My tribute to September 11th

Posted on WC

https://www.joeuser.com/index.asp?AID=130068

I made a news item on WinCustomize.com tonight about the 5th anniversary of 9/11.  It's always a touchy thing putting up a political hot potato on WinCustomize.com.  One thing I have learned over the years is that many non-Americans who visit WinCustomize.com have an extremely poor opinion of the US, its policies.  I don't think that's representative of foreign readers of WC, just those who happen to post.

But 9/11 was a big deal. And at the end of the day, we're an American company.  We have people from all over the world that we work together with. A good portion of our development team is from UK for instance and we also have developers in Italy, Poland, and elsewhere.  But we are not neutral. What happened on 9/11 was unprovoked, monstrous, and required a strong response.

If nothing else, people, especialy people outside the US, need to understand how big of a deal 9/11 was in the United States.  I don't think most people, even today, realize the scale of 9/11.  There's been no terrorist attack, anywhere, in history that is remotely on the scale of 9/11.

The twin towers, even when pictured, don't show their scale because the pictures are so far away.  The twin towers alone supported a population that about a quarter of Detroit Michigan. And those two buildings weren't the only ones that were destroyed as a result (a couple of other nearby buildings were also destroyed).  Largely, only by luck, was the death toll not catastrophically higher. 

The twin towers, supporting up to 150,000 people when at full capacity, were cities unto themselves. Cities full of innocent people who had just gone to work that day.  Destroyed over an evil, fascist ideology that is based on a particular interpretation of Islamic theocracy. An ideology that is widespread in the middle east but not generally acted out upon - thankfully.

9/11 was a wake up call to the United States that the people who want to exterminate every man woman and child that adheres to western culture really were getting serious and needed to be dealt with now rather than wait until they managed to obtain even deadlier weapons.  The product of a failed culture that blames those failures not on themselves but on external enemies believes that if they can appease Allah and reintroduce the Caliphate (as a starting point) modeled after the Taliban, that Allah might then strike down the decadent, corrupt, immoral western nations and pave the way for a world of Islamic fascism.

The word fascism, has become a pejorative. A word that is used to insult rather than as a strict definition. I use the term fascism in its true sense -- a form of organization that is led by a single person or small group that is not accountable to the people and promotes an ideology based on the hatred of outsiders, other religions and racism. That is the way of life that these fundamentalist Muslims have in mind for the world.

It is something that must be fought against. It cannot be ignored. While one can debate the effectiveness of the current administration's attempt to fight Islamic Fasicm (Or Islamism), there should be no doubt that it exists, is real, and must either be dealt with now or dealt with later (except at a vastly higher cost).

Those who think that the problem can be ignored need only look at history.  9/11 was merely the most recent and most deadly attack by these extremists.  Since 9/11, the US has improved its intelligence, defense, and covert operations to the point that no new attacks have occurred on US soil since 9/11 (while there have been attacks overseas in places easier to carry out such attacks).

To see the announcement on WinCustomize.com along with the responses to it, click below.

17,155 views 44 replies
Reply #1 Top
Thanks for the artilces.
Reply #2 Top
Well i will start by saying that if your article was more about the loss of life and paying your respects to that then i would have left well enough alone. However considering it is more political in nature I feel it more appropriate to respond in kind with my own point of view.

If nothing else, people, especialy people outside the US, need to understand how big of a deal 9/11 was in the United States.


While this statement is true it almost seems to suggest that "we" dont understand how big a deal it was. This is not true.

The rest of the world is very well aware of the scale of the attack given that all of "us" (Im from New Zealand) have been dealing from the fallout either directly or indirectly since it happened. The flip side to this statement is that I have to wonder just how much the average American understands just how outraged much and in a very many countries, most of the non US population of this world resents the actions of the US in pursuing their attackers.

I for one fail to understand why Iraq was subsequently invaded (using as a justifcation the 9-11 attacks, after the one about WMD that is) when 15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudi? In fact i truely dont understand any of the policies of the American government since the event and especially not in light of their stated aims and claims that it is to make the world safer. If anything from my little perch in the woods it appears to have made things a damn site more volatile and without doubt decidely more expensive.

9/11 was a wake up call to the United States that the people who want to exterminate every man woman and child that adheres to western culture really were getting serious and needed to be dealt with now rather than wait until they managed to obtain even deadlier weapons.


This is a great exaggeration. Im from New Zealand (as stated) and we have no such fears but are definitely Western in culture. In fact one of our citizens and one of your own was recently released from a hostage situation in Iraq primarily because he was a Kiwi. So its not true to include all Western cultures in your grouping. This is very much Cold War thinking and is far too simplistic to be of any use in the modern world. Us vrs Them. With or against. Patriot or Unpatriotic. Right and Wrong. Good vrs Evil. Only children talk in terms such as these. Norway, Denmark, Finland, Switzerland, etc etc I dont see any of those countries being overly concerned about terrorism.

Statements like the one you have made here while highly emotive are ultimately untrue. In making statements such as these people completely fail to look at the underlying causes for such actions. Why do people fly half way around the world to attack the US and Britain. What is it about these two nation states that these people find so abhorrent? Freedom, jealously, i dont think so at all. In looking through some of the history of this site Im sure one of the classic answers to such questions is "who cares, lets just kill 'em back". But surely after 5 years now we can all see just how futile this policy is. All America has really done in 5 years is fuel a recruitment drive for terrorist organisations and spread itself so thin that realistically dealing with Iran is pretty much off the books. Iran thumbs its nose at the US and its threats of intervention re:its nuclear program. The US is not stronger, despite all its rhetoric, its much weaker.

he product of a failed culture that blames those failures not on themselves but on external enemies believes that if ...


How have you come to the conclusion that their culture is failed? 19 hijackers flew planes of destruction. How does that get expanded into a entire culture of failure? When acted upon, its precisely this kind of generalised, dismissive attitude that makes such peoples hate Americans so much.

That is the way of life that these fundamentalist Muslims have in mind for the world.


Your descriptions could just as easily be applied to Christian fundamentalists.

While one can debate the effectiveness of the current administration's attempt to fight Islamic Fasicm


Id suggest this is the biggest debate of the day.


covert operations to the point that no new attacks have occurred on US soil since 9/11 (while there have been attacks overseas in places easier to carry out such attacks).


I doubt whether this would pass any statistical measure of safety. I think it was 8 years between the 1st and 2nd attacks against the World Trade Center wasn't it? The second being much more deadly. Such measures as you've used also completely disregard the opportunity cost the freedoms many of your countrymen seem to feel they have lost, not to mention the discontent and polerisation of your population that has occured because of the implementation of these policies that you would argue make you so much safer.
Reply #3 Top
So far, the responses on linked article seem to be very supportive.
Reply #4 Top
Statements like the one you have made here while highly emotive are ultimately untrue. In making statements such as these people completely fail to look at the underlying causes for such actions. Why do people fly half way around the world to attack the US and Britain. What is it about these two nation states that these people find so abhorrent? Freedom, jealously, i dont think so at all. In looking through some of the history of this site Im sure one of the classic answers to such questions is "who cares, lets just kill 'em back". But surely after 5 years now we can all see just how futile this policy is. All America has really done in 5 years is fuel a recruitment drive for terrorist organisations and spread itself so thin that realistically dealing with Iran is pretty much off the books. Iran thumbs its nose at the US and its threats of intervention re:its nuclear program. The US is not stronger, despite all its rhetoric, its much weaker.


Scoff, This is your view, and you disagree with what the Satates and Britian have done, yet you do not make any suggestions for alternative ways of dealing with the problems.

How do you see the States and Brits protecting themselves, what do you see as a resolution to the problems faced by those countries?

Norway, Denmark, Finland, Switzerland, etc etc I dont see any of those countries being overly concerned about terrorism.



I think you will find they are concerned if you investigated it and really looked into it.

Reply #5 Top
I think you will find they are concerned if you investigated it and really looked into it.


Finland, Norway, Switzerland - not so much. They don't have any sizable Muslim populations and no clear terrorist targets. But Denmark is very definitely a different problem. Their country is very concerned about terrorism, and has been a backer of the War on Terror for quite some time.

There's been no terrorist attack, anywhere, in history that is remotely on the scale of 9/11.


The firebombing of Tokyo, the deathcamps of Burma, the sacking of Baghdad by the Mongols. All of these accounted for a much higher number of deaths in much nastier circumstances and, like 9/11, occurred in the context of civilisational war.

9/11 is special because it was the first medium-large terrorist attack on US soil, not because it was the first big attack ever.
Reply #6 Top
Draginol

I found this to be a well balanced article, it put forward a convincing case.

Scoff has a point though in as much as - do not under estimate how much understanding the rest of the world has of what happened 9/11. They know, they saw, some had losses too, granted nowhere near as many as the states. Largely speaking they stand with the states.

It has to be said, that terrorist will never ever again reach the heights of awesomeness and levels of shock as they achieved with 9/11 again. They could never outdo themselves in this one vile atrocious act. (To use Masons term they jumped the shark). This is not meant as a compliment either, so do not take it offensively.

Please understand I am not praising the act of 9/11 as awesome I am trying to state the success of what they did in that one hit will never again be accomplished, they out did themselves. Whatever they deal out now will only be like little flies that we can swat with a fly swatter in comparison.

The reason they will never be able to do it again or reach such levels of shock is because the world is now prepared for them, to stop them, to bring them down, before they cause more harm.

Today is not the day to start slinging political mud back and forth, today is a day to remember. So all you political animals out there, hold up and respect the day of mourning and tribute please.

Today should be a day of support not criticising (spell) one persons beliefes against anothers.

A British Citizen
Reply #7 Top
9/11 is special because it was the first medium-large terrorist attack on US soil, not because it was the first big attack ever.


Also because of the media footage covering it from the moments of impact. It has had a visual impact of horror for thousands across the globe.

Seeing it with your own eyes from the start to the pile of rubble that resulted makes it bigger, as everyone of us who saw it on telly were in effect witnesses.

Am I making sense in what I am trying to put across, forgive me I am not very good at voicing my opinion?
Reply #8 Top
Am I making sense in what I am trying to put across, forgive me I am not very good at voicing my opinion?


I dunno....seems like you did a good job of it. I will "never" be able to forget that day and the anger I felt. All I wanted to do was hurt someone like they had done to us.
Reply #9 Top
Traditional fascism is also associated with little to no regulation of corporations.
Reply #11 Top
The firebombing of Tokyo


Sorry but this does NOT qualify as a terrorist attck. We were at WAR with Japan. And after Pearl who coould blame us.
Reply #12 Top

The firebombing of Tokyo, the deathcamps of Burma, the sacking of Baghdad by the Mongols. All of these accounted for a much higher number of deaths in much nastier circumstances and, like 9/11, occurred in the context of civilisational war.

9/11 is special because it was the first medium-large terrorist attack on US soil, not because it was the first big attack ever.

That's a real stretch. Comparing a battle of nation states (not civilizations, NATION STATES) to terrorist organizations is not reasonable in my opinion. 

What makes terrorism so insidious is that it is incredibly difficult to define specifically those responsible. When country A attacks country B, it is the country that is accountable. We do not go after the individula soldiers.  Terrorism, by contrast, is far more muddy.

If we were in a traditional war, there would be no question about holding people prisoner in Guantanamo Bay or questions on Military tribunals.

 

Reply #13 Top
If we want a good example of a facist leader we need only to look at Bush and this administration and their violations of the constitution and our freedoms.

I firmly believe our government had some part in 9/11 and used it as a vehicle to further their own radical agendas which wouldn't have been possible without a catastrophic event to move people. Islamic hatred over the US is largely a byproduct of our own flawed policies and actions, and our blinding support of Israeli atrocities. The war on terror is largely overblown, consider that in 30 years in this country 3000 people died to terrorism, yet during the same period, nealy 30,000 children drown in swimming pools. Shall we declare a "War on swimming pools" and devote trillions of dollars to it, and strip the constitution because of it?

Statisically, the war on terror is entirely overblown when given raw statistics, overblown to further an agenda by a few radical hawks intent on a world oil grab.
Reply #14 Top

If we want a good example of a facist leader we need only to look at Bush and this administration and their violations of the constitution and our freedoms.

Wow that's amazing considering nobody has lost any of their freedoms.  Just more useless talking points.

 

I firmly believe our government had some part in 9/11 and used it as a vehicle to further their own radical agendas which wouldn't have been possible without a catastrophic event to move people.

Right......

I can't believe there are people out there who can walk and speak at the same time.

Reply #15 Top
Being complacent is "having a part" in the action, and clearly, even the 9/11 commission established willfull neglect and complacency at the hands of this administration regarding 9/11. Clearly you jumped the gun, and lumped me in with those conspiracy people saying the towers were demolitioned. While I believe there needs to be answers, like why the billions in gold was moved out from the tower basements the night before, why the hard drives found in the rubble showed millions of dollars in transfers 1 minute before the planes hit. Or perhaps why Tower 7, a building designed to withstand anything, fell like a deck of cards 9 hours after the first two towers did. Why haven't the black boxes been uncovered (so says the govt.) while much more sensative things were recovered already?

Clearly, there is overwhelming evidence that a lot of people knew what was coming, and it was just more than some terrorist rabble. Follow the trail of money and it leads right up to the people in power in this country right now. I am surprised that otherwise intelligent people are ignoring some very serious things about this event.

PIRMASENS, Germany (Reuters) - German computer experts are working
round the clock to unlock the truth behind an unexplained surge in
financial transactions made just before two hijacked planes crashed
into New York's World Trade Center on September 11.

Were criminals responsible for the sharp rise in credit card
transactions that moved through some computer systems at the WTC
shortly before the planes hit the twin towers?

Or was it coincidence that unusually large sums of money, perhaps
more than $100,000,000.00+, were rushed through the computers as the
disaster unfolded?

A world leader in retrieving data, German-based firm Convar is trying
to answer those questions and help credit card companies,
telecommunications firms and accountants in New York recover their
records.

Rather mysteriously, as this data was being "Recovered" the company doing the recovery was bought out by Kroll Associates, widely regarded as the private version of the CIA....

GFP would like to inform, that in June 2002, Ontrack/Convar was aquired by Kroll Inc. (Kroll O'gara Eisenhardt), which has strong ties with the US Government.

or what about all of the "Mysterious" stock trading leading up to 9/11 that was done by a company setup by a former CIA Director?

Between September 6 and 7, the Chicago Board Options Exchange saw purchases of 4,744 Put Options on United Airlines, but only 396 Call Options. Although there was no news at that time to justify so much "left-handed" trading, United Airlines stock fell 42 percent, from $30.82 per share to $17.50, when the market reopened after the attacks. Assuming that 4,000 of the options were bought by people with advance knowledge of the imminent attacks, these "insiders" would have profited by almost $5 million.

Sources tell us that a large amount of the United Airlines "Puts" were purchased through Alex. Brown, Inc., a firm managed until 1998 by the current Executive Director of the CIA, A. B. "Buzzy" Krongard. Upon the merger of Alex. Brown with Bankers Trust Corporation in September 1997, Mr. Krongard became Vice Chairman of the Board of Bankers Trust and served in such capacity until joining the CIA. He also served as Chairman of the Securities Industry Association in 1996 and was named the outstanding executive in the financial services industry in 1995 and 1996 by Financial World. (If you say, "So what?" you are not reading the white part of this page.)

On Monday, September 10th, 4,516 Put Options were purchased for American Airlines with only 748 Call Options. No other airlines showed similar trading patterns to those experienced by United and American, the two that were used in the attacks. These two were 600% above the normal day's trades. From 9/6 through 9/10/01, Merrill Lynch, Morgan Stanley, et al. also noticed highly abnormal levels of Put Options on these two airline stocks.



Reply #16 Top
What makes terrorism so insidious is that it is incredibly difficult to define specifically those responsible. When country A attacks country B, it is the country that is accountable. We do not go after the individula soldiers. Terrorism, by contrast, is far more muddy.


To be entirely fair it was the biggest example of the modern idea of terrorism - ie terror conducted by non-state actors. The US made it a war of nation-states though by conflating al Qaeda with Afghanistan and pursuing the war there, which to some extent put 9/11 back in line with the examples I mentioned. The heavy infiltration of the Afghan leadership by al Qaeda also made the question of 'non-state action' a little hazy - how non-state can an attack be if the leaders of the base country are in full support?

Reply #17 Top
@James

I find it appalling to read you're replies (DATED 9/11) and filled with such garbage. There is something very disturbing about it.
Reply #18 Top
Being complacent is "having a part" in the action, and clearly, even the 9/11 commission established willfull neglect and complacency at the hands of this administration regarding 9/11. Clearly you jumped the gun, and lumped me in with those conspiracy people saying the towers were demolitioned. While I believe there needs to be answers, like why the billions in gold was moved out from the tower basements the night before, why the hard drives found in the rubble showed millions of dollars in transfers 1 minute before the planes hit. Or perhaps why Tower 7, a building designed to withstand anything, fell like a deck of cards 9 hours after the first two towers did. Why haven't the black boxes been uncovered (so says the govt.) while much more sensative things were recovered already?


It's okay to wear your tinfoil hat in public James.
Reply #19 Top
I don't blame the people of the US a bit for what happened on 9/11. It is tempting to lay part of the blame on the Clinton administration, but the same complicity and insipid attitude can be seen in the administration of Bush the First.

That said...

What we did and continue to do after will have a DIRECT impact on the next large attack. I think our response thus far has been a miserable failure. You see it continuing today when we hamstring Israel's efforts to flush out terrorist in terrorism complicit Lebanon. We are continuing the garbage war-by-proxy that has handed us defeat after defeat for the last 60 years. Instead of addressing the real foes, the nations that kill people through their terrorist proxies, we seek "diplomatic" solutions.

I have a dismal outlook right now. Bush has shown himself to be half the man he claimed to be and is obviously intimidated by international opinion. The next president will no doubt be a "change" to an even more diplomatic stance. I desperately fear that we have done nothing but show the world that the best way to make a third-rate pile of sand into an "important" country is to become a terrorist state.

I don't see anything wrong with what you've written, and I agree with it. People don't understand, even people like the person above who claims to. It's obvious even in the language they use. I hope I am wrong and they don't all receive the kind of wake up call we did one nation at a time in response to their jaded attitudes of inaccurate moral equivalence...

Reply #20 Top
It's okay to wear your tinfoil hat in public James.


I dont understand why you respond to him like that. Can you refute him point by point? I see alot of this "looney conspiracy theorist" type insult but i rarely see a blow by blow response that actually puts the so called "looney" argument to bed. Surely if its so far left of field it should be a trivial matter to knock him off his so called loopy perch.

I consider myself a fairly rational and down to earth individual and theres nothing in what James has written that is completely "tropo" to me. Surely these kinds of things about which he speaks (which sound alot like claims made in films such as Loose Change 2) should be quite easily and scientifically refuted if they were so far fetched.

Id really like to see a point by point dissection of the claims because to me they seem entirely credible.... especially when the only answer such people (and lets face it...its not just one or two) seem to get is something like that posted by drmiler.

I mean all Ive "actually" seen with respect to 9-11 is 2 planes crash into a couple of skyscrapers. Beyond that everything is just heresy. I did and do find it remarkable that the buildings fell the way they did, it still amazes me that the Pentagon attack has all of 5 or so frames of footage of the attack from a single point of view.... and in none of which do i see a 747. Im sure such things as financial transactions should easily be confirmed. Why are such question so off limits?

There are all kinds of questions. Perhaps the answers are entirely logical and provide support for the official story. If so great. That would be a very good thing. I would like that to be the case. What i dont understand is why so many interested parties get so flustered about what seems to be some very simple enquiry. If the truth is the truth then wouldn't it easily stand up to any and all forms of scrutiny?

If nothing else such claims are interesting.... now why are they incorrect again?



Reply #21 Top
Scoff, very nice first post. The only problem is everyone who replies to you starts their posts with the word "Scoff" as though they're making fun of you.

The word fascism, has become a pejorative. A word that is used to insult rather than as a strict definition. I use the term fascism in its true sense -- a form of organization that is led by a single person or small group that is not accountable to the people and promotes an ideology based on the hatred of outsiders, other religions and racism.

Instead of trying for your own strict definition, I think you should link to the guy who coined the term Islamofascism (h ttp://www.tcsdaily.com/article.aspx?id=081606C ), who's more rigorous about it. He doesn't mention your "led by a single person or small group" criterion, which is good because Islamofascism is not led by a single person or small group. Here's some specifics he gives:

"Fascism was paramilitary; indeed, the Italian and German military elites were reluctant to accept the fascist parties' ideological monopoly. Al-Qaida and Hezbollah are both paramilitary."

"Fascism rested, from the economic perspective, on resentful middle classes, frustrated in their aspirations and anxious about loss of their position. The Italian middle class was insecure in its social status; the German middle class was completely devastated by the defeat of the country in the First World War. Both became irrational with rage at their economic difficulties; this passionate and uncontrolled fury was channeled and exploited by the acolytes of Mussolini and Hitler. Al-Qaida is based in sections of the Saudi, Pakistani, and Egyptian middle classes fearful, in the Saudi case, of losing their unstable hold on prosperity -- in Pakistan and Egypt, they are angry at the many obstacles, in state and society, to their ambitions. The constituency of Hezbollah is similar: the growing Lebanese Shia middle class, which believes itself to be the victim of discrimination."

And so on... however, there are many criteria for fascism that Islamofascism doesn't meet, such as racism, nationalism, glorifying war as an end in itself, embracing the struggle of the youth versus their elders, and having a broad base of popular support:

"Fascism attracted political support from diverse sectors of the population, including big business, farmers and landowners, nationalists, and reactionaries, disaffected World War I veterans, intellectuals such as Gabriele D'Annunzio, Curzio Malaparte, Carl Schmitt and Martin Heidegger to name a few, conservatives and small businessmen, and the poor to whom they promised work and bread. In countries such as Romania and Hungary (and to a lesser extent in other states), Fascism had a strong base of support among the working classes and extremely poor peasants. The broad appeal of support for Fascism makes it different from other totalitarian states." (wikipedia)

All in all, I'm not convinced that "fascism" is any better of a description for the phenomenon than the corresponding left-wing spin, a "global counterinsurgency."
Reply #22 Top
Documentary film maker and radio host Alex Jones, coordinating today\'s 9/11 truth movement events in downtown New York City, says that the atmosphere around ground zero has dramatically changed, with the majority of firefighters and police officers now sympathetic to the claim that 9/11 was an inside job.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPvtIoh9Zxw&eurl=

Alex is featured at the end of the Associated Press video above imploring viewers to understand that 9/11 was \"a self-inflicted wound designed to create a police state in the U.S. and capture us as an engine for world government and world domination.\"

Alex was assigned to lead a protest march today which he described as over 1000 strong as it snaked across ground zero and through lower Manhattan.

Saying that the \"entire atmosphere had changed,\" Alex explained how police support for protesters at ground zero had gone from 20% support two years ago to around 60% support now - with many willing to affirm that sentiment on camera and many knowledgeable about Alex Jones\' work and the 9/11 truth movement.

\"Police just saying \'keep your investigation going, we appreciate you\' on video,\" said Jones.

\"The firemen we\'ve been talking to - a hundred per cent are on our side and have seen the documentary films....it is just incredible what\'s happened at the grass roots.\"

Jones said that the few debunkers who were spewing Bush administration style propaganda were met with distain from the police.

\"I think that thing that triggered it was the fact that the government lied about the dust, the asbestos all of it,\" said Jones in citing why first responders and police have become increasingly skeptical about anything the government says about 9/11.


Reply #23 Top
Scoff, very nice first post.


Whats wrong with the 2nd post? Nothing wrong with a little devils advocate?

The only problem is everyone who replies to you starts their posts with the word "Scoff" as though they're making fun of you.


This might well be true but hopefully the entire nickname suggests that i dont take myself too seriously in these kinds of formats anyway. By all means I invite people to "scoff" away but hopefully once their done they'll be able to answer whatever questions have been put toward them.

Reply #24 Top
Scoff: the first post makes original points drawing from your unique (to us) New Zealand perspective, and uses very clear logic (New Zealand is "western culture," yet the terrorists don't hate them, etc). Even on slashdot that would get a high rating.

Your second post, actually, I didn't like as well, because of what it did to the persuasiveness of your first post. I don't think it's illegitimate to give some consideration to conspiracy theories, but if your audience basically thinks it's unpatriotic even to say 9/11 wasn't the worst thing that ever happened to America, an open mind on this issue lowers your credibility with them.

If you're really interested in the topic you may have already seen this, but I found a lot of evidence for the plane that hit the Pentagon at h ttp://www.abovetopsecret.com/pages/911_pentagon_757_plane_evidence.html (Sorry, this software makes me break all my hyperlinks to post.) But there's nothing wrong with keeping an open mind about it.

"hopefully the entire nickname suggests that i dont take myself too seriously in these kinds of formats anyway."

I'm afraid I do... sorry if I'm boring y'all. I want you to stick around just for those interesting New Zealand touches like calling an idea "tropo." (Is that real slang? I wonder where it came from, maybe global warming discussion is mainstream over there and you hear more talk about the troposphere?)
Reply #25 Top
The only problem is everyone who replies to you starts their posts with the word "Scoff" as though they're making fun of you.


rubbish! it is just a shortened version of his name.

I may not agree with some of the things he says, but that does not mean I am "scoffing" at him.

For me you do not speak! Speak for yourself!

Conspiracy theories:- James

Some of the stuff that James has mentioned - probably does warrant further investigation, some of the things mentioned are downright disturbing and suspicious.

Perhaps the public at large should not reject them as conspiracy outright but look into it before doing so. What harm can it do to investigate it?

It may cost a few bob, but that is about all?

However, will they ever get to the bottom of it? JFK - look at that - it still goes on today, the iffing anf butting and suggesting.