You really don't want to mess with Israel

Now, how many are hoping that Israel does something to the Palestinian PM regardless of whether the Israeli soldier is returned?

I wonder if this one is rational.  It is apparent that this faction does not like the direction that the politicians are taking.  And if they do cut off the head of the snake, then there will never be peace.

Hamas is a terrorist organization, Dr. Guy, and they installed terrorists in their government positions. Our own government espouses the killing of terrorists to prevent further attacks. Sometimes it isn't about whether or not terrorism will end, it is about a job that needs to be done. Hamas officials will not allow themselves to be brought to justice, so, there's not much else you can do.

Eventually, hopefully, the Palestinian people will have a glimmer of wisdom and elect leaders that look to their best interest, instead of organized crime figures who profit from their suffering. Until then, they commit acts that require answer. Peace is not served by ignoring murderers there, any more than it is here when we send them back out onto the streets to kill again.

The difference is, there they have the resources of a small nation to fuel their evil. We've heard the argument before that killing, say bin Laden would just spawn more like him to appear. Should that stop us? We beheaded the leadership of an entire nation after 9/11. It would by hypocritical for us to condemn what Israel is doing after they have lost so many.

Our own government espouses the killing of terrorists to prevent further attacks.

Terrorism as state policy is a dangerous proposition for two reaSONS. oNE A STATE CANNOT GO OUT OF THE BOUNDS OF national and international law. While USA may use its CIA to kill persons it considers terrorists, I doubt seriously whether this is the official policy of the US government. As far as I know the last time USA indulged in assasination as state policy was in Chile when the Adllende government was overthrown.Second, the fight against terrorism has to faught both at the political and military levels and therefore practising state sponsored terrorism only compromises the ability of the state to respond.

Reflect on the whole issue of Al Qaeda. When the Soviets invaded and occupied Afghanistan in December 1979, the USA set up a force to train freedomfighters or mujahudeen as they were called then. Today the very same persons are termed terrorisrts.

" oNE A STATE CANNOT GO OUT OF THE BOUNDS OF national and international law.

A state can most certainly go out of the bounds of international law when those laws prohibitively prevent a state from protecting itself, or unfairly protects people who intend harm on innocent citizens. International law isn't a biblical edict, it is an agreement that can be made and broken.

"While USA may use its CIA to kill persons it considers terrorists, I doubt seriously whether this is the official policy of the US government"

It is stated as official policy by Bush in almost every speech on terrorism when he says we will hunt them down and kill them wherever they are. It is enacted every time we use a drone to kill terrorist leaders across the Pakistani border. I don't know how we could really make it a more obvious policy beyond making it an amendment to the constitution or something.

"Second, the fight against terrorism has to faught both at the political and military levels and therefore practising state sponsored terrorism only compromises the ability of the state to respond."

Terrorism is the killing of 'soft' targets to create terror. Israel is not targeting soft targets, and when they do accidently kill innocents it is because terrorists choose to launch their rockets and construct their bomb factories beside them.

Equating what Israel is doing to 'state sponsered terrorism' is granting Hamas the moral right to keep on killing with no lack of moral justification.

"When the Soviets invaded and occupied Afghanistan in December 1979, the USA set up a force to train freedomfighters or mujahudeen as they were called then. Today the very same persons are termed terrorisrts."

Again, you seem to have a problem with the definition of terrorist. I don't consider people who fight the American military to be terrorists by default as many people do. Terrorists target innocents and commit atrocities in order to create terror and get attention. We trained the fighters in Afghanistan to fight the Soviet military, not fly planes into buildings full of civilians.

The difference between our estimation of them then and now is based upon their actions, not ours.

Diplomacy hasn't found any peace - only more killing.
Gaza was part of Egypt - they don't want it back.
The west bank was part of Jordan & they don't want it back.
Blaming Israel & the US is easier then actually taking responsibility & building a country of their own.
This everything that is wrong is someone elses fault.

#3 by BakerStreet Sat, July 01, 2006 2:24 PM

My concern is that there is someone left to make those decisions. Israel seems determined, in this case, to make sure there is not. That is what I fear.

My concern is that there is someone left to make those decisions. Israel seems determined, in this case, to make sure there is not. That is what I fear.

Then there may be no problem at all, as there may be no need to negotiate a peace or a surrender when there is no enemy left to be fighting against you.

this started when Israel shelled a beach and killed a young girls entire family ...
when the UN sort to investigate they skuttled it ...

mis-direction people ... just misdirection.

It has always pissed off Israel that hamas got into power ... the previous Palestinian
Government could be easily "bought off" ... not so with hamas ...

These plans of assasinating and killing leaders where in planning months ago ...

I believe the Israel soldier is either
1) safe in hiding
2) or at the hands of Israeli sponsored "terrorists" who will kill him at the opportune time
to turn public sentiment and allow re-colonization of the gaza strip


Lets watch and see it unfold ....
WATCH THE BIRDIE ...

what is mossads creed?
"through deception thou shalt do war"

WATCH THE BIRDIE ...

>Again, you seem to have a problem with the definition of terrorist. I don't consider people who
>fight the American military to be terrorists by default as many people do.

Ah so something Bakerstreet and I agree on.

So Bakerstreet ... can I say that you agree with me in my support of Iraqi Rebels in
DOING WHATEVER IS HUMANLY POSSIBLE TO INFLICT MAXIMUM HURT/PAIN/AND SORROW ON INVADING FORCES
be they coalition
or
martian?

>Hamas is a terrorist organization, Dr. Guy, and they installed terrorists in their government
>positions.

Then Hamas is no different from Israeli Leadership

Israeli leaders (from its mandate .. Balfour Agreement) were terrorists ... in the eyes of the
British Empire.

The stern gang, urgun, lehi, hagannah ... were all terrorist groups (NO MATTER HOW YOU DEFINE
IT) ... and employed death and destruction to drive out the arab population.

These groups also produced several Israeli leaders:
Ben Gurion, Begin ... etc

My memory is foggy on this ... but I have libraries on this subject ... with authors who are
Israeli and Non Israeli ... the actions of the above mentioned groups are NOT questioned