always have military bases covering my planets, and squadrons of tiny fighters to guard them and intercept intruders. they only have an attack of one for each weapon type (you can fit all 3 on after you have researched all the miniturisation techs, and built the shrinker), and the starbases boost their attack to about 55 when maxed out. they cost about 100 to build, so only a week or two at even the least productive planets. hence easily replaceable.

I build separate fleets for battles outside my space, normally a huge escorted by 2 large and 5 mediums, with the weapons/defense tweaked so that huge is targeted last and mediums first. I always use the best technology, and have evenly balanced defense and offense, usually a mixture of all 3 types as i can't be bothered tailoring them to the enemy (except for the mediums, i tailor their defence since they have the least space, and I don't like losing them).

I also don't like upgrading, so i don't actually build these fleets until i've researched all the weapons/defence/engine techs.

In a war I let the enemy come to me, wiping out all their good ships with my fighters, then going on the offensive with my fleets.
Reply #8 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
@darth Silliness
Why not tweak the Huge ship to be the first target in the fleet? It would seem like that ship would be much harder for the enemy to destroy?
Reply #9 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
As for a good strategy, are you using starbases? If not I would build a few big military starbases in the main combat areas and use them to destroy anyone who comes close.


Yorman - are you implying that you can attack things with starbases? I thought starbases could only BE attacked. Holy crap, did I not know this the whole time?? Can I tell a starbase to shoot enemies?

Reply #10 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Why not tweak the Huge ship to be the first target in the fleet? It would seem like that ship would be much harder for the enemy to destroy?


Just how i like to play at the moment, i don't really see much point in designing and building escorts if they don't actually escort. I might as well only build huge ships (i actually did play one game where i only had large ships, its quite a good way to play).

And there's something disheartening about watching your flagship get overwhelmed by the enemy while your smaller ships hide amongst the wreckage. Which can happen, since all the defenses simply won't help in some contests.
Reply #11 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Yorman - are you implying that you can attack things with starbases? I thought starbases could only BE attacked. Holy crap, did I not know this the whole time?? Can I tell a starbase to shoot enemies?


No starships cannot move or attack (although i once had some thing happen which appeared to show my starbase shooting at a nearby planet, however i think it was a bug since i couldn't tell if anything was affected ny it).

I believe he means use fleets that are supported by the starbase to destroy the enemy, not use the base itself.
Reply #12 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Can I tell a starbase to shoot enemies?


No, but military starbases can add nice bonuses to the attack and defense of nearby ships.
Reply #13 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I design each ship class to be the most powerful at my current tech level. Then I just put them together into a powerful fleet. Simple and works really great.

I don't use military starbases anymore, not built one in over 20 games, I think they r for newbie's, experienced players just don't need them. The drawback that they r fixed positions and cannot move is just to big. They require to many constructors to build as well to be useful.
Reply #14 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I only build a military starbase on a resource in my own territory to deny it to the AI.
Reply #15 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I think optimum fleet construction depends on your relative tech level.

With a large or even moderate tech lead, you may well be able to design almost invulnerable huge ships, in which case why bother with the smaller ones? You *will* need to micromanage a bit to take full advantage though...withdraw damaged ships from the front lines to repair.

If you're way behind in the tech race, the smallest ships packed with heavy offence you can get away with that will overcome the enemy defences are the way to go (basically, you *are* going to lose material - so you want to inflict as much damage as possible, and the enemy firing on small ships means they'll be "wasting" a lot of their damage potential each round).

If things are more even, the best combo depends on what is being sent at you.
Reply #16 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
If you're way behind in the tech race, the smallest ships packed with heavy offence you can get away with that will overcome the enemy defences are the way to go (basically, you *are* going to lose material


I used that strategy against the dread lords. Worked incredibly well to take out their uber-ships.
Reply #17 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Smaller ships should be primarily defensive units. The AI does target them first. My fleets are primarily composed of Small hull destroyers with 20+ points of defense versus the primary weapons of my enemies, with a smattering of weapons matching my primary type, I like beams.

My main units are usually Huge hull ships, which have a reasonable level of defense, which for them is 30+ points, given their mass, I can slap enough defense to make them nigh on invulnerable to a weapon type, if I wanted to, and something over 50 points of weapon output, depending on tech level. I like slamming out beam weapons once my research machines are in full swing, so before the first one slips out of dock, its running second generation phasers at a minimum, disruptors if the diplomats do their job. I also have medium and large hull units, but they tend to work solo as a raider unit, or support for the main formations. I've come to view them as somewhat expendable, where I'll keep the destroyers and dreadnoughts bouncing back and forth between the front lines and the border colonies for repairs. The dreadnoughts are a harsh offense, while the destroyers are better for planetary defense, and damage sponging for the main units.

Even though I don't often upgrade existing units with generational improvements, I'm constantly cycling my destroyers with new technology. Nothing like throwing a Destroyer group at a Drengin fleet each mounting three Aereon Missile Defense rigs ahead of a pair of Dreadnoughts packing over a hundred points of beam damage each.

The less advanced units get farmed out as gifts to races that I'm looking to court for alliances, or are doing a decent job of making a nuisance to a race I'm fighting, as a new generation of support ship comes online. My dreadnoughts never leave my fleet, being constantly updated as needed, even if I go into debt.

Reply #18 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Generally I build Huge ships with large amounts of offense, and I use smaller ships that are more defense oriented. The smaller ships act as a protective screen. They're smaller they're cheaper and easier to build, which makes them more expendable.

I design ships to specialize in home defense or intersteller offense. Generally defensive ships will have no engines or life support modules added to them, (speed and range is compensated for more weapons or armament). Orbital defense is a must. These ships will only protect planets. Offensive ships will have added engines and life support modules on board. These ships have great range and speed for high mobility and deployability. Transports are also always designed with speed in mind (you want to conquer worlds using a sort of blitzskreig strategy, launch a preemptive attack and do as much initial damage as possible).
Reply #19 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
transport speed seems to be key. My last game I built a transport with 3 adv. troop modules and 27 speed, I could move them from my production planet to my population planets and get them to the front line fleet in 1 turn, next turn I could blitz multiple enemy planets, taking anywhere from 4-5 per turn. This was a large galaxy as the Drath
Reply #20 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
To have the AI target my Small ships, should I gear them with high defense or high offense to grab their attention, or does the AI automatically choose them?

With the planet defenders, could the player build a bare hull with engines, fly it to its destination, then upgrade it to all weapons/defense/no engine/no support?
Reply #21 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Ships are targeted by the formula Total Attack / (Total Defense + HP). So all you need to do is make sure the ships you want to be shot at first have the highest result from that formula. Starbase bonuses are not included in the calculation.